"♪" "It was a Hollywood gala in Charm City tonight as Baltimore's politicians, movie stars and counter culture turned out en masse for the world premiere of John Waters' latest film, Hairspray." "It was a very exciting night." "It was a very exciting night." "There was a real charge in the air." "People were liking the movie." "We were so excited about it and thrilled that we had accomplished it." "We thought, this is it." "This is the one that Divine's been working towards." "He was there, he looked wonderful, and he was so proud." "In one sentence, can you sum up this movie experience?" "This is Divine, yeah." "It's great." "It's the greatest night for me in a long time." "It's the greatest night for me in a long time." "I love every minute of it..." "Everybody was really high on it, and they thought this could open doors for John to make movies for Divine." "After all those years of struggling, all those years of working, all the years of horrible reviews and really mean stuff, to finally be accepted... he certainly would've wanted to continue what was just starting." "He was such a gregarious, big, healthy, pink piece of flesh," "He was such a gregarious, big, healthy, pink piece of flesh, you just figured he'd go on forever." "♪" "People like to laugh at sex." "People like to laugh at dirty things and people love to be shocked, I think." "Kill everyone now!" "So that's my job, to get out there and shock them." "Get those cameras rolling!" "Divine was dangerous, part outlaw, part serial killer." " Who wants to die for art?" "!" " I do!" "Divine was a cinematic terrorist." "I didn't get my reputation for nothing, you know!" "I didn't get my reputation for nothing, you know!" "She was just barreling through the scenes, chewing up the scenery, and owning every minute of it." "Why you sneaking, conniving little abortion!" "She was simultaneously sexy and monstrous and terrifying." "Is she gonna screw me or eat me?" "You wanna fuck me?" "He had something that no one else has." "She just had this power." "She was a midnight movie star." "You could only see her after midnight, but it was worth staying up." "People would say, you can't do that." "Well, why not?" "Well, why not?" "Well, fuck you all very much!" "He was such a good soul and such a funny person that even the absurd and horrific things he did are forgiven." "He could get away with them." "How's this for a center spread?" "He was breaking the rules of drag, and defying them by wearing stuff that a fat person would never, ever wear." "He took it to a different level." "He took it to a level of anarchy." "Do not forget " "I... am..." "Divine!" "♪" "I'd always wanted to be a movie star." "John Waters started to make films for our own enjoyment and to keep us out of trouble." "It was just for us, for no one else." "We never thought that anything would ever happen with the movies." "With the movies." "We were the only ones that thought they were funny at the time." "They became quite popular, much to our shock and amazement." "Everything sort of mushroomed and snowballed from there, and here I am today." "In 1977, I caught a double bill of Pink Flamingoes and Female Trouble at Cinema Village, here in New York." "That double bill changed my life." "It was punk, it was raunchy, it was outrageous, it was glamorous, it was exciting." "It was glamorous, it was exciting." "I was vomiting and rolling in the aisles at the same time." "When I was 12 years old" "I went to the Copa in Houston to see him." "And he did not disappoint." "He had the sequin dress and the skin-tight form to his 65 DD breasts, dragging half-naked guys up on the stage and practically masturbating them, like, right there before my 12-year-old eyes." "It was fantastic." "I wanted to know what this was all about." "There was a mystique of the character Divine." "And people wanted to know who really was that real person, Divine." "When he was hiding behind that cloak of Divine, he could be outrageous." "He could be the alter-ego of Glen." "We all have our other sides that we don't show to other people, and sometimes don't even know that we have." "So I think playing the character of Divine, as opposed to the person Divine, is maybe a great release for m." "Oh, and you're still the most beautiful woman in the world." "Oh, and you're still the most beautiful woman in the world." "The commitment to his completely unbelievable characters - nobody is like these people, and yet, 100 percent commitment." "They called you either the trashiest or grubbiest or sleaziest character in film, and you and John Waters were pretty proud of that." "Oh, yeah, the king and queen of filth." "When they see my name or Divine's name when they come to our films, they expect something." "I love everything that's bad with America, and that's what I make movies about." "And that's what I make movies about." "Look at me!" "I'm the most famous person you've ever seen!" "Anything that John asked Divi to do, he would do." "Okay, go ahead, pick it up." "There was a trust that is remarkable when you think of what Divine was asked to do, and what he actually did, and then what John would think up for him to do next." "Divine was the burlesque of John." "It wasn't lovers or anything." "They were like these two entwined pieces of energy." "They were like these two entwined pieces of energy." "We have our love affair through the camera lens, or the movies wouldn't turn out too well." "He put himself in physical danger to do these roles that he had no way of knowing were ever gonna pay off." "We were kids in Baltimore." "Glenny's first name is Harris, but they all called him Glen." "He was a good little baby." "He always had nice manners." "He loved to go to Sunday school." "Glen liked to watched musicals." "He'd play with his cousin, with their dolls and fix their hair." "And he always wanted to be the mother." "He liked pretty things all his life," "He liked pretty things all his life, in his childhood too." "And he would go into his mom's closet and dress up." "When Glen was 10 years old" "I took him to a pediatrician and he told me that Glenny was more feminine than he was masculine." "When Dr. Anderson told me about Glen, I cried." "And Glen, he would say," ""Mom, what did he tell you was so bad?"" ""Mom, what did he tell you was so bad?"" "I said "Glen, no matter what that doctor told me, you'll always be my baby, and I'll always love you."" "I said, "Just remember that."" "No one really can resist a rich, moist cake made with a Betty Crocker cake mix." "Glen loved to eat." "When he got in high school, I took him to a diet doctor." "The doctor gave him pills." "But as soon as we come out of the doctor's office, he said, "Come on, Mom, let's go get a pizza."" "he said, "Come on, Mom, let's go get a pizza."" "He stood out because he was a little chunky." "He didn't like to sweat." "He didn't like to run." "He just wasn't very athletic." "I was an introvert, and I never really went out of the house 'till I was about 16 years old." "I was very uptight about my weight and about the way I looked, and, um, I always wanted to look like everyone else." "Glen didn't have any friends." "After school he would come home, we'd eat dinner, then he'd do his homework." "Then he'd do his homework." "He got beat up every day at school, really got hassled at school." "They used to wait for me every day to beat me up after school, to the point where I was quite black and blue and, uh, afraid to say anything 'cause they had threatened my life." "I really hated school, and I hated the whole situatio." "I dated Divine, whom I knew as Glen," "I dated Divine, whom I knew as Glen, from the year 1959, until maybe 1965." "He would take me to movies and plays and we would go to the Baltimore Symphony." "He cared." "He was very attentive." "He was loving, he watched out for you." "He had a great sense of humor." "His first attempt to kiss me was when he was 16, and it was just a very gentle kiss." "And it was just a very gentle kiss." "It was nothing, you know, animalistic or lusty." "He wanted me to look nice." "He would make sure I had things." "If he wanted me to look a certain way, he would dress me that way." "He would bring me these things, and I would wear them." "He looked forward to the prom." "But he decided he would do the hair and the makeup, and the flowers." "We went to the prom and they were all very envious of us, and that's what he liked." "When I used to go to the beauty shop and get my hair done on Saturday, and get my hair done on Saturday," "Glen used to come in the shop and wait for me." "And while he was there, he'd fool around with the wigs." "I said to Glen, "I'll tell you what " "I'll make a deal with you." "I'll let you go to the beauty school."" "My husband I bought him a beauty shop, so he could learn responsibility." "And the women loved him." "They would go there specifically and ask for Glen." "He would say, "Eat your hearts out, because you know I'm the star around here."" "I was going to the store and this one lady said," ""He does good work, beautiful work, but he's queer."" "And I thought, uh-oh, they were talking about Glen." "Growing up in those times, you just didn't know about people being different in that way." "Homosexuals move in all walks of life." "Except for hairdressing and a few other occupations, their presence is unnoticed." "So it never dawned on me that he was gay or anything." "I liked his creativity." "I liked his creativity." "In Baltimore all the hairdressers were gay men, and I mean, very gay." "It was not like today, where everybody was out and there was a gay scene." "There was, but it was illegal to be gay." "It was kind of more fun then." "It was underground, but that's the charm of Baltimore." "You could get away with a lot." "I lived in Lutherville, Maryland, with my parents and Divine's mother and father moved up the street, six houses away." "Moved up the street, six houses away." "I didn't meet Divine 'till I was probably about 17." "My father used to take us to school." "And I was angry and hating every moment of school, just defiant." "And I would see Divine waiting for the bus, and my father would shudder." "And Divine was dressed in a little preppy outfit just waiting for the bus, but like with that look of, "nelly-ness"." "And Divine wasn't trying to stick out." "He was trying to pass as a normal preppy kid going to school, but no one believed it." "Going to school, but no one believed it." "He could never pass as normal." "We just both were always interested in movies," "Russ Meyer films, especially." "The love for these films, and any sort of film that was out of the ordinary, brought us even closer together." "When Divine finally did go out and went downtown, he met gay people." "And then he went out with a vengeance." "He never came back." "He didn't want to come home at 10:00." "Maybe he had someplace else to go." "Maybe he had found a group that didn't beat him up." "Maybe he had found a group that didn't beat him up and that accepted him." "And maybe he just wanted some friends." "And so then, this big tribe came about." "Kids that grew up in the '60s, that's a very different time." "They were completely rebelling against everything." "We were freaks, we weren't hippies." "Freaks drank, ate meat and did, you know, drugs." "Hallucinogens are mind-altering drugs," "Hallucinogens are mind-altering drugs, and the one you are most likely to run into most often, of course, is marijuana." "He smoked pot." "If you want a good smoke, try one of these." "That's what changed everybody, smoking pot." "And then, you had irony all of a sudden." "And if grass doesn't make it for you, baby, well, you can always drop a cap of acid." "We took LSD in 1964, so we had it early and it was stolen from Shephard Pratt Hospital." "It was Sandoz acid that they treated alcoholics with." "They're damaged for life." "They're damaged for life." "Their brains are wrecked." "They go into institutions." "I would take LSD and say, "Let's see Bergman movies."" "Divine and I were the only people that ever saw Bergman movies on LSD." "Hour of the Wolf, where she pulls her face off..." "That really freaked Divine out." "There were so much drugs, and LSD and poppers and pot, and alcohol, cheap alcohol." "There was a mix of rich kids, poor kids, gay people, straight people, all together on LSD." "Believe me, that's a melting pot." "That's when he started to change." "That's when he started to change." "He would start to tell little lies, and I'd catch him in it." "I was arrested a couple of times for shoplifting." "Were you guilty?" "Uh-huh." "He was just one of the most generous people, not always with his own money." "Like, I'd get this bill for flowers, for like $800, and I'd say, "What was this for?"" ""Oh, we threw a party."" ""How come I wasn't invited?" "I like parties."" ""How come I wasn't invited?" "I like parties."" "He'd do things like a huge, catered party at the Belvedere Hotel for all his friends." "He loved being bigger than life, showing off." "And then he would send the bill to his parents, but rip up the bill so his parents didn't know!" "They never saw the bills." "He'd get the mail every day and just rip up all the bills until his parents' credit cards were cut off." "And he would write bad checks." "And the police busted him and took him home, and he said to his parents," ""I did not do that." Just such a liar, right?" ""I did not do that." Just such a liar, right?" "And they made him take a lie-detector test - and he passed." "That's acting." "David Lochary was a high school dropout who somehow had an English accent, and his hair was dyed blonde with heart-shaped roots and long, which really, at the time, was really radical." "David Lochary was, at the time, an apprentice at the best salon in town." "And David Lochary was Divine's drag mentor," "And David Lochary was Divine's drag mentor, and got him in drag." "Glen invited me to a costume party." "I said, "What are you gonna go as?"" "and he wouldn't tell me." "He came to my house with his costume and his friend David." "I really wasn't fond of David." "I had this feeling he was a little possessive of Divine." "They took over my bedroom, and when he came out he looked just like Elizabeth Taylor." "He wanted to be Elizabeth Taylor." "That's all he cared about." "That's all he cared about." "He smoked Salems because she did." "The dress looked great, the shoes were great." "He was gorgeous." "So we went on to the costume party and that's the first time I ever noticed so many guys dressed like girls." "And he outdid all the other girls there." "We had two separate lives." "Mine was on one side, and the group with John and all the other outsiders was on the other side." "I really didn't lose him until, I'd say the fall of 1964." "I really didn't lose him until, I'd say the fall of 1964." "I didn't see him very much after that, and we just kind of lost track of each other." "The contest in which they were runners-up was a masquerade." "Actually, in the vernacular it's called a drag ball." "David Lochary and Divine, they would go to these drag balls in Washington." "It was a big underground, and they didn't start 'till, like, 12, 1:00 in the morning." "And they didn't start 'till, like, 12, 1:00 in the morning." "And they were over in ratty neighborhoods, and I don't know what kind of basements." "They all would compete with their outfits and makeup, and it was all about makeup." "Drag was pretty." "It was glamorous." "But it was pretty and it was thin." "There was a certain way that a drag queen looked, and what she wore, and that elegance." "Divine, only as Elizabeth Taylor," "Divine, only as Elizabeth Taylor, kind of played it straight, but then immediately he did a twist on it 'cause he was overweight." "Well, yeah, after a while I saw that they were so seriou, it made it ridiculous." "I didn't want to be like them." "I really couldn't get into it like they did." "And I thought I might as well just have fun, you know, 'cause they were so serious about being so competitive." "So he wore clothes that you would never wear when you're overweight." "And that's when he realized the attention was so much more." "I encouraged this heavily because he was making fun of drag." "Because he was making fun of drag." "John was always into movies." "For Christmas when he was 17," "John's grandmother gave him a Browning movie camera." "I was having a surprise birthdy party for a friend of mine, and John had just gotten his first camera then and came over and decided to try it out at the party, and he shot some footage and used it." "The first one he was in was The Roman Candles." "It was just three 8mm movies." "It was random footage, really, taken of my friends." "It was random footage, really, taken of my friends." "And he had the makeup, some kind of scarf tied around his head that David Lochary probably did for him." "He got the name Divine," "I gave it to him for Roman Candles." "He said, "Fine."" "You know, it was not some big thing." "We didn't have a christening or anything." "And he liked it." "He just said that he thought I was Divine, and that should be my name for the film, and so it was, uh, that simple, actually." "It just caught on very quickly, that name." "Whoever the audiences notice the most." "Whoever the audiences notice the most gets bigger parts each time, and Divine, immediately, everybody noticed him." "So then I gave him a much bigger part in Eat Your Makeup, where he played Jackie Kennedy." "It's the first time in cinema that anyone played Jackie Kennedy." "...in one of those pink suits and little pillbox hats, with a dozen roses." "That was fun." "The whole entire outfit was remade to fit a larger girl." "The whole entire outfit was remade to fit a larger girl." "Divine has to climb over the back of the car during the assassination, and they did that before anybody else did." "When was he shot?" "'63?" "It was '65 and it was not v." "People really didn't think it was funny." "When I was a kid I always wanted to be a movie star, but I thought as I got older, who's got a chance?" "I lived in Baltimore, Maryland." "He wanted to be a movie star and joked about it but he never really thought he could be." "But he never really thought he could be." "But I talked to him - yes, you can - pretty early." "Mondo Trasho is when I first got him under my control." "He was the leading lady." "The look hadn't been quite that developed." "It was more like a trashy girl with a lot of makeup on, trashing around town." "Oh, man, I only ask you for what is rightfully mine, what the good Lord has bestowed on me - what the good Lord has bestowed on me - being divine!" "These are very raw movies, but already you can tell that Divine has a certain something." "Even though we had made this feature Mondo Trasho, which got some national attention," "Multiple Maniacs, I think, was when it became realer, because there was dialogue." "You must be Lady Divine." "I heard so much about you." "Oh, boys, please remove this little slut from my presence immediately!" "I knew that Divine had this anger that he hadn't really tapped into yet." "That he hadn't really tapped into yet." "What did you say?" "I said you're sick and repulsive." "You my dear, are dead." "And that's how Divine got born." "This character that I thought up for Divine, used that anger that he had from all his high school traumas." "John went to the movies all the time, and his obsessions in movies were things like bigger-than-life women, like Jayne Mansfield." "Man, oh man, oh, Mansfield!" "Jayne Mansfield that is!" "Man, oh man, oh, Mansfield!" "Jayne Mansfield that is!" "She was almost like a cartoon, and the thought of putting a man in a dress and doing that was even more rebellious." "And he knew that Divine could pull it off." "John wanted a very large woman because he wanted the exact opposite of what normally would be beautiful." "He wanted a 300-pound beauty as opposed to a 110-pound beauty." "That's what he got." "The most beautiful woman in the world turns out to be a ma." "At the end Divine goes crazy and she murders everybody." "At the end Divine goes crazy and she murders everybody." "And Divine gets raped by a lobster." "I used to always say to Glen," ""Don't ever do anything to embarrass us."" "He promised he would never do anything to ruin our reputation." "When they saw me and I had no eyebrows and my hair shaved back, they just completely freaked out." "They just completely freaked out." "That's the day that, um, I told them everything." "I told them I was gay." "I told them I smoked dope, that I had tripped." "I just got it all off because I couldn't live two separate lives, and they just did not understand." "And I said, "So just keep on going and forget you have a mother and father."" "I remember saying that, and I felt so bad after I said it." "It was a horrible, horrible experience." "It was the last time I saw the." "The Cockettes were a bearded, transvestite theater group that believed the revolution was coming." "It was the only drag queens I ever knew that read Lenin." "It was men, women, lesbians, drag queens, babies, everything all together." "It was just, kind of a free-for-all." "And they did Busby Berkeley shows, and the entire audience was on LSD, so it was quite a scene." "In San Francisco, Sebastian had the Nocturnal Dream Show." "In San Francisco, Sebastian had the Nocturnal Dream Show which we called the midnight movies at the Palace Theater every weekend." "And he scoured the planet for the freakiest movies he could find." "John Waters knew this was a perfect place for him to screen his films." "We ought to just pick them up and shoot them." "Sebastian helped our career more than anybody, because he booked Mondo Trasho and Multiple Maniacs as midnight shows." "He opened the film Mondo Trasho and he showed it on a double bill with The Diane Linkletter Story." "I am what I am, and I'm doing my own thing in my own time." "I am what I am, and I'm doing my own thing in my own time." "We felt that Divine and John were complete soul mates." "And we begged Sebastian, go get Divine, bring her out here." "We've got to meet these people." "They've got to be part of the show." "Divine got on the airplane with not one penny in his pocket." "Van Smith came with him too, who did him up." "And I said, "Do something weird with his hairline."" "That's all I said." "Van said, "Go to the bathroom, shave your head halfway back," "Van said, "Go to the bathroom, shave your head halfway back, and pluck all of your eyebrows out."" "And I did not question him." "That was the deal, when he shaved it back and then continued, and made that part of this." "Right before I got off the plane I heard," ""Divine, Divine!" "We want Divine!"" "And Van said, "You hear that?"" "He got on the plane as Glen, and got off as Divine." "I got off and the people rushed me," "I got off and the people rushed me, and flashbulbs were going off." "And it was just like all those stories." "I read about Marilyn Monroe and all these things." "It was so perfect." "He never really took it seriously 'till he came to California and he saw fans, and then in his mind he never, ever went back to being Glen Milstead." "And he realized it could be true and he could have a career doing this, and he could live his life as Divine." "Divine came to San Francisco and did a stage show before Mondo Trasho." "And did a stage show before Mondo Trasho." "Imagine my amazement when I stepped off my jet to be mobbed by crazed Cockettes, embracing me, comforting me after my ordeal." "Now I am ready to tell my stor." "I have chosen the Palace Theatr as the place where I can find friends who will understand what I have been through." "I would come on stage dressed like a hippie pimp, and then say, "And now I'd like to introduce the most beautiful woman in the world!"" "And he would come out, pushing a shopping cart with dead mackerels in it that he'd throw in the audience." "With dead mackerels in it that he'd throw in the audience." "And then he would give this long speech that I would write for him." "The first thing she says was," ""I give blow jobs to serial killers."" "But then she said, "I eat white sugar."" "And there was a shudder through the whole audience." "The fact that she ate white sugar was to us, just completely shocking." "It was very confrontational in that way, but everybody loved it." "But everybody loved it." "To this day I don't understand why I walk out on the stage and abuse people with words." ""Fuck you!" And people love to hear it." "Divine was just a ball of energy on stage." "People just ate it up." "She decided to live in San Francisco." "Divine came to perform with us." "There was no question about it." "We wanted Divine, and Divine wanted to be with us." "In one of the shows she was in the jungle," "In one of the shows she was in the jungle, and she had all these guys in loin cloths standing around, and she was groping them to see who she was gonna put into the pot, and boil for dinner." "And then she did Divine Saves the World." "That's where she seduces Fidel Castro, hijacks a plane, she saves the world and she gets peace in the Middle East." "Who could ask for more than this?" "When we did Journey to the Center of Uranus, she came on in an electric red crab dress with padded pinchers and a six-foot tail." "And she came on stage and she sang," "And she came on stage and she sang," "A crab on Uranus Means You're loved." "One was a Halloween show which was called Vice Palace, and it's loosely based on Mask of Red Death." "And Divine played Divina." "♪ Who's the one we all know ♪" "♪ Always puts on the best show ♪" "♪ It's Divina... ♪" "She would to the Odd Beam, and different clubs and she'd dance." "She loved to dance." "♪" "She loved her Quaaludes, too." "I'm sure it loosened her up for her to have fun." "She was kind of shy." "I know it sounds bizarre that Divine was shy, but she was kind of shy." "She was so different from the character that she played on stage." "It was as though it was two different people." "When she was Glen, no one really knew it was Divine." "When she was Glen, no one really knew it was Divine because she wore no makeup, no wig, or nothing." "She just looked like an overweight queen." "David Baker Jr." "Was an actor from New York." "David was Divine's leading man in Vice Palace." "Divine was very, uh, timid still, in those days, when it came to his sexuality, but David wasn't." "There was definitely a relationship there." "Divine would tell you." "Divine would tell you about someone that she was in love with, and then when it didn't end well," "Divine would come over and there would be a lot of weeping." "When you were with Divine it was a grand moment of excess and you would plunge in." "He completely never wanted to leave San Francisco." "Of course he did fly back to Baltimore to film Pink Flamingos." "People say, how did you ever make a movie on $10,000?" "People say, how did you ever make a movie on $10,000?" "For us that was a huge budget." "The fact that we had color and sound, and we had locations." "It was a bigger production." "It was a bigger deal." "Babs Johnson?" "Yes, I'm Babs Johnson." "Divine was Babs Johnson, who was retired, living on her mantle of filth." "How could anyone be filthier than Divine?" "And it was a battle about who could be the filthiest person alive." "You know who I am, bitch!" "I'm the filthiest person alive!" "That's who I am!" "I have a makeup man, Van," "I have a makeup man, Van, and he is totally responsible for..." "He is my face." "Van Smith was kind of a genius." "He is the guy who developed the look of Divine." "Van always said that he shaved his hair back like that so there'd be more room for eye makeup." "There wasn't enough room on the human face for the amount of eye makeup that Van wanted him to wear." "I'm all dressed up and ready to fall in love." "John's very involved with the costuming in his movies." "John's very involved with the costuming in his movies." "They're very important to him." "They are part of the role." "She becomes part of the costume at times." "I can't look in that lens." "Okay, start the whole thing over." "That movie was hell to make." "We would shoot in the middle of nowhere." "It was freezing cold." "20-hour days and none of the film would turn out." "Divine had on these skimpy outfits, and you could see his breath and his goose flesh." "They would do pages of dialogue that they had to memorize." "They would do pages of dialogue that they had to memorize." "You see, gentlemen of the press, oh..." "I think a lot of people were taking speed." "I can't remember." "I think the person who suffered most, was probably Edith." "Hi, everybody." "My name is Edith Massey." "We hung out at this Greek bar called Pete's Hotel." "This is Edith, from down Pete's." "And this is where Edie was a barmaid." "And I remember calling John Waters and saying," ""John, you've got to get down here." "You will not believe it."" "John realized the potential of Edith." "John realized the potential of Edith." "The minute she showed up as the egg lady, the audience was obsessed with her." "Why isn't the egg man here?" "I'm starving to death for some eggs." "But Edith was difficult to carry on a conversation with." "She was kind of on a different planet." "Oh, the egg man, the egg man!" "Divine was frustrated with Edith because she didn't know her lines." "But" " But is it true, Babs?" "Divine was a true professional and could do this stuff." "When we were making Pink Flamingos, we couldn't mix with the real world." "We couldn't mix with the real world." "We just were in this vacuum of what Pink Flamingos was, because of how he had to look." "He could never get the stain off his lips, and there was no eyebrows." "And his head shaved back like that, people were like," ""What the hell is that?" "!"" "The shot that John did just in a car of Divine in full drag, walking cold down the street was utter genius." "The looks on the people's faces is exactly how everybody." "The looks on the people's faces is exactly how everybody reacted to Divine in real life." "People just didn't believe it." "These men across the street were screaming all kinds of things at me." "The whole city was just filled with laughter and screaming." "People were going absolutely out of their minds." "They didn't know what I was." "My favorite scene is the scene with the birthday gift." "Oh, my God almighty, someone has sent me a bowel movement!" "It's Divine's turd, actual turd, 'cause he shit in the box the night before." "It really did stink." "It really did stink and it did enhance everyone's performances." "This is a direct attack on my divinity!" "Well, the whole end of the movie," "I mean, was the whole reason that the movie exists." "You think you know somebody filthier?" "Watch." "It was one shock after another and how are you gonna top that?" "I thought what can we do that isn't against the law yet?" "Something that will really freak people out, as a publicity stunt, as a joke." "And the topper was, of course, for Divine to eat dog shit." "And the topper was, of course, for Divine to eat dog shit." "John came to me and he said, "You know, would you do this?"" "And I said, "Oh, sure."" "Well, I thought he was kidding." "A year later he said, "Okay, now tomorrow you have to eat the dog turd."" "I thought, oh, this is great, he wasn't kidding." "He said, "Well listen, do you want to be famous?"" "Had anybody ever done it?" "Would he get some attention?" "John had enough of PT Barnum in him to know that." "No matter what they said, they were gonna say something." "I thought, well what do I care?" "You know, I was very young." "Pick it up and eat it, and crouch down." "Pick it up and eat it, and crouch down." "And you don't think about all these things." "And I didn't really think about it until." "I had to follow that dog around for three hours." "We tried to get that dog to poop all day." "They kept it inside and fed it for a couple days, so it would do it." "It wouldn't." "So they took it inside and they gave it an enema." "What if he doesn't shit right here?" "Well, wherever he does, crouch down on that side of him, facing here." "And it came out and he finally did it, but not like a proper turd." "What you are about to see is a real thing." "What you are about to see is a real thing." "Divine said, "That?" And I said, "Just do it, yes."" "And Divine actually went over there, picked up the dog shit, put it in her mouth." "Cut!" "And I didn't make him do it twice." "You know, I'm not a sadist." "Divine ate a dog turd." "And I don't think anybody in the history of cinema is ever going to top that feat." "The first time I saw it with an audience, I knew it worked." "I saw people leaving that theater, like, ugh!" "I saw people leaving that theater, like, ugh!" "It was, uh, really the grossest film I've seen." "Brother, it took off." "There was a line around the corner for five years." "There had been a lot of press that was all about the shit, of course." "That seemed to be the main emphasis." "And people loved being outraged." "First time I've been to it." "It's an incredible head scene for people." "She ate dog shit." "They were able to market the movie " ""Do you know this queen eats dog shit?"" "Everyone sat in the seats waiting for that scene, which doesn't come 'till the end." "Which doesn't come 'till the end." "It was done for anarchy, and it worked as anarchy." "The word-of-mouth spread, and then it spread all over the country." "As my father later said, "Yeah, like cancer."" "Oh, it's marvelous, actually." "The most disgusting thing I've ever seen in my whole lif." "Even if you hated it, you had to talk about it." "It was divine, fabulous." "Everybody knew that movie." "I worked the movie theater, and I had to clean up the vomit." "John used to say, "If someone puked, it was like a standing ovation."" "And I used to have to call him up and say," ""You know, I got about three standing ovations last night, and I hate you."" "and I hate you."" "Seeing Divine on the screen, he was so amazing, 'cause he was like a creation." "You stand convicted of asshole-ism!" "He was scary." "It was like Clarabelle on acid." "Does blood turn you on?" "It does more than turn me on..." "It makes me come." "John and Divine became a phenomenon." "♪" "And then Divine did become a real, real star." "And then Divine did become a real, real star." "He was being known in the underground." "He was being known in the chic parts of the cities, that here is somebody that you should get to know." "He's an underground star." "When Andy Warhol met Divine, history was made." "How we met Warhol was after Pink Flamingos came out, we went to the Factory and I took Divine." "Andy came out and went," ""Oh..." "Divine..." "I really wanted to meet you,."" ""Oh..." "Divine..." "I really wanted to meet you,"" "and then he walked away." "Andy liked people that were colorful." "Divine was truly colorful." "Action!" "Get off me, you ugly witch!" "You devil!" "Come here, you'll pay for this!" " Yeah?" " Yeah, you'll pay for this!" "Okay, so hold it right where it is." "Female Trouble was a little bit different than Pink Flamingos, but it had the same punky, angry allure to it." "But it had the same punky, angry allure to it." "Female Trouble is John's Gone With the Wind." "It's so disgusting and..." "hilarious." "It was written to be a Divine vehicle." "He plays Dawn Davenport." "Dawn Davenport," "I'm a thief and a shit-kicker, and, uh, I'd like to be famous." "I loved playing Dawn Davenport." "She was very much like me as I was growing up." "I wasn't quite as bad as she was," "I wasn't quite as bad as she was, but she was very much like me and then blown out of proportion a bit." "Divine is really funny in the movie." "I think it's my favorite performance of Divine." "I'm going to go sink into a long, hot, beauty bath now and try to erase the stink of a five-year marriage." "Van should've gotten the Academy Award for the costumes." "They were brilliant." "There is the early Dawn, which is the hair-hopper Dawn." "There is pregnant Dawn." "There is pregnant Dawn." "There is the early criminal Dawn." "And there's the lipstick salon Dawn." "This is our new customer, Miss Dawn Davenport." "Then there's nightclub Dawn." "And then of course you go straight to electric chair Dawn." "Without all of you, my career could never have gotten this far." "It definitely was a pre-Punk movie." "You saw all those looks on people years later." "You saw all those looks on people years later." "And I'm so fucking beautiful I can't stand it myself!" "The role of Dawn Davenport was a very physical part." "He swam across a river in November in full drag, and hit his mark on the other side." "The trampoline act at the end where she has a Mohawk, an acid-burned face, and she's rubbing dead fish on her crotch in a baby crib." "Watching him go up and down." "Watching him go up and down with that insane look on his face is so exciting." "He was absolutely out of his mind." "In New York, Female Trouble was a smash." "It was sold out." "And then he moved to New York." "New York in the 1970s was a time of tremendous energy, a lot of queer art, a lot of off-off Broadway, counter cultural arts, a lot of off-off Broadway, counter cultural arts, underground." "Divine started having these other opportunities, and he took them." "Women Behind Bars was a hilarious play by Tom Eyen." "It was a parody of all those women in prison films where they throw some young innocent into jail, and she's eaten alive by these other hardened women." "When people try and hide things from me, I get crazy!" "Divine played the matron, a very cruel, sadistic woman, who had her way with the youngest who came in." "Who had her way with the youngest who came in." "I was raped by Divine eight times a week for a year." "Divine was in a really tight, white polyester nurse's outfit, gigantic boobs." "In those prostitute heels without the back - you know the kind." "I had seen him in Pink Flamingos, and I was a little afraid about working with him." "Because everybody said," ""Oh, you've got to be careful with Divine." "You're gonna have problems with him."" "But when I met him at the first reading," "But when I met him at the first reading, he was so nice and so professional." "I said, "My God, this is a nice man."" "There was something marvelous about him, beyond being the campy drag queen." "He was very funny, but he was also believable." "There is the Truck and Warehouse Theater, and is currently playing Tom Eyen's Women Behind Bars." "It was a hot show." "It was the place to be, Truck and Warehouse Theater, you go see Divine." "You go see Divine." "It was an event for Divine to come to New York in the legit stage, and it had the feeling of an event." "It had the feeling of electricity in the air." "We were in love." "There were lots of celebrities..." "Diane Keaton." "One night Warren Beatty was in the audience." "David Bowie." "You know Nureyev, the ballet dancer." "Elton John came..." "And they became really good friends, and he asked Divine to be in his show at Madison Square Garden." "And he asked Divine to be in his show at Madison Square Garden." "It was first class, and there were limousines everywhere." "It was just the way I've always wanted to live, and then all of the sudden you're living like that, and it's unbelievable." "In a sense there was the leaving small-town Baltimore behind." "He was embracing his new life, as well he should." "I was always for it," "I was always for it, because I couldn't make a movie every year." "I couldn't get it together." "I couldn't get the money to make it, so I hoped Divine found a way to get other work." "I thought it was great, because I knew how talented he was, and how much he needed to spread." "He was ready to stretch a little bit, and not just be a John Waters star." "I know now that I can be successful - not without John, because I started with John, not without John, because I started with John, and I owe John quite a bit." "He gave me my beginning in the whole business, and sometimes I thank him, and sometimes I hate him for i." "But, uh, mostly I love him and thank him for it." "I don't like the work that's involved in making a movie." "I enjoy it when it's happening, but all the preparation and the delays are no fun." "But once it's finished it's all gravy from there, sort of." "I love it once it's done." "I love it once it's done." "David was, to say a difficult person, he probably had had a fight with every single person in Dreamland, except for me." "At the end of his life he was smoking a lot of angel dust." "One night Divine threw a party at his house." "The whole cast was there, and we were each provided with a... like a joint, only it was angel dust." "That night he smashed a mirror and he cut himself with mirrors," "That night he smashed a mirror and he cut himself with mirrors, and he didn't feel it, because of the angel dust." "Dearest Lisa;" "David Lochary is dead." "I still can't believe it, my oldest friend." "It's so strange." "This has been a week to forget." "Love you and miss you." "Always, Divine." "In the late '60s, a Baltimore filmmaker by the name of John Waters began jolting the industry with a series of shockingly explicit underground films." "He, in effect, created and molded the queen of the underground in the character of a 300-pound female impersonator, whom he named Divine." "Well, it's been over 10 years, and the phenomenal popularity of this character is stronger than ever." "I moved to New York in the summer of '78 and one of the things I did was to see Divine live, and one of the things I did was to see Divine live, off Broadway in a play called The Neon Woman." "I'm Miss Flash Storm, the Neon Woman, the original flasher, the last of the pink hot strippers!" "Divine played Flash Storm, the owner of the strip joint." "He played the role of this tough stripper." "You were a common whore in San Francisco." "Who isn't in San Francisco?" "And I was his twin sister." "And I remember saying to him," "And I remember saying to him," ""You're nothing, trash, you've got nothing, and you always will be nothing!"" "Every night, at the beginning of the show he would entertain the audience." "Oh, my God, her entrance." "She would walk into the theater in this white, tight dress and she had to walk in from the back of the theater to the front." "And her first line was, "Ha, girls!"" ""I'm the Neon Woman, and the Neon Woman is..." "Divine!"" "Divine!"" "The great thing about it was we did it in a disco." "Hoorah was the hottest place in New York, right before Studio 54." "And this event was so 1978, we sat on the floor to watch the show." "And when the show was over, we all jumped up, and it turned into a disco." "In New York his stock rose enormously because Divine was a huge, social figure in that whole disco era." "In that whole disco era." "We've just seen Tom Eyen's the Neon Woman, starring Divin." "We'll pause for a commercial, and be right back with the Village People singing Just a Gigolo." "Don't go away." "There was nobody that Divine didn't want to meet." "And especially if they had any kind of name, he wanted to meet them." "And guess what - he did." "We went to Studio 54, opening night." "They invited us 'cause, of course, our show was the hottest thing in town, and it was thrilling." "And it was thrilling." "Studio 54 - that was the ultimate disco, and Divine would be there." "I thought, there are people that would cut their arms off to be in that position." "I had a real good time." "He really got to enjoy things that come with celebrity." "We were having more money coming in, so he was able to buy himself a fur coat, and he had a diamond earring that was huge." "He was so happy when he got that earring." "I was the West Coast Editor of Interview Magazine." "I was the West Coast Editor of Interview Magazine." "They had a showing of Pink Flamingos in Beverly Hills, and we had a big party for Divine." "And before we knew it, Divine was staying at our house." "He met the cream of LA." "He met artists, he met actors, he met writers." "Quinton Crisp used to come over." "David Hockney would come over when he was in town." "David also did that beautiful," "David also did that beautiful, almost life-sized painting of Divine." "I never saw him exercise." "All he did was eat, and lay around, lay around the pool." "He loved the pool." "In the dark of night, he used to have all of his visitors meet him at the pool." "And they'd sit at the pool 'till all hours of the morning." "God knows what was going on back there." "Do I do drugs?" "Well, I love grass." "Divine liked marijuana a lot, really a lot." "Divine liked marijuana a lot, really a lot." "He's the kind of person that smoked pot from the time he got up to the time he would go to sleep, except for, like, when he had to work." "He wasn't loaded when he was making movies." "Divine was stoned his entire life." "He really was a pot head, more than you can ever imagine." "That was his drug of choice and his only vice." "And then that led to the vice of a big fat cupcake." "He would call me up every day and he'd say," "He would call me up every day and he'd say," ""Please come over." "I have an ounce of pot - and could you bring donuts?"" "So I'd always bring two dozen donuts because he would have to have a dozen donuts, and maybe I could have a few if I got another dozen." "Before dinner he would break into a big bag of chips, and drink a quart of Diet Pepsi." "That was his appetizer." "He would pull a chair up to the refrigerator, and eat out of the refrigerator." "She loved cake." "She'd have her slice, my slice, and then everybody else's slice." "I asked him once, "Why do you eat so much?"" "He said, "I'm afraid if I don't eat it, somebody else will."" "Basically he woke up and wanted to eat every single thing, food, that was in the entire nation before anybody else had it." "I'm very lazy and, um, and lazy with myself." "You talk about diets and thing, I talk about them, you know, but it's very hard to actually get started on one." "But it's very hard to actually get started on one." "I was actually on one and did well, but then I just dropped off one day and started eating and never stopped again." "I think food filled a void with him." "He was very vulnerable." "People didn't see that because he covered, you know, a lot." "But when you got to know him, he was very sensitive." "People were afraid of him." "People that knew him from the movies, had a completely fixated idea of who Divine was." "Had a completely fixated idea of who Divine was." "They said, "Let's go to dinner tonight."" "I said, "You can have dinner with me, but I'm having dinner with Divine."" ""Is he gonna shit on the table?" "I said, "I don't think so."" "Although gay men love drag performers on stage, they don't necessarily love them in bed." "So that's what I had wondered about Divine - if he was able to find romantic or sexual partners amongst gay men who might look down on him for being a drag performer, at the same time deifying him," "for being a drag performer." "Divine actually had plenty of loving in his life." "Divine actually had plenty of loving in his life." "He was a very sexual person, very sexual." "He was outlandish and if he was interested in somebody he'd go for it, and he'd usually get it." "He had one in every port." "Believe me, he didn't have any trouble." "He didn't mind being turned down." "If you look like that - so bizarre - you've got to expect some people are gonna reject you." "I think Divine was, like, ask ten and one will say yeah." "And he asked good ones." "He had cute boyfriends." "And he asked good ones." "He had cute boyfriends." "Lee L'Ecuyer and Divine had a very, very long, long relationship." "It wasn't like your normal, long-term, live-together relationship." "They were absolutely together whenever they were in the same place." "Isn't that adorable?" "Couldn't you vomit?" "I introduced him to a guy that was a porn star." "Leo was a great guy." "And they actually had a very charming, romantic relationship for quite a while." "I loved seeing it for Divine." "I loved seeing it for Divine." "I loved seeing him happy and with someone that was genuinely interested in him." "Because I had been the cliché story of being typecast- and I certainly was " "John and I decided it was time to do an image change." "Polyester was sort of." "Leave it to Beaver goes berserk." "Everything bad that could happen to a suburban family." "Please leave us alone!" "My family hasn't done anything to you!" "John wanted to show Divine's range, and also wanted to tell a different type of story." "What the hell are you doing?" "Saying my prayers, Elmer, asking God to forgive you for showing dirty movies." "He'd already done Divine as monster." "He wanted to show her as a sympathetic heroine." "I cannot take another heartbreak!" "I just cannot take it!" "She was fat and she drank and, you know, the whole house was just dysfunctional." "I remember Van showed Divine her costumes and she burst into tears, 'cause they weren't glamorous." "Lulu, I'm trying to clean in here!" "Not only was it a spoof of old Hollywood, you had old Hollywood playing opposite Divine." "At the time John Waters called me to do Polyester," "I was out doing dinner theater, and I was in Indianapolis when I got a phone call from John Waters." "He just mentioned that he was doing a film with Divine." "He just mentioned that he was doing a film with Divine and would like me to play a character called Todd Tomorrow." "It's Todd, honey." "Todd?" "Todd Tomorrow." "And then he said, "Oh, by the way... how would you feel about kissing a 300-pound transvestite?"" "And I said," ""I've got nothing to lose, everything to gain." "Why not?"" "He doesn't look old enough to drink." "I'm old enough to do anything." "Tab Hunter, I mean, he was a '50s teenage icon." "And to have him with Divine, it was too good to be true." "Divine had a crush on Tab Hunter since he was a little boy." "How do you shave, Tab?" "With the Gillette Super Speed, of course." "Oh, Divine was so thrilled." "A famous heartthrob like Tab Hunter, and she was gonna get to kiss him." "I could only afford to have Tab for a week, so we shot the whole movie, except him." "First night was Cuddles' debutante party, so Divine knew he had to dance with Tab Hunter." "He was a nervous wreck, and Divine didn't get nervous easily." "And Divine didn't get nervous easily." "He was genuinely excited to be working with me." "I don't know why." "I was very excited to be working with him, because I respected him." "Divine was really nervous." "You know, they had to, like, kiss." "But he did it beautifully." "I remember Tab lifted his face, so he got in the light right." "Read my lips." "I love you." "Tab never made fun of Divine in that movie." "That's why it worked, because he treated Divine as if she were Natalie Wood, some huge movie star some huge movie star that he would've done a real love scene with without ever winking at the camera," "and doing it like he believed it." "It was great." "Really a good experience for both of them." "Divine got really good reviews for the first time ever, really respectful reviews - New York Times and everywhere." "And finally someone said, "I think this person can act."" "Before it was just always this fat transvestite with the big candy floss wig that couldn't see beyond the paint and the exterior to what was behind me." "I've always been a great actor." "I've always been a great actor." "We're a real family again, a normal American family." "Believe me, Divine was not an overnight success." "This was a long act that kept building, but there were long periods in between where, what do you do, and how do you get work?" "I know why people have breakdowns and things in showbiz now." "I just sat around for six weeks with no work, and you go crazy." "We were always either right on the edge," "We were always either right on the edge, or on tons of money." "Everybody, once they get to a certain point, you've got to have an agent and/or manager." "Divine absolutely needed that direction and needed someone to negotiate for her." "Bernard Jay was the producer of Neon Woman in San Francisco." "From producing that, it segued into becoming Divine's business manager." "He really took over Divine's career." "Bernard was good for Divine's career." "He got him in that whole music thing." "He got him in that whole music thing." "I always just thought of Divine as a rock star." "He was such a part of the Punk scene." "♪" "Divine had a couple of records before I got involved with him." "I felt that those songs were okay, but they weren't really going to make a career as a record performer." "I can't call him a singer." "And we discussed my concept," "And we discussed my concept, which was to write specifically for the character Divine." "♪" "Native Love was recorded first, and he performed the song and it was just magic." "It was released first in the United States, and then in Europe, Native Love exploded." "That started the whole recording career." "♪ My car is by Ferrari And my body's Jack LaLanne ♪" "♪ My clothes are by Armani And my hair is by Elaine ♪" "♪ Tiffany and Cartier Are telling me the time ♪" "♪ This native love is restless And I'm just not satisfied ♪" "♪ This native love is restless And I'm just not satisfied ♪" "We all need a couple careers, and I think it was a good part of Divine's life." "And he had great success." "He did techno music before anybody." "♪ You think you're a man But you're only a boy ♪" "♪ You think you're a man ♪" "♪ You are only a toy ♪" "♪ You think you're a man ♪" "♪ But you just couldn't see ♪" "♪ You weren't man enough ♪" "♪ To satisfy me ♪" "It was great, that gay bathhouse disco is fabulous." "She's not the best signer in the world, but she owned every lyric." "But she owned every lyric." "She could get where she needed to go, and she evoked a sense of power and punk aggression." "He was great because he was just being Divine, and what else are you gonna want when you're listening to a Divine song than as much Divine as you can get?" "These songs helped make him one of the most in-demand, disco performers through that era." "Disco performers through that era." "San Francisco, New York, LA had to have Divine." "He was so larger than life in these outlandish costumes by Van, he really had a great presence on the stage." "The costumes, the makeup, the hair;" "It was a walking work of art." "Please welcome the biggest movie star in the world..." "Every sense in your body was, like, on edge because you just didn't know what was gonna happen next." "Because you just didn't know what was gonna happen next." "You make my nips get hard." "He performed at Studio One, but you couldn't get in." "It was a huge deal." "It was as if Elvis was playing." "I saw him at the Saint, in New York, and all of a sudden, like, the ceiling opens up, and there's Divine, so over the top and so fabulous." "He had a brilliantly caustic way of handling the audience." "Mother?" "I'm not your mother." "I wouldn't want to be;" "Look at him." "I wouldn't want to be;" "Look at him." "And if there wasn't trouble, he'd kind of invent some." "Some girl over here has the worst-smelling cunt." "I've ever smelled in my life." "And somebody here has the cheesiest dick." "I've ever smelled." "The two of them should get together and make a Denver omelet." "She was kind of like this huge Don Rickles insult comic." "Oh, suck my fat ass!" "As part of the show people knew it was okay to heckle her and she would heckle them back." "Let's eat your pussy, eat your pussy, eat your pussy!" "Let's see your big dick!" "He had a great following." "By the way he looked and the way he talked, it kind of made it okay for them to be who they were." "Mobs of boys would come out of nowhere." "They would just, like, squeal at Divine." "They thought Divine was God." "People literally did throw themselves at him." "God damn her." "She had like an 18-year-old boy worshipping her body..." "Why her and not me?" "Why her and not me?" "He would go on these tours, and he literally did go all over the world with those." "And he'd get paid pretty well for a show every night." "They were grueling." "He did a disco show every single night." "Divine was playing in Paris, at Body Rock." "All the French kids were going insane." "And it was Divine." "It was really thrilling." "Divine was on Top of the Pops." "People called in and complained." "People called in and complained." "That's funny about Britain, they didn't want him on the show again." "They had some complaints because I was dancing." "When all this starts to move around, it gets a bit much for a lot of people to take." "So I was banned from television, and got a lot of press out of t and it doubled the record sale, so it wasn't so bad." "And I remember the great headline in the London paper." "The headline said, Eechhh!" "You think Boy George was bad." "He was a big spender." "He was a big spender." "Divine liked to buy things, and spend money." "Divine could walk through an airport and spend $1,200." "Divine could've made 90 million dollars and spent 91, and he would've done it on people, not himself." "Every year at Christmas big boxes would come from all over the world for my kids." "He just was very generous." "He loved holidays." "He loved Christmas, and he'd worry about it later." "If it was your birthday, he would call up Tiffany's." "If it was your birthday, he would call up Tiffany's and find out what your birthstone was." ""Honey, you can't afford it."" "She said, "So what?"" "It was a bumpy ride with money, but we always made it work." "Bernard was very much the disciplinary to Divine's kind of chaos." "That's what cemented the relationship with him and Bernard Jay." "It was a business relationship." "I don't think that they were especially fond of each other as friends, especially fond of each other as friends, and I don't think that they were friends, but I think that they needed each other." "Now thundering across the screen comes the mightiest, most inspiring saga of all " "Lust in the Dust." "The pairing of Tab Hunter and Divine in Polyester was a tremendous hit." "From that evolved Lust in the Dust, which was a comedy western, spoofing the westerns of the '50s." "Having worked with Divine," "I knew that Divine was perfect for Lust in the Dust." "I knew that Divine was perfect for Lust in the Dust." "This is your second film that you've done with him/her." "Why?" "Divine was Rosie Velez, a painted lady with a past." "I'm Rosie de la Valez." "Everyone calls me Rosie." "What's your name?" "Divine's female co-star was Lainie Kazan." "Freeze, hombre, or I'll be wearing your asshole for a garter." "They were awfully good together." "They loved one another and it showed, even though they hated one another on screen." "Here's your coffee." "In the movie they play sisters." "Divine would always refer to Lainie as his older sister." ""Get my older sister to the set."" ""Would my older sister like to have lunch with us?"" "We have makeup maven George Masters, to thank for Divine's haunting beauty." "George Masters was a master at doing hair and makeup." "He would do Marilyn Monroe, Rita Hayworth, just the biggest stars." "I always do Tab's co-stars." "In between takes if Lainie got made up prettier than Divine," "In between takes if Lainie got made up prettier than Divine," "Divine would kind of wipe his lip and mess up the makeup so George would have to come and redo his last, so he would look prettier than Lainie." "He was in makeup at four in the morning to be on the set at six." "He would shoot a 12-hour day." "If he couldn't do everything, he tried." "Well, there was one thing he couldn't do." "At the very beginning of the picture," "Divine's character, Rosita, is supposed to be sitting on the back of a mule." "He got on the mule and he couldn't get his balance," "He got on the mule and he couldn't get his balance, because he was so heavy and he and the mule weighed about the same." "So he kept tipping sideways and over and backwards, and it really upset him, because he just wanted to do everything 100 percent." "The first time I'd ever seen him really upset with himself." "He was carrying a lot of weight at that heat and that altitude;" "I'm sure it was a big strain on his heart." "Divine did pass out on the set because of the high altitude in Santa Fe, and his weight." "Because of the high altitude in Santa Fe, and his weight." "It was just like a lethal combination." "So we had to get air tanks for him to walk around in between takes." "He would do a scene, and then if we were setting up another scene or we were about to do another take, he'd be out like a light." "He'd fall asleep during makeup." "He'd fall asleep between takes." "He never complained about it." "He never complained." "He was just happy to be doing it." "New World Pictures took a huge billboard out." "New World Pictures took a huge billboard out above the Chateau Marmont on Sunset Boulevard." "And I remember Divine calling me and saying," ""Oh, my God, I can't believe it!"" "He would literally just stop his car and stare at it." "When Divine went out to promote Lust in the Dust," "I naively said to him," ""Why don't you wear your outfit as Rosie Valez?"" "You would've thought I, like, slapped him in the face." "He said, "I won't wear any of my work clothes." "He said, "I won't wear any of my work clothes on a television talk show." "Are you a transvestite?" "No." " You're not?" " No." "Did he want to be a woman?" "Never." "He never, ever wanted a sex change." "He never ever wanted to become a woman." "It was a J-O-B." "When he wasn't on camera he would get that shit off." "It was uncomfortable, it was hot." "No, he never wanted to be a woman, are you kidding?" "No, no, no." "He just wanted to be a movie star." "There's a difference." "And here you are in a dress shirt, dress slacks." "And here you are in a dress shirt, dress slacks." "Where is the Divine we all kno?" "In the closet and in a couple suitcases right now." "That persona was a heavy burden." "That's what you are, and you had to be that, otherwise you didn't exist." "I saw the original Pink Flamingos and there was one scene toward the end of the movie that I've never been able to forget." " And, uh, I was just" " Nor have I." "Eventually, of course," "Divine got very weary of the dog shit thing." "Divine got very weary of the dog shit thing." "...if that was real dog feces that you ate?" "I'm so tired of talking about that movie." "It was something in the past." "I think it's been the best and worst thing that has ever happened to me, and I just really don't even go into it anymore." "It really doesn't matter." "Hollywood has a tendency to pigeonhole everybody, anyway." "For Divine it was like you are the guy in the big fishtail dress who eats poop and shoots people." "And we're not really looking for that for Fantasy Island this season." "People couldn't see past the man in drag." "People couldn't see past the man in drag to the commitment to the performance, to the skill of the performance." "He was very depressed because he was trying to parlay this Divine character that had been his stock and trade, into an acting career as a man." "I never set out in the beginnig to play just female parts." "But they were the only parts that came my way." "They were written especially for me, and they were the leads of films." "As a young, aspiring actor." "As a young, aspiring actor you don't turn down the lead in the movie." "It made me a star of sorts with a cult status, but then a cult status isn't enough." "You can't get by on that." "You can't make any money." "I don't want to grow old and be poor in some home somewhere eating garbage out of a can." "I just want to be comfortable." "It just takes a lot of money to get through this life." ""Dearest Lisa:" "I love LA, but is it the place for me?" "It's a very straight town and I'm not sure if there is really any work there for me." "And I'm not sure if there is really any work there for me." "All the parts I come up for end up hiring real women." "I just don't think they're ready for me yet." "I really can't take a hell of a lot more."" "He really wanted to be known as a character actor." "It was really important to him." "Divine was an actor, and it was waiting for a break, and trying different things that could get him to that break, like doing this Alan Rudolph film, Trouble in Mind." "Most people imagine me to be a very patient person, whereas I'm just the opposite." "Whereas I'm just the opposite." "I wanted to show myself." "I could play a different type of part, and to play a man." "The very moment I want something," "I have to have it." "Nothing ever satisfies me." "With playing a man's part you really had to watch everything because I didn't want any of those feminine traits to certainly... bounce out." "Once his confidence level was built outside of the persona of Divine and he realized that he could play other roles, that really boosted his ego and his confidence that really boosted his ego and his confidence and allowed him to kind of step outside" "the parameters of the Divine character." "What do you think - is this gonna start a new career for you?" "I hope so." "I've been getting into agents' offices that two years ago we couldn't get through the front door." "Well, you can't see an agent dressed like this." "Come on!" "I knew it was a hard sell." "I just kind of made a lot of calls and hoped that somebody would see him." "And he would always go in there very prepared." "He really wanted them to like him." "There wasn't anything he wasn't willing to do." "I'm ready and raring to go." "I can play men and women's parts, so there's no need to hire anyone else." "He would've preferred to have just done movies, because it was hard." "The touring was hard." "♪" "And there were times when I was in clubs with him where I was fucking worried he would have a heart attack." "He was not only a big guy in hot clubs," "He was not only a big guy in hot clubs, shaking his ass off and dancing for 45 minutes with his shows, but he was wearing, you know, 140 pounds worth of shit." "Okay, the big bitch has to rest for a minute." "Does anybody want to ask any questions?" "I was very concerned that something was gonna happen when we were on the road." "It's hard on a person with that kind of weight in that kind of condition to be on planes all the time and sleeping irregular hours and working irregular hours and eating food that's maybe not so great." "And eating food that's maybe not so great." "He ate all the wrong food for him." "It was a concern, but we tried to keep a watch over it." "And we'd battle, you know, if his doctor was, like, you have to stop, we would -- I would get him on a diet." "He was concerned about his weight." "He didn't really talk about it, but I think it certainly did concern him." "Divine was probably your typical addict - shopping and love, and at some point drugs, and at some point drugs, at some point food." "Divine was excessive, and that adds to a lot of pain that one has to deal with when you're fighting that." "I don't think of her." "I don't think of my momma." "Divine went through a long time where he did not speak to his family at all." "His mom used to call my mom and say," ""Where is he?" "We don't know where he is."" "You know, it was a sad time for me." "I felt I did wrong by telling him to get out." "I felt I did wrong by telling him to get out." "My husband had muscular dystrophy, and that's the reason we moved to Florida." "And at that time Glen and I weren't speaking, and I didn't know where he was." "I noticed this fella sitting beside me." "I knew he was gay." "He was reading this article, and I saw John Waters' name." "And I looked at that picture on the cover, and I thought, boy, those eyes look like Glen." "And I thought, boy, those eyes look like Glen." "I took the magazine home and I said to Harris," ""Who do you think this picture looks like?"" "He looked and he said," ""It looks like Glenny, don't it?"" "That's how I found out that Glen was Divine." "And this fella's talking about Divine playing in this movie." "Here she is, Divine as Dawn Davenport, a feisty young high school gir." "How about let's go down and see this movie?" "Watch as Divine performs the most perverse acts." "Watch as Divine performs the most perverse acts ever brought to the screen." "There was about five or six boys came over to me in the lobby." "And they said, "We don't think you're gonna like it."" "I said, "I'll let you know after the movie's over."" "The man said, "Listen, lady, you don't want to see this movie."" "And she said, "I do want to see this movie." "Divine is my son."" "And people said, "You're Divine's mother?"" ""Yes."" "And they asked for her autograph." "She loved it." "And that's when I called him." "And that's when I called him." "When he heard my voice, he started to cry and I started to cry." "He says, "Mom, can I come back home and we can be family again?" "And I said, "Glen, that's the nicest thing you could say to me." "We'd love to have you come back home."" "When he went home they had a sign out front that said Welcome Home Divine, which very much moved him." "We had a crying good time." "We enjoyed being with each other." "We enjoyed being with each other." "And he promised he'd start coming home." "When they made up, they really made up." "And he was really happy to make up with them, and I know Frances was too." "And she grew to be really proud of him." "I think it did." "It took quite a while, but maybe that was good because now we've become more than just parents and a son." "We've become very, very good friends." "They're quite thrilled now, and both told me they were very proud of me and very happy that I was doing what I loved to do and that I was successful." "Divine knew that we had to keep changing, that we had to evolve." "We had to reinvent ourselves." "We had been doing this a long time." "And that, of course, led to Hairspray." "Hairspray is legendary." "It was an exciting change of tone for John Waters and Divine." "It was a sweet, yet radical, racial inequality drama/musical." "It ain't right to be dancing on TV to that colored music." "It ain't right to be dancing on TV to that colored music." "It was really a homage to Baltimore, and to our teenage 'hood." "And where did you see it first, kids?" "The Corny Collins show!" "It was really wonderful to reconnect." "We were gonna be working together again." "It was gonna be, like, the old gang's back together." "This was a little bittersweet in that it was the biggest John Waters' movie yet, his biggest bid for mainstream attention, and yet Divine had a supporting role." "Ricki Lake was the star." "I'm big, blonde, and beautiful." "I'm big, blonde, and beautiful." "I was in my first year of college at Ithaca, and I got a call that there was a lead role in a movie that I was perfect for, that they were looking for a fat teenager who could dance." "People started saying things to me, 'cause I would say, "Oh, I'm up for this John Waters movie."" "And they're like, "He made Pink Flamingos." "Divine ate dog poop in that, you know?"" "And I was just, like, "What?" "What?"" "I knew there was, you know, some controversy." "Divine played my mother, Edna Turnblad." "Divine played my mother, Edna Turnblad." "We were one big family." "Did you take that appetite suppressant." "I gave you at Dr. McKenzie's orders?" "Mother, I'm a growing teenager." "I need food!" "She's a good wife, a good mother." "Those are her main concerns in life." "And to keep a clean house." "Could you turn that racket dow?" "I'm trying to iron in here." "That look that he had in the beginning of Hairspray, you didn't even recognize him." "I didn't recognize him." "The other women in the neighborhood that looked like that were talking, and," ""Hi." "They're making a movie here."" "And he said, "What drag queen would ever allow themselves to look like this?"" "And he's right." "Now what?" "More soiled laundry for mommy, I suppose." "Poor thing, he just looked so horrible." "He wasn't scared to not be glamorous." "That was the best compliment." "I mean, I did fit right in, and I did look exactly the way I was supposed to." "Divine wasn't happy about me being cast as Tracy." "Divine wasn't happy about me being cast as Tracy." "I can definitely understand where he's coming from." "He's been demoted." "He was John Waters' muse up until then." "There was a new girl in town." "Hi, Corny!" "I'm Tracy Turnblad, and I go to Merville High!" "When I first met him he taught me how to walk in high heels." "I was practicing, and he's like," ""No, no, no, Ricki!" "Do it like this!"" "And he grabbed me, and just pulled me along." "I grew on him over the course of the eight weeks making the film." "By the end, we were great friends." "Divine wanted me to eat with him, all the time." "Divine wanted me to eat with him, all the time." "He would say, "Come on, Ricki, let's share a pie." "Let's eat a roast."" "I loved the scenes where we were together." "We had a great chemistry." "All ratted up like a teenage Jezebel." "Oh, mother, you're so 50s." "I believed he was my mother." "Honey, this is only the beginning." "Stick with me and we'll claw our way to the top." "Divine pulled it off." "She played a real person." "She made you believe in Edna Turnblad, and it was a totally sympathetic, lovable momma." "And it was a totally sympathetic, lovable momma." "That performance in Hairspray is so touching, and it's so believable that the fact that he was a man is irrelevant." "There was not an empty seat in the house tonight for the world premiere of Hairspray." "The premiere was wonderful." "It was really a happy moment." "This is Divine!" "We're delighted to talk to you." "When we went to Baltimore he had a limousine pick us up." "It was a big crowd there." "Divine, of course, went with his mother, and it was such a great night." "Divine was so happy." "It was a film that he could feel good about showing to his family, that they would feel good about and they would respect him in it and applaud him in it." "And I think that's probably what he wanted." "Is this gonna be your biggest hit?" "Oh, well, I don't know yet." "I hope so." "You always hope every one will be the biggest hit." "You know, that movie, I didn't think, was gonna be any different than the other ones." "I never thought - let me think of one that's gonna be mainstream or be a hit." "It just was." "Divine got great reviews." "Pauline Kale, of the New Yorker gave Divine a good review." "And Divine would always say," ""Could you read that Pauline Kale review again?"" "And then that review from the New York Times, he was overwhelmed." "Divine and John all of a sudden exploded on the national scene." "They were being enjoyed by an audience." "They were being enjoyed by an audience who never had seen them before." "For Divine that must've been incredibly satisfying and incredibly validating." "It was huge." "He did the cover of Interview." "He couldn't walk down the street." "New York City bus drivers stopped the bus, and jumped off and asked for autographs." "I was talking to Brandon Tartikoff about a series for Divine because there was loose talks about making Hairspray into a series." "About making Hairspray into a series." "Of course you get elated and you're hopeful that there's more to come... and more did start to come." "He was so much more comfortable with himself, that he knew that his abilities had gotten him to the highest level." "He had cleaned up his act." "He had gotten on a really healthy eating pattern, and he wasn't getting high." "He was getting his life together." "I called the producers of Married With Children and asked them to incorporate a role for Divine as a man... and they did." "This was so exciting for him." "She finally got what she wanted - to be taken seriously as an actor." "A paying job on a sitcom, a hit." "Yippee!" "We had lunch." "I remember Glen eating spaghetti and oysters." "I remember Glen eating spaghetti and oysters." "He had two orders of oysters." "He liked oysters, raw oysters." "I made him promise me he was going to the doctor, 'cause he was so heavy." "We kissed each other goodbye and that was the last time" "I saw him in person." "The last time I ever saw Divine was, the movie had come out, it was a hit, we had dinner at Odeon." "We had dinner at Odeon." "For some reason we had a car and driver." "I don't remember who paid for that - neither of us - and, uh, I kissed him goodbye and put him in the limousine." "We had a lovely night, and I never saw him again." "Divine had flown in Saturday, and he was starting work at 9:00 on Monday for Married With Children." "He was very excited about showing up on the set." "We had a great dinner and we had a great evening and he was in a great mood, really confident." "And it was great to see Divine in that space." "After dinner I drove him home, and he was staying up off of Hollywood Boulevard near Laurel Canyon." "He came out on the balcony in a Smile t-shirt, sings Arrivaderci, Roma." "It was just a great vision of Divine." "I went to the studio, Sunset Gower, and I was to meet Divine there at 9 AM." "And I was to meet Divine there at 9 AM." "And I was there and the rest of the cast was there, and the producers and everything." "And, um, I was summonsed to the phone, and it was Bernard and he said that Divine had died." "Bernard said, "He's dead, Div's dead." "You have to come over to the hotel."" "The room was so sweetly set up." "He had his little Married With Children script." "He had his little bedroom slippers." "He had his diamond studs on the table." "He had his diamond studs on the table." "He was lying down flat, very serene, and very beautiful." "I answered the phone." "It was John." "He said, "Divine's dead."" "And I remember my knees buckled." "He had a massive heart attack in the middle of the night." "I remember Pat Moran came over and my friends came over, and we sat in my bedroom in my old apartment, and we sat in my bedroom in my old apartment, while the phone just rang and rang and rang," "so the answering machine couldn't even pick it up." "And there was news teams downstairs." "The actor, whose real name is Harris Glen Milstead, died in his sleep in his Hollywood hotel room." "And the said thing was, it was just like - why now?" "This was a happy time - it should've been." "Why did it have to be like this?" "It just seemed unbelievable." "He was just so happy." "You know, he would say, uh..." ""Can you believe we came this far?"" ""Can you believe we came this far?"" "We were stupefied that he died." "I've never gotten over the shock of it." "I'm still shocked he's dead." "I wake up sometimes and I'm amazed by that." "Divi was at a level of spirituality, of serenity, of peace, and of loving, and I just found him to be just like a Buddha." "And I just found him to be just like a Buddha." "I loved Divi, and most people did." "I never dreamed in my lifetime that here I am, a mother of a person that was known all over the world, and loved by everybody." "And when I get letters from young people, it makes me feel good to know that people cared about him." "There's a whole lot of things that he stood for that he didn't mean to." "He wasn't out there being any kind of politico." "Divine stood for all outsiders." "He stood for anybody that didn't fit in, that exaggerated what everybody hated, turned it into a style, and won." "No one else can ever call themselves Divine." "That's her legacy." "She earned it, she worked for it," "She earned it, she worked for it, and God damn it, it's hers." "It's just that childhood dream, I guess." "You think it's never really going to happen, but I've realize now, nothing is impossible." "Now I've been all over the world, and met unbelievable people, and there's still much to do, so nothing is impossible." "If you've got those kind of dreams, go for it." "Maybe you'll be one of the lucky ones." "If you believe in something and believe in yourself," "If you believe in something and believe in yourself, do it."