"[♪♪]" "[♪♪]" "YOUNG MAN:" "I'm starting my own paper." "I'll show you how it works." "[♪♪]" "Go faster!" "Whoo!" "(laughing)" "MAN:" "I'll get a job." "We'll buy a house." "Couple of kids." "Don't worry." "I got it all worked out." "MAN 2:" "Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome the newest and youngest addition to the Tribune team," "Lee Strobel." "(muffled cheers)" "It is my distinct pleasure to honor one of our own for his nationally acclaimed" "Ford Pinto investigative series." "Lee, your work has given justice to families across the country and peeled back a corporate cover-up." "So I present you with the Len H. Small Memorial Award for community service journalism." "And congratulations on your promotion" " to Legal Affairs editor!" " (cheering, applause)" "LEE:" "Thank you, Mr. Cook, for the award, for the promotion." "Um... (clears throat) mostly for the promotion." " Uh... (chuckles)" " You're welcome." "The only way to truth is through facts." "Facts are our greatest weapon against superstition, against ignorance and against tyranny." "Now, I learned those words from my mentor," " Mr. Ray Nelson, everybody." " Thank you." "Let's let him hear it, huh?" "Huh?" "His ego needs it." "Bring it on." " That's enough." " (light laughter)" "LEE:" "Now, you all know Ray." "He's a legend in the business." "But, to me, Ray, you've been more like a father, so... thank you." " Thank you." "Thank you, son." " (light laughter)" "Most importantly, uh, I owe this honor to my beautiful and very patient and very pregnant wife, uh... and to my favorite little lady, Alison." "I love you both more than you'll ever know." " GROUP:" "Aw..." " Yes, sweetie?" "ALISON (whispering):" "Now can we eat?" "(Lee laughs)" " "Now can we eat, Daddy?"" " GROUP:" "Yes!" " Yes!" " I'll drink to that." " MAN:" "Cheers!" " Thank you." "[♪♪]" " LEE:" "What's next?" " LESLIE:" "I got "pasta."" "LEE:" "Ooh." "Well, then." "Of course, she finds the biggest word on here, right?" ""Asparagus"?" "Wow, that is a big word." "Not for a girl who's lost a tooth." " Oh, okay." " LEE:" "Oh, big girl." "LESLIE:" "I'm still impressed." "A big girl who didn't eat her dinner." " I'm full." " LESLIE:" "You're full?" " LEE:" "ls that right?" " Yeah." "LESLIE:" "Are you gonna tell me you're hungry when we get home?" "All right, I'm gonna give you dessert if you eat one more noodle." " That was easy." " See?" "Just have to bribe her a little bit." " Chew it up." " LESLIE:" "Mm-hmm." "(makes slurping sound) We done?" " Show me done." "There's still spaghetti in there." " LESLIE:" "Swallow that." " (laughing)" "LEE:" "Take this." "Go." " (laughing)" " LESLIE:" "Good work." "LESLIE:" "You know, I'm feeling pretty good about myself." " LEE:" "Yeah?" " LESLIE:" "Mm-hmm." "LEE:" "How is that?" "I am married to a published author." "(Lee chuckles)" "That's very impressive." " Mm-hmm." "Isn't it?" " Mm-hmm." "I'm proud of you." " Thank you." " Mm-hmm." " I love you." " I love you." "You and only you." " LEE:" "Mm-hmm?" " LESLIE:" "Sweetie?" "Ali, what is it, baby?" " Are you choking?" " I think she's choking." " Ali, come on, cough." " Hey, sweetie, just breathe for Mommy, okay?" " Ali?" "Please, Lee." "Everybody, please, just give her..." " give her some space." " Lee, do something, Lee." " LESLIE:" "Ali, I'm right here." "Okay," "Come on, honey, come on." " Baby, it's gonna be okay." " Can somebody help us, please?" "!" " Call an ambulance!" " (indistinct chatter)" " It's okay, baby." "I'm right here." " Look at Daddy, okay?" "Okay, breathe for me." "You're gonna be all right." "(stammers) Baby, I'm right here." "I don't know..." "I don't know what..." "I don't know what to..." " I love you, sweetheart." "Just..." " She can't breathe!" " Hand her to me." "Quick, quick." "I'm a nurse." "Ali, please!" " Quick, quick, quick, quick, quick." " Okay, just stay calm." "Come on." "Come on, Ali, cough for me." " Cough, honey." " She can't breathe, Lee!" "She can't... [♪♪]" " (coughs)" " LESLIE:" "Sweetie." " WOMAN:" "Cough, baby." "Cough, baby." " Sweetie?" "Okay..." " (Alison coughs)" " LESLIE:" "Okay..." " (murmuring) - (coughs)" " Just breathe, okay?" " WOMAN:" "She's coughing." " She's fine now." "She's fine." " Okay?" " LESLIE:" "Okay, just breathe." " LEE:" "Thank you so much." "Thank you, thank you." " I don't know how to thank you." " Come here, baby." "Come here." " Thank you so much." " You don't have to thank me." "I'm a nurse at Mercy Hospital." "She's gonna be fine now." "We're so lucky." "Well, it's not luck." "It's Jesus." "My husband and I were on our way to another restaurant tonight." "Something told me I needed to be here." "Wow." "Thank you." "Um, Leslie." "Alfie." "Alfie Davis." "I'm not gonna forget you." "ALFIE:" "God bless you." "(Lee sighs)" "Just keeping it interesting, huh?" "You keep drinking that." "(insects trilling)" "ALISON:" "I can still have candy, though, right?" "LESLIE (chuckling):" "We'll have to see about that." "You get some sleep now, all right, missy?" " Mom?" " Hmm?" "Who's Jesus?" "Jesus was a man... great man..." "And... you know, we've talked about God, right?" "Honey, you know how Mommy and Daddy read you stories at night..." "You know, the fairy tales that you like?" "So, believing in God is kind of like that..." "It's really nice stories." "But we are atheists." "Atheists don't believe in God." "What do they believe?" "Uh, they believe in what's real, in what we can see, what we can touch." "Like What?" "Oh..." "like this." " (Lee grunting playfully) - (Alison laughing)" "(Lee chuckles)" "Well, I guess I'm an atheist, too." "LEE (chuckles):" "Get some sleep, booger, okay?" "Here's Beary." "There you go." "Fudge Pop." "All right, sleep good." "I love you." "Daddy?" " Yes, love?" " Good night." "(chuckles) Good night, baby." "LESLIE:" "I thought we said we weren't gonna force anything on her." "She asked." "Right, so as long as it's what we believe." "Ugh." "Are-are we really gonna go around on this again, Les?" "I guess so." "Babe, I..." "I am grateful for what that woman did tonight..." "Obviously..." "But it was..." "it's a coincidence." "It didn't mean anything." "How can you say that?" "She was going to another restaurant, and something made her come to ours." "You think that means nothing?" "I know it means nothing." "Can I tell you what it means?" "It means that we would've lost Alison." "If that woman hadn't been there, we would've lost her." "Our whole world would've changed forever." "I..." "Yes, but it didn't." "Okay?" "We're all okay." "Everyone's okay." "[♪♪]" "(indistinct conversations)" "There you go." "I got ya." "Whoa." "Hey, chief." "I could've edited three pieces with my red pencil in the time it takes me to do one piece on this ridiculous thing." "LEE:" "My new book." "Just picked these up from the mailroom." "Wanted you to be the first to see it." "Hmm." "Hey, there was a cop shooting this weekend." "Englewood." "Officer survived." "See what you can get me on the shooter, James Hicks." "No, that's cop beat." "I'm Legal Affairs now." "Why don't you give that to Monroe?" "(chuckles) Now, you may be a golden boy to the suits upstairs, but to me you're still just a beat reporter here." "(muffled):" "Thank you." "Uh, don't close the..." "London." "Hey." "Want an autographed copy of my new book?" " Not one bit." " Ooh." "(chuckling)" "Jealousy doesn't look good on you, my friend." "Then again, nothing does." "Overnight legal briefs from AP, Mr. Strobel." "Thanks, Rod." "Hey." "Want you to go through yesterday's local rags." "See if anyone reported on a cop shooting." "Perp's name is Hicks..." "James Hicks." "Hicks." "James Hicks." "Sure." " Okay." " You got 30 minutes." "I'll take a book if you're still offering." "Hey, London." "Hear that?" "Got my first taker." "He doesn't know any better." "LEE:" "Bet you're gonna go far in this business, kid." "Even if you are sucking up." "29 minutes, Rod." "ALFIE:" "Room 241, bed two, going home today." "Want to prep for discharge, please?" "Leslie?" "Yes." "Hi." "Alfie." "Yes." "Um... muffins." "I have not... been able to stop thinking about it." "What if you hadn't been there?" "There is no "what if" with God." "You're so sure." "How can you be so sure?" "Do you really want an answer to that?" "Please." " LESLIE:" "Alfie." "So sorry." " Ah!" "I'm sorry." "The babysitter." " I'm-I'm sorry." " Oh, it's fine." " Okay." "Okay." " Come on." "Come on in." "♪ O soul, are you weary ♪" "♪ And troubled?" "♪" "♪ No light in the darkness ♪" "♪ You see?" "♪" "♪ There's light for a look at the Savior... ♪" "PREACHER:" "Sometimes God speaks to us in unexpected and surprising ways." "So tonight, for example, if you find yourself here for the first time," "I just want to encourage you to open your heart and take a chance." "Maybe God's trying to get your attention right now." "And, trust me, if you listen expectantly for His whispers, you'll hear them." "You Will." "Maybe you're afraid." "Maybe you have doubts." "Maybe you've felt something missing in your life and you don't know quite what it is." "That's fine." "God is patient." "And when you're ready, I promise you," "He'll be right there waiting for you with open arms." " LEE:" "Hey." " Hi." "Sorry I missed dinner." "New boss piling on the work." "I think he's punishing me for the award." "How was your day?" "Good." "It was good." "(knocking)" "Officer Koblinsky." " Who are you?" " Lee Strobel." "I'm with the Chicago Tribune." "Close call, huh?" "So, I'm looking to do a story on the shooting." "You know, hero cop, injured in the line of duty, that whole angle." "I'm not supposed to talk to anybody from the press." "I know, but you've gotta be able to give me something." "You know the deal." "Not while it's under investigation." "Look, I read your report." "I know you and James Hicks got in a scuffle," "I know he shot you, but come on." "Give me a little something off the record?" "Why do you think he did it, huh?" "Look, thanks anyway, okay?" "LEE:" "Ah..." "All right." "I will go find another hero cop to interview." "Mr. Strobel, do you want a story?" "Yeah." "Do one on the gangbanger who did this." "Put him away for good." "[♪♪]" "Feel better, huh?" "PREACHER:" "We find the answer right here in the Book of John, chapter one, verse 12," ""But as many as received Him," ""to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name."" "So, what does it mean to not just believe but receive?" "PREACHER:" "And how does it lead us..." "ALFIE:" "So, did you ever go to church?" "LESLIE:" "Yeah, I went to church as a girl." "Mm-hmm." "And my mom sung hymns to me." "But Lee and I moved on from how we were raised." "And, uh, what is it that Lee believes in again?" "Just the facts." "(chuckling):" "Okay." "I've always been kind of curious, but, uh, lately, you know, having Alison and now..." "It's just starting to seem more important to know." "And I don't believe that it was a coincidence that you came to the restaurant..." "I don't... so... (chuckles)" "What do I do with that?" "What do you think you should do with it?" "I don't know." "I've just... (chuckles)" "I've just spent most of my life feeling like God is a million miles away." "Oh, no, sweetheart." "God is not a million miles away." "He's right here... right now, waiting for you to talk to Him." "[♪♪]" "LEE:" "The TV's all staticky again." "Tried banging on it." "That's not working anymore." "Did you check the roof?" "Yeah." "The, uh, antenna's fine." "Maybe you should call the repair guy, see if he can come by and take a peek at it tomorrow." "Sure." "Hey, so I went to see Alfie last week." "LEE:" "Uh..." " Alfie, Alfie, Alfie..." " Alfie, Alfie." "Superwoman who saved our daughter?" " Right." " Alfie." "So, uh, she invited me to her church, and I went." "(laughs) Really?" "Oh, I would've loved to have seen that." "Yeah, well, I wanted to go." "(Lee sighs)" "Can't we just give it a break, Les?" "Okay?" "I know you were rattled the other night." "Are you interested in hearing me or just condescending?" "No, that's not... that's not what I'm trying to do here." "Okay?" "Alison's fine, hon." "Let's not go crazy." "I'm not acting crazy." "Am I acting crazy?" "It was the wrong choice of words." "I don't think you're crazy." "I think you're pregnant." "And a little crazy." "And scared, and..." "I get it." "Do you?" "Because I'm not done yet." "Okay." "(Leslie sighs)" "So, I went to church." "And I don't know exactly how it happened, but... (sighs)" "I felt something." "And so I went again tonight." "And I know this is gonna be weird to hear, because it's weird to say, but..." "I prayed." "So, what are you..." "what are you telling me, Les?" "I'm saying that..." "I talked to Jesus." "I..." "I told Him I want Him in my life." "You what?" "Why?" " Why would you...?" " Hey, stay with me." "Hon, this is a good thing." "What did this Alfie woman say to you?" "It was my decision." " Okay?" " I don't accept it." "You don't get to accept it." "I'm not asking." " (Lee shushing)" " I'm telling you what happened." "You're not hearing me." "Okay." "Listen, hon." "It's me." "This is me talking to you." "It's me." "Honestly, this is something that I think I've been thinking for a long time and I just haven't been able to... to say anything because of who you are." "Oh, are you kidding me, Les?" " I know this is a lot, hon." " A lot?" "A lot?" "You drop this on me." "What does that even mean?" "I don't know what it means, but I know it's a good thing for me." " For us." "Yes." " No." "No." "Okay." " Yes." " Okay, this is not us, Les." "Whatever this is, okay, it is not us." "You are on your own..." "Can you listen to me and not get mad?" "I am listening to you, and that's the problem, so if you're serious about this..." " And I am." " Okay, well, then I... then I don't know what to say to you" " about whatever this is." " Don't say anything, then." "Just listen to what I'm trying to say, because I'm trying to explain that I felt something that is maybe more real than anything" "I've ever felt in my life." "More real than anything you've felt in your life." " Okay, I'm not trying to compare." " Got it." "Got it." " I'm..." " No." "You know what?" "I don't want to hear any more of this." " Come on." "Hon..." " Okay?" "Where are you going?" "To file a missing persons report." " That's not funny." " Not meant to be." "(door opens and closes)" "[♪♪]" "Thank you." "[♪♪]" "[♪♪]" "YOUNG LESLIE:" "I love you, Lee Strobel." "You and only you." "[♪♪]" "LEE:" "I feel like I can get through to her before she gets too deep, but I remember, you went through something like this, uh, with your daughter..." "With Lori, right?" "Yes, yes, I did." "It's a conundrum." "You see, in times of crisis, we humans tend to seek meaning, don't we?" "You've read Bertrand Russell, of course." "Yeah, of course." "I mean, not since college, but..." "There's no way that Leslie would read that right now." "Yeah, my daughter wouldn't, either, but I kept picking away at the delusion until she finally came around." "But I gotta tell you, Lee, doesn't come without a price." "How do you mean?" "Whatever this is for Leslie, maybe it's not such a terrible thing." "I mean, if it brings her comfort, are you sure it's not something you can live with?" "Yes, I'm sure." "I'm not gonna lose my wife and my kids to some thing that I can't even reason with." "No." "I can't even pretend to go along with this, Ray." "I mean, you of all people should understand that." "I do." "And I know that Leslie is a reasonable woman, so I think that reason is probably the best approach." "And, as always, it comes down to facts and truth." "Now, you present her with the facts, and I'm sure she will find her way back to the truth." "Meanwhile, my collection is at your disposal." "Take your time." "(sighs) Appreciate it, Ray." "Oh, Lee, one more thing." "I'll be praying for you." " That's not even funny." " (Ray laughing)" "LEE:" "Kenny, let me ask you something." "Uh, you're into all this God nonsense." "Wow, you sure know how to charm a source." "So, a bunch of Bible thumpers got to Leslie." "Um..." "I'm afraid she joined your cult." "So, if somebody..." "somebody wanted to do an investigation into Christianity..." "Oh, like a hit piece." "Well, uh... you know, if that's where the evidence leads." "(chuckles)" "Seems to me you got yourself a catch-22." "What's that?" "Let's say you debunk Christianity." "How's Leslie gonna live with the man who destroyed the very thing that now gives her life meaning?" "(stammers) I..." "Because I should be the thing that gives her life meaning." "And then what if Leslie's right and you prove your theory of science and reason wrong?" "How are you gonna live with yourself?" "I'm willing to take that chance." "Okay." "You're a journalist." "Check it out." "Where would you start?" "Unless you want to do two years of seminary, I'd say go straight for the jugular." "The entire Christian faith hinges on the resurrection of Jesus." "If it didn't happen, it's a house of cards." "He's reduced to a misunderstood rabbi at best." "At worst, he's a lunatic who was martyred." "For a guy who thinks I'm trying to assassinate Christianity, you sure you want to hand me that gun?" "I'm pretty sure you're not gonna be able" " to pull the trigger." " All right." "Who's the big authority on the Resurrection?" "Dr. Gary Habermas." "He debated Antony Flew." "That guy's one of my heroes." "He's in Wisconsin, by the way." "Big debate this weekend." " Wisconsin?" " Mm-hmm." "Who would go to Wisconsin?" "[♪♪]" "REPORTER (over radio):" "spike in gang violence, especially in the communities of Wrigleyville," "Lincoln Park, and Englewood, as evidenced..." "Dr. Habermas, if Christians want to hold on to their belief in a giant cosmic imaginary friend..." " (light laughter) - that's all well and good, but don't try to stand your historical technique up against a tsunami of legitimate scholarship." " You will drown." " (laughter)" "HABERMAS:" "Well, thank you for the warning, Dr. Singer, but are you not aware that Gerd Ludemann, one of the most famous atheist" "New Testament scholars, now believes that the earliest known report of the Resurrection was formed no more than three years after the Cross?" "Now, these are your colleagues, sir, not mine." "Something you'd like to ask me, Mr. Strobel?" "Yeah, well, I-l..." "so I read your book, and there's something that stuck out to me." "How can anyone talk about historical evidence for the Resurrection when the Resurrection, by nature, is a miracle?" "Right?" "We all know miracles can't be proven scientifically." "Correct, but we don't have to prove a miracle to prove a resurrection." "(chuckling):" "Okay." "Love to hear you explain that one." "No, you just have to show that Jesus died and he was seen afterwards." "Right, but the very people who claim that they saw him are religious zealots." "So, in my line of work, we call those "biased sources."" "Well, I'm not interested in bias either, Mr. Strobel." "You see, I care about the facts for professional and-and personal reasons." "Right, so where are the facts, Dr. Habermas?" "The Resurrection narrative is more legend than it is history." "Really?" "Well, not according to historical records." "Did you know that we have a report of the Resurrection with specific eyewitnesses that dates all the way back within months of the Resurrection itself?" "That source also adds that 500 separate people saw Jesus at the same time." "We're not talking decades or centuries after the Cross, Mr. Strobel." "It's months." "Hey, you a coffee drinker?" "Uh, sure." "ALISON:" "I should be able to reach the faucet." "When am I gonna be taller?" "(chuckling):" "Before you know it." " Ooh." " What's wrong, Mommy?" "Nothing's wrong." "It's just the little one saying hello." "LEE:" "Okay, so 500 witnesses, but that's still just one historical source: the Bible." "Wrong." "There are at least nine ancient sources both inside and outside the Bible confirming that disciples and others encountered Jesus after the Crucifixion." "But-but they were already followers of Jesus." "Well, not all of them." "Think of Saul of Tarsus." "He originally was a persecutor of Christians." "He hunted them down and killed them." "Yet he died the Apostle Paul, proclaiming that Jesus was the Son of God." "But-but let's not kid ourselves here." "People die for lies all the time." "900 people died drinking poison Kool-Aid at Jonestown." "True, and there are other examples like that throughout history, but here's the difference." "People don't willingly drink poison for something that they know is a lie." "Fair point." "If the early Church martyrs knew that the Resurrection was a hoax, then why would they willingly die for it?" " Would you?" " Um, I want to go back to something that you said earlier." "You said that, uh..." "that this was personal to you." "Why is that?" "I lost my wife Debbie to cancer." "I'm sorry about that." "It was the worst thing that will ever happen to me." "(takes deep breath)" "But in my time of loss, it... it made me confront my beliefs." "That is where I found my true comfort." "Because I know that I am gonna see my wife again someday." "And... forgive me, but as a man who... who claims to value hard evidence, don't you find that that sort of, um, hopeful thinking weakens your argument?" "Not one bit." "The fact that I benefit from gravity isn't proof that it's real, just as my dislike for mosquitoes isn't an argument against their existence." "You see, what I... what I want and what I don't want has no impact on truth." "That being said, if Christ's resurrection means that I get to be with Debbie again," "I have no problem being happy about that." "Sometimes truth reminds us of what's really important." "[♪♪]" "(beeping)" "(engine revving)" "[♪♪]" "(pager beeping)" "ALFIE:" "Oh, Lee, Lee." "Lee." "Alfie." "Remember me?" "Yeah, of course." "What happened?" "Okay, well, her water broke." "She couldn't reach you, so she called me, and... well, I drove her here." "Again... thank you." " I'll take it from here." " Okay." "(knock at door)" " Hey, Les." " LESLIE:" "Lee." " Daddy." " Hey, peanut." "(grunts) You a big helper for Mama?" "LESLIE:" "Lee, where were you?" " I was working, hon." "Hon, I paged you and I paged you" " and I paged you and I..." " I know, I know." "Okay?" "Yeah." " You okay?" " Mm-hmm." "He's beautiful." "They're cleaning him up." "We were at home, and I started cramping, and..." "Ali was scared." "Right?" "And we prayed, and everything got better." "Good." "I'm glad." "(baby crying)" " Oh..." " Oh, hi, sweetie." "Hey, come here, honey." "Oh, hi." " (chuckles)" " Oh, he's got healthy lungs." "Meet your son, Kyle Christopher." " Hey." " (gasps) Hi." "(grunting)" "Hey." "Welcome to the world, buddy." "[♪♪]" "(fussing quietly)" "You should call your parents, don't you think?" "People can change, you know?" "Well, the announcement's in the paper." "They can read it just like everybody else." "(radio playing indistinctly)" "[♪♪]" "[♪♪]" "[♪♪]" "(grunting):" "Good gracious." "(blowing)" "(horn honks)" "LEE:" "Mr. Marlow." "Lee Strobel, Chicago Tribune." "You'll have to excuse me." "Sir, you've been dodging my calls about James Hicks for over a week." "I tried talking to PD." "They won't tell me anything, either," "Why can't I get a statement from anyone?" "What's the big secret?" "Hold this." "Tell you what..." "Why don't you come to the jail and talk to my client yourself?" "Maybe you can get him to say more to you than he'll say to me." "(lock buzzes)" "Mr. Hicks, I'm Lee Strobel." "I'm with the, uh..." "the Chicago Tribune." "I'd like to talk to you about the shooting." "I figured that maybe you'd want to give me, uh, your side of things... you know, help yourself out a bit here." "I didn't do nothing." "Okay, so then... so then tell me how it all went down." "I don't know." "It's fuzzy." "Joe started shoving me around for no reason." "Who's Joe?" " Koblinsky." " HICKS:" "The cop." "Koblinsky." "He put his hands on me, so I fought back, like anyone would." "We go at it for a bit, then a gun goes off." " Whose gun?" " I don't know." "Like I told you, I was drinking that night." " It was fuzzy." " Crime scene report says they found your .22-caliber" "pistol in the bushes, that it was missing a bullet and it had your prints all over it." "Koblinsky carries a .38." "His gun was never fired." "In fact, it was never taken out of its holster, so... if you didn't shoot him, then who did?" "My old lady kicked me out that night." "I got a little crazy, you know, fired off a round at the building, but I didn't aim it at nobody or hurt nobody." "I tossed my piece in the bushes when Koblinsky rode up on me." "That's it... he tossed it in the bushes." "I tossed it in the bushes." "Mr. Hicks, are you still affiliated with the Gangster Disciples?" "You know what this is?" "This is a waste of my time." "Guard." "Sir, I-| am trying to help you here, and nothing that you've told me is gonna change the evidence that's stacked against you, which right now is pretty overwhelming." "What you talking about?" "You don't know me." "Okay, sir, you gotta come up with a better excuse than "the dog ate my bullet"" "if you're gonna beat this thing, Mr. Hicks." "(door closes)" "Your client's guilty as sin." " You know that, right?" " Really?" "[♪♪]" "(bell tolling)" "[♪♪]" "(knocking)" "LEE:" "Father Marquez." "Lee Strobel." " Thank you for seeing me. I..." " Of course." "Of course." "I, uh..." "I should tell you" "I'm a bit of a history buff myself, so..." " Oh." "Yeah, I'm-I'm..." "I'm particularly intrigued with your archaeological work." "Oh." "A former life." "Uh, former life, yes." "I'm a..." "I'm a bit surprised, given your, uh... your stellar reputation that you just gave all that up for, uh, this." "Well, would you like to be more specific?" "Well, it just seems to me that, for the better part of 2,000 years," "Christianity has been creating these... these rituals and these rules." "You know, they've erected these elaborate and often expensive cathedrals, and all of that to support a faith that I believe is-is ultimately built on sand." "And yet it's all still standing." "Yes, because people keep telling each other the same stories over and over again." "Just because I write something down and I bury it in the dirt, that doesn't make it true." "I think I'm beginning to see the crux of your visit." "Look, I..." "I understand that a number of people claimed to have seen Jesus after his crucifixion and some of them even wrote it down, but I guess my question is:" "How-how can we be sure of the reliability of those manuscripts?" "Well, the same way we authenticate any historical document:" "by comparing and contrasting the copies that have been recovered." "It's called textual criticism." "The more copies we have, the better that we can cross-reference and figure out if what the original was saying is historically accurate." "And the earlier they come from in history, the better." "Take Homer's "Iliad," for example." "MARQUEZ Hmm?" "Is this real?" "It's as real as the Macedonian dirt that I dug it up from." "LEE:" "Well, the Greeks considered this their Bible" " for many centuries." " Yes, they did." "That is one of 1,565 copies in existence today." "Now, the "Iliad" was originally composed" " 800 years before Christ." " Okay." "This Greek copy is dated at the third century A.D." "(Lee inhales deeply)" "So... (exhales) 800... that's-that's... 1,100 years between this copy and the original, yes?" "Correct." "There is only one ancient collection of writings that has more authenticated copies than the "Iliad."" "Can you guess what that is?" "You're gonna tell me the Bible." "The New Testament." "And how many copies is that?" "To date, archaeologists have recovered 5,843" "Greek New Testament manuscripts." "That's four times as many as the "Iliad."" " Really?" " The earliest fragment of the Gospel of John was found in ancient Egypt, and it dates to the second century A.D." "How close is that to the original?" "Less than 30 years." "I have one of the fragments in my collection." " It's quite a treasure, isn't it?" " Hmm." "After the New Testament and the "Iliad,"" "runners-up don't even come close." "We only have a hundred copies of Sophocles, seven copies of Plato's tetralogies and only five copies of anything by Aristotle." "In fact, if you laid the surviving copies of Aristotle one on top of the other, it would make barely four feet." "You do the same with surviving copies of the New Testament, the stack would be a mile high." "Nothing else in history even comes close." "How is that for "reliable"?" "LEE:" "Well, Father, I certainly appreciate it." "You've given me a lot of food for thought." "MARQUEZ (chuckling):" "Entirely my pleasure." "LEE:" "Oh, wow." "The Shroud of Turin." "That is a fantastic reproduction." "Uh, the actual shroud is in the Cathedral of Saint John the Baptist in Italy." "Under lock and key." "Of course." "No one's ever proven if the shroud is the actual burial cloth of the Christ, but whenever someone looks in those eyes for the first time, the Galilean who hung on the cross two millennia ago suddenly becomes a real person." "But why would he do it?" "Why... why allow himself to be killed if-if he really is the..." "the Son of God?" "Why not use his power to defend himself?" "The answer to that is what got me out of the dirt and into the church." "It's really very simple." "Love." " ♪ ♪" " Mm-hmm." "Love." "♪ Carry on, my wayward son ♪" "♪ There'll be peace when you are done ♪" "♪ Lay your weary head to rest ♪" "♪ Don't you cry no more... ♪" "LEE:" "You're saying that the historical Christ is identical to the religious basis for Jesus Christ?" "VOICE:" "Please deposit one dollar to continue talking." "Dr. Yamaguchi, could you hold for one second, please?" "Hi." "Lee Strobel with the Chicago Tribune." "How are you, sir?" "Dr. Ben Witherington told me he'd be letting you know that I'd be calling." "Well, no, I just wanted to check on the validity of a few historical documents, if I could." "♪ And if I claim to be a wise man ♪" "♪ It surely means that I don't know ♪" "♪ On a stormy sea of moving emotion ♪" "♪ Tossed about I'm like a ship on the ocean ♪" "♪ I set a course for winds of fortune ♪" "♪ But I hear the voices say ♪" "♪ Carry on, my wayward son ♪" "♪ There'll be peace when you are done ♪" "♪ Lay your weary head to rest ♪" "♪ Don't you cry no more. ♪" "Ah!" "(baby crying)" "(shushing quietly)" "(sighs)" "(crying stops)" "A-one, a-two... a-three." "Three." "ANNOUNCER:" "How many licks does it take to get to the Tootsie Roll center of a Tootsie Pop?" "The world may never know." "LESLIE:" "What on earth?" "It's 3:00 in the morning, hon." " What you doing?" " Oh, uh... a little research for a story." "(Leslie sighs)" "What's your story on?" "Imported German beer?" "Oh, the judgment." "Here it comes." " I'm not judging you." " Bring it on." "I'm worried, hon, that you've been up late every night or out." "I just..." "I feel like you're not here with me." "Well, whose fault is that, Leslie?" "Okay." "You've obviously had one too many." " You're being a jerk." " So this is my fault, then?" " (sighs)" " Sweetheart," "I'm not the one who went and changed." "You did that." "I don't know, maybe I wasn't enough for you." "Maybe... maybe you had to go find yourself a new man." " What?" " Yes." "You're cheating on me." "With Jesus." "You're hilarious." "You went off the deep end, and now you're pissed off 'cause I won't jump in after you." "I'm gonna sit this one out." " All right?" " Great." "I'm going back to sleep." " I'm gonna crash on the couch." " Fine." "Hey, I didn't sign up for this, Les!" "I want my wife back!" "(taking deep breaths)" "(sobbing)" "Please just tell me what to do." "Just tell me what to do." "LEE:" "Hey." "Good morning." "Did you sleep good last night?" "You have sweet dreams?" " Mm-hmm." " Good." "Okay, well, I'll see you later, all right, baby?" "Mm-hmm." "DUBOIS:" "Strobel!" "Rolling in at the crack of noon." "Just trying to get to the bottom of this cop shooting, chief." "Mm-hmm." "By reading Voltaire." "Can't wait to see how that's gonna play in." "Well, that's for something different." "How long till I'm reading copy?" "I'm trying, Okay?" "There's a big story here." "I feel it." "Yeah, I need to feel it right here." "I know that, and I'm gonna do my best to make that happen." " (phone rings)" " All right?" "Oh, excuse me." "Legal Affairs desk." " MAN:" "Lee Strobel?" " Speaking." "Yeah, this is, uh, Bill Craig." "I'm sorry." "Who?" "Bill Craig." "Dr. Craig, thank you for returning my call." "I appreciate that." "BILL:" "Yeah, I'm sorry for the delay." "I'm-I'm calling from Jerusalem." "I have to give a lecture any minute." "I just, uh..." "I didn't want to keep you waiting." "LEE:" "I'll cut right to the chase." "So, I've been doing research into the purported resurrection of Jesus, and I want to run a theory by you." "Maybe the reason that the tomb was empty was because Jesus' body was never there in the first place." "Because we know that the Romans used to throw the bodies of... of, uh, crucifixion subjects to the dogs." " Right?" "Well, there's no evidence for that, but there are specific records that didn't happen to Jesus." " And what records are those?" " Well, actually, the earliest recorded accounts tell us that Jesus was properly buried in a tomb..." "And the Romans did allow for burial of some crucifixion victims." "But then there's something that still doesn't add up to me about all of these supposed eyewitnesses that claimed to have found Jesus' empty tomb." "What, the fact that they were all women?" "Yeah, because..." "because we know that, according to Jewish customs, women were deemed to be unreliable witnesses." " Am I right?" " Well, true." "So, why did all four gospel writers record that it was women who discovered the empty tomb?" "(laughing):" "It..." "So I'm asking you that." "Well, if you were a first-century Jew making up this story out of thin air, then you would never say that women discovered the tomb." " It would damage your case, not help it." "Okay." "So maybe we're dealing with the world's most inept disciples." "Or maybe the disciples reported what actually happened and let the chips fall where they may." "Okay, all right, but you-you have to admit here that there is a..." "there is a gaping hole" " in all of this." " A gaping hole?" "The-the fact that the gospels are filled with contradictions about the empty tomb." "Okay?" "If I turned in a story that was this jumbled," "I'd be out of a job." "If we look through the gospels, you start at... start at Matthew, okay?" "Matthew puts Mary Magdalene and some other Mary at the tomb." "You flip over to Mark, he adds Salome." "You go to Luke, he adds Mary, mother of James, and then some lady named Joanna." "What-what is that?" "You need a Sherpa guide to sort your way through this mess." "Sure, there are differences, but that doesn't trouble most historians." "Why?" "Why doesn't that trouble...?" "It troubles me." "It should trouble them." "Because the core of the story is the same in all four." "After Jesus is placed in the tomb, it's visited on Sunday morning by a small group of women, and they find the body is gone." "Now, you've studied law." "Yeah, law, yes." "Then you know that, when policemen question several witnesses at a crime scene, they never expect the secondary details to be consistent, as long as the core account is the same." "In fact, if they're too similar, it's suspect." " That's true." " Well, that's exactly what we're talking about here." "The empty tomb is based on evidence, and isn't evidence your trade?" "It is, yes, but what if..." "what if the Resurrection is one of the historical details that was recorded incorrectly?" "How can we know?" "How can we ever know?" "(sighs) Lee... let me ask you something." "Do you really want to know the truth, or is your mind already made up," " regardless of the facts?" " Oh, look, Doc," "I-I'm a journalist, okay?" "It's my job to challenge assumptions until they're proven otherwise." "That's all I'm doing." "Well, I get that." "But when is enough evidence enough evidence?" "LESLIE:" "He 's so frustrating." "I'm just not good at this, I guess." "I just..." "I want to share it with him." "I want to celebrate it, and I'm walking on eggshells in my own home." "Well, it's probably the same for him." "He's walking on eggshells, too, so... give yourself a break." "But the more I try to reach him," " the more he pulls away." " Okay, so... how did you reach him before?" "Well, We'd talk." "We'd really talk and listen and..." ""Listen."" "(laughs)" "Do that." " LESLIE:" "Easier said than done." " (Alfie laughs)" "(muttering)" "Koblinsky..." "Koblinsky." "Koblinsky." "Koblinsky." "Koblinsky." "You gotta be kidding me." "Says here that Koblinsky was Hicks's arresting officer six times." "Obviously, these guys knew each other." "In fact, when I interviewed Hicks, he slipped up." "He called Koblinsky by his first name." "So, what's your theory?" "My theory is that Hicks is an informant for the gang task force and Koblinsky is his handler." "Which means a gang member just shot his own handler and, for some reason, Chicago PD's covering it up." "PD's protecting this guy." "He's a cop shooter." "(sighs)" "I can't run that unless you get me a source inside the PD..." "Someone to confirm Hicks is an informant." "Well, I'm gonna need a little help." "(sighs)" "DUBOIS:" "Dinner and drinks only." "Well, drinks at least." "Bring me back a receipt." "And don't close the..." "MAN:" "What do you want from me, Strobe]?" "It's an open-and-shut case." "That's all I know." "(chuckles) So, you're..." "you're on the gang squad." "That's all you know?" "You gotta give me something." "Can... can I get you dinner?" "You like steak?" "LEE (clears throat):" "Here's my theory." "Koblinsky's on your team, and Hicks is your informant." "(chuckles) You think that, uh, 'cause you take down a big car company that there's a conspiracy underneath every rock?" "No, don't-don't..." "Come on, Acosta, you know that I'm right." "Koblinsky's a hero, okay?" "No one's taking that away from him." "But his own snitch shoots him, and your bosses don't want it getting out." "That doesn't look good for your new department, politics or whatever, I get it." "You want to know what I hear?" "I hear they're gonna knock Hicks's time down to petty time in county." "They're gonna put him back on the streets." "They're offering Hicks a plea to keep his mouth shut." "Now, you don't want that." "Now, all I need to run this story is one source from the squad." "That way, everybody knows Hicks is a stoolie, he goes away for a long time, and, boom, your task force is free of cop shooters." "I'm not gonna quote you." "I'm not gonna use your name." "You don't have to go on the record." "Nothing." "How about this?" "If I'm even in the right ballpark, you leave the tip." "Drop a couple bucks on the table, get up, you walk out of here," "I know that I'm safe to run my story." "I'll do you one better." "I'll pay for the meal." "It was crap anyways." "(typing)" "DUBOIS:" "Now, how confident are you on this?" "Very." "Okay." "Get it to the copy desk." "Front page..." "Green Streak edition." "Uh, and d-don't..." "LESLIE:" "Lee?" "Lee?" "Hey." "(Lee grunts)" "I made you coffee." "(groaning):" "Oh, okay." "Shut up and take the coffee." "(sighing):" "Goodness." " I wanted to ask you a favor." " Mm-hmm." "Uh, the..." "I'm taking the kids to church." "Come with us." "Why would I do that?" "Because I asked you to..." "Nicely... and... because, even though you think I've lost my mind, you'd still do anything to make me happy." "(Lee grumbles)" "(sighs)" "I'm still gonna bring my notebook, in case I uncover a church scandal or something." "Deal." "Get ready to go." " 15 minutes." " Mm-mm." "♪ When I'm depressed and I get down so low ♪" "♪ And then I see You coming to me ♪" "♪ It's all right ♪" "♪ Oh ♪" "♪ You put this love in my heart ♪" "♪ You put this love in my heart ♪" "♪ You put this love in my heart. ♪" "(cheering)" "Some of you have had bad experiences in church before, and I get that." "Churches aren't perfect." "Pastors aren't perfect." "I know I'm not." "But that's not God." "That's people." "God wants to be your Father." "To love you until you know His promise of Heaven." "Because this is the simple truth of our faith." "God made us." "We messed things up." "Christ paid for our mess, and all we have to do is receive Him." "It really is as simple as that." "ALFIE:" "Hi." "Lee." " Hey, Lee." " Hey." "Good to see you, Alfie." "Good to see you." "I see you brought the baby." "LEE:" "Yeah, yeah." "He's growing up." "Hey, uh, can I talk to you for a minute?" "Um, sure... sure." "Yeah, I-| just wanted to say that-that... we are grateful, uh, for what you did with Alison." " Oh..." " And-and we owe you." "And... and-and I-I don't mean that lightly." "But now, this whole thing with Leslie, it needs to stop." "I don't understand." "You're-you're putting ideas in her head." "You're drawing her into..." "in this, and... and-and I know how this works." "I know you folks have a mandate, okay?" "You need to raise money." "You need to get the good news out and all that." "I'm just letting you know that you're gonna need to find someone else to recruit." "Lee, your wife is not brainwashed." "She's seeking God, and I'm just trying to help." "She is vulnerable, and you are taking advantage." "She's my wife, this is our life, and I want you to stay out of it." "Now, is that clear?" "[♪♪]" "LEE:" "All right, come on." " Let's go." " Well... anyhow, see you." " Okay." " Alison?" "Come on, sweetie." "Bye." "(doorbell rings)" "Lee." "Dad." "LEE'S MOTHER:" "There he is." "Hello, sweetheart." " Hi." "Hi." " Big guy." "Oh, he's so sweet." "Hi, honey." "Oh, Walt, look at how handsome he is." " I'll say." " Oh, he's an angel." "LEE'S FATHER:" "Yeah." " (laughing) - (baby crying)" "LEE'S MOTHER:" "Oh, sweetheart." "Oh..." "You know what, it's time for your nap." "Nap time, so..." "Okay, honey, there you go." "LEE'S MOTHER:" "I love his name." "What's his middle name?" "Christopher." "Kyle Christopher." "You didn't use "John" in his name?" "LEE'S MOTHER:" "Walter." "Kyle Christopher is a beautiful name." "It's a beautiful name, but "John" has been in the Strobel line for generations." "Oh, here we go." "Because I didn't want to name my son John, okay?" "Your grandpa's John." "So is your older brother." "Mm-hmm." "It's also the euphemism for a toilet and the client of a prostitute." "LESLIE:" "Lee!" "Really?" " (Lee clears throat)" " Sorry I brought it up." "LEE:" "Don't know why you guys came anyway." "Nobody invited you." "I'm gonna get some air." "(Walter sighs)" "Leslie, it was lovely to see you." " Thanks for coming." " Thanks." "Lee, was that really necessary?" "I learned from the best of 'em, Mom." "Oh, I just wish the two of you could learn" " to understand each other." " Oh, you know what?" "I wish a lot of things." "I..." "What do you want from me?" "The guy never cared about me my whole life." "Now, suddenly, I got kids, and he wants to be best friends?" "No." "It's too late." "Honey, I'm gonna go do some work." "(sighs)" "(car engine starts)" "I'm sorry." "I know it's always hard with him." "That can never happen to us." "LEE:" "Ray, I'm telling you, I've checked it out." "I've interviewed a dozen historians, philosophers, archaeologists." "There's all these accounts of actual eyewitnesses which corroborate each other." "People with zero motivation to lie." "In fact, they should've lied." "Some of them ended up dying for their beliefs." "(sighs)" "I'm losing my mind, Ray." "I wake up every morning, and, um, I think to myself," ""Maybe today's the day." "Maybe... maybe today she'll come to her senses."" "And she doesn't." "You know, just gets worse." "Thing of it is, she's different." "She's actually different." "You know, that's what scares the heck out of me." "Just miss my wife." "I wish that I could be of more help to you, Lee." "But just remember..." "Leslie knows full well that you don't approve of all this, but she is still your wife." "And you love her very much." "Just make sure she knows that, too." "(footsteps approaching)" "You're up early." "Mm-hmm." "Just"" "enjoying the quiet." "Baby's still sleeping." "You Okay?" "Yeah." "Just... feeling grateful." "For you." "For us." "Yeah." "Me, too." "What would you say if we... went out tonight?" "Grabbed some dinner." "Maybe, uh..." "maybe a little dancing." "But just you and me." "No kids." "That be crazy?" "Uh..." " Little bit?" " Yeah." "(chuckling):" "A little bit." "Let's do it." " Yeah?" " Mm-hmm." "I want to take care of us." "You and only you." "Yeah." "JUDGE:" "Mr. Hicks, do you understand the felony charges that have been filed against you?" "HICKS:" "Yes, sir." "JUDGE:" "How do you plead?" "HICKS:" "Guilty, sir." "(gallery gasping, murmuring)" "JUDGE:" "This is not the first time" "I've seen you in my courtroom, son." "I know you thought you'd be walking away today with a slap on the wrist, but with recent information that's come out in the press, well, today you're gonna get some hard time." "At my discretion, I'm sentencing you to a minimum of 15 years" " at the Joliet State Prison." " (applause)" " Bailiff, take him away." " (gavel slams)" "LEE:" "Mr. Hicks." "Guilty, huh?" "We're all guilty of something, reporter, but I ain't guilty of this." "Okay, so then why not maintain your innocence?" "Why cop a plea?" "Your story didn't give me no choice, did it?" "Did your story give me a choice?" "Yes, the courtroom was filled with police officers all awaiting the verdict..." "LEE:" "Excuse me." "(phone rings)" " Dubois." " LEE:" "He pled out, chief." "15 years." "I guess your theory panned out, huh?" " Yeah." "Yeah, I wouldn't want to be Hicks, though." "The guy's now a cop shooter and a gang informant." "That's gonna be one tough stretch." " Yep." " Ten grafs for page one." "Yeah." "Heading back to you." "All right." "(playing soft tune)" "You know what I was just thinking?" "Hmm?" "I miss you." "I'm right here." "Yeah?" "I wish I could make it more understandable, what I'm going through." "I feel like I'm on this journey to the most amazing place" "I've ever been, and I can't take you." " I..." "I-I can't even..." " (Lee sighs)" "I don't know how to tell you about it." "I'm sorry." "(engine shuts off)" "Look, Les, I..." "I understand... that all this feels good right now." "I mean, I went to church." "I-l... heard the music." "I get that you want this to be true." "But what if it's not?" "Wouldn't you want to know that before you've dedicated your entire life to it?" "Of course." "But what if it is?" "What if it is true?" "Wouldn't you want to know that?" "There's a verse that says..." "(sighs) faith is the evidence of things we can't actually see." "You believe what you can see and touch and feel, and I feel this." " I can see it." "I-I know it." " Les..." "You-you can't." "But I..." "I do." "It's the same way I know I love you." "Yeah, but that's..." "that's different, Les." "I'm real." "I'm-I'm..." "l-I'm a person." "We-we have a relationship." "Hon, I know we've been fighting and... it's been weird lately, but..." "I..." "I love you more now than I ever have." "Based on what?" ""Based on what?"" "Honestly, it's since I accepted Jesus." "My love for you has only... it's only grown and it's only deepened." "And if that's not proof of something," "I don't know what is..." "No, that's not proof of anything, Les." "That's feelings." "It's not proof." "And my feelings are a valid experience that-that..." " Les, I-I..." " They're real to me." "I-I don't like... this version of us." "I don't..." "I don't like what you're becoming." "And if I'm looking ahead and we're still having this conversation five years from now... we're having this conversation two years from now..." "I don't want to be there for that." "Okay?" "I won't be." "I'm gonna check on the kids." " ALFIE:" "We can sit here for a minute." " LESLIE:" "Okay." " Okay." "Thank you." "Okay." " Okay." "Alfie, I'm-I'm losing hope." "I'm losing hope for Lee." "I'm losing hope for my marriage." "Oh, come on, now." "It's gonna be okay." " It'll be all right." " No," " I don't know what to do." " All right, okay." "I know that it's scary." "I do." "Trust me." "I've been there." "But I can promise you this." "In His time and in His way," "God always keeps His promises." "And what did He promise Ezekiel?" ""I will give you a new heart." ""I will put a new spirit in you." ""I will remove from you your heart of stone and give you a heart of flesh."" "Now, that's a truth you already know." "Yeah." "But it's the same truth for Lee." "You just gotta be patient." "Okay." "Thank you." " Thank you." " Oh, come here." "You're gonna be fine." "I promise." "I promise, I'm praying for both of you." "ALFIE:" "Mm-hmm." "(indistinct chatter)" "Hey, just because they said they saw Jesus doesn't mean they actually did." " I'm sorry." "Was that for me?" " (Lee stammers)" "Maybe the eyewitnesses to the Resurrection..." "Maybe they're delusional." "You know what I mean?" "Maybe they only thought they saw Jesus." "Maybe it was, like, mind control or brainwashing." "Rod!" "You need to see a psychologist." "Oh, you think I got a screw loose?" "Yeah, well, that's another story." "But if you're talking about first-century mass psychosis, you need to talk to a psychologist." "I'm already ahead of you." "Rod!" " Hey." "I need you to find me..." " Sorry." "A good psychologist to interview." " A ps-psy..." " Psychologist." "That's right." "A guy with... with a lot of academic street cred." "Knows the human mind better than God does." "KENNY:" "No pressure, kid." "LEE:" "Don't listen to him." "ROD:" "Dr. Roberta Waters, president of the American Association of Psychoanalysts, agnostic..." "LEE:" "Ah, agnostic." "Finally." "ROD: and a leading authority on human behavior at Purdue University." "LEE:" "Indiana." "Great." "Dr. Waters." "Ah." "Hello, Mr. Strobel." "As much as I would like to help a fellow skeptic, what you're proposing is completely impossible." "But how can you say that?" "I mean, if Charles Manson can turn his followers into... murderous zombies, surely the followers of the Christ cult could be convinced of their own delusions." "Listen, hallucinations are like dreams." "They happen in individual minds." "They don't spread like the common cold." "Okay, so... a hypnotist turns a stage full of insurance salesmen into... into clucking chickens..." "Then that's... that's not really happening or...?" "No, of course it is." "The power of suggestion can be very profound." "But it's one thing to be mesmerized into making animal noises." "It's quite another for 500 people to have the same dream." "To be honest, that would be an even bigger miracle than the Resurrection itself." "And without an empty tomb, you and I, we're not even having this conversation." "If Jesus recovered from his injuries, that solves that problem." "All these people could have easily seen him, yes?" "Yes, but I'm afraid that's not a brain issue." "You need to speak to a medical doctor." "Of course." "Dr. Waters, again, thank you for your time." "You've been most gracious." "Before you go, may I ask you something?" "Sure." "It's about your father." "I'm just curious what your relationship with him is like." "(chuckles)" "Um..." "Complicated." "Let me guess." "Distant, cold, doesn't give much affirmation or express love?" "Guilty on all charges." "Why?" "I imagine, as a skeptic, you're familiar with history's great names in atheism." "Hume, Nietzsche, Sartre, Freud." "Of course, yes." "Some of my greatest heroes." "Did you know that all of them had a father who either died when they were young, abandoned them, was physically or emotionally abusive?" "In the world of therapy, it's called a father wound." "No, I..." "I was not aware of that." "But with all due respect, Dr. Waters," "I did not have a loving father, but that doesn't mean that I have a problem with those who do." "What I have a problem with is some made-up loving father." "If God was real..." "I could accept that He loves me." "I just don't believe He is." "I don't disagree." "Well, unfortunately, my wife does." "The problems that it's currently causing my marriage are very real." "Again... thank you." "LESLIE:" ""I will give you a new heart" ""and put a new spirit in you." ""I will remove from you your heart of stone and give you a heart of flesh."" ""I will give you a new heart" ""and put a new spirit in you." ""I will remove from you your heart of stone and give you a heart of flesh."" "[♪♪]" "LEE (muttering):" "Oh, interview..." "Alexander Metherell." "(clicks tongue)" "Found you." "California." "Better than Wisconsin." "(clears throat) Uh, Mr. Strobel?" " Yeah?" " You have a visitor." "Hey." "Officer Koblinsky." "How you feeling?" "Eh, getting there." "Good." "Thanks, Rod." "Just wanted to come by and, uh, you know, say thanks for the story, for telling the truth." "Yeah, well, it's my job and, uh, in this case, my pleasure." "Yeah." "So, you got everything you need on Hicks?" "Wrapping the story up?" "Yeah, well, that's..." "that's all done." "Uh, you don't have to worry about him shooting anyone" " for another, uh, 15 years." "Ooh." "Uh, still have bullet fragments in my spleen." " Ah, right, I forgot." " Yeah." "Price for doing my job, I guess, huh?" "Right." " Thanks again, Strobel." " Yeah." "Feel better." "[♪♪]" "(muttering quietly)" "[♪♪]" "Not sure why you want to do this now." "Hicks has already been sentenced." "Just humor me, Marlow." "LEE:" "And here's what's weird." "He's got... bullet fragments in his spleen, but the entry wound is up here." "It's-it's as if..." "it's as if the weapon barrel was pointing inside the breast pocket." "Yeah, you can see the powder burns right there." "Now, a couple years back," "I was doing research on concealed weapons." "People disguising firearms as cigarette lighters, belt buckles." "That's a pen." "It's a writing utensil." "LEE:" "ls it?" "What is that?" "Spent shell casing." "That, Mr. Marlow, is a gun." "That is a... a .22-caliber pen gun." "Look at that right there." "That's what shot Koblinsky." "This is illegal, for any cop to carry a weapon like this while on duty." "How could nobody have seen this?" "'Cause nobody was looking for it." "Koblinsky had a secret." "He played the victim card, and I bought it." "Well, so did the cops." "Unbelievable." "He's actually innocent." "He was wrongfully prosecuted, is what he is." "You gotta get back to that judge." "You gotta get Hicks out of lockup." "Can you get this stuff in..." "I got it." "I got it." "Just, you go." "DUBOIS:" "How could you miss this?" "!" "LEE:" "Koblinsky played me." "No." "You let yourself get played, Mr. Best Seller." "And you put the integrity of this paper at risk, not to mention putting an innocent man in harm's way." "Whatever's been distracting you lately, it got in the way of your reporting." "Now, go write me a retraction." "I gotta call downstairs and have them hold the presses so we can remake A-1." "Yes, sir." "After this, um..." "I'd like to take a few personal days, if I could." "Take more than that." "DUBOIS:" "Get me Production." "PREACHER:" "Leslie Strobel, today is very much like a wedding ceremony." "By taking the step of baptism, you are publicly proclaiming that you are a follower of Jesus." "Do you believe He is your Savior and died for your sins?" "I do." "PREACHER:" "And is it your desire to make that belief public b)' being baptized?" "Yes." "Yes, it is." "PREACHER:" "Then... it is my privilege to baptize you in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit." "[♪♪]" "(car engine revving)" "(tires screech)" "(engine shuts off)" "Thank God." "Where were you?" "I was just out celebrating on my own." " Okay." "And then I remembered that I need to go to Los Angeles tomorrow, so I have to pack a bag." "No, no, no, no." "Los Angeles?" "No, no." "What happened today?" " You left." "You left." " Uh-huh." " What happened?" " Well, I didn't want to..." "I didn't want to interrupt the wedding festivities." "It's... that's a big deal." "Congrats." " It's a metaphor." " Uh-huh." "You know what a metaphor is, right?" "You're a smart guy, Lee, right?" " Married to Jesus." "Yep." " Hey." "Come here." "Come here." "Listen to me." "Today was important to me." "You know that." "I don't understand how you could just..." " That makes two of us, Leslie." " Lee, I'm trying here!" " I know you're trying." " I'm trying..." "Hey, listen!" "I know you're trying." " I can feel you trying, Leslie." " Can you?" "I am." "I'm trying." "I'm tr..." "Behind closed doors every day, hoping" " and praying that you can..." " Yeah." "Fix me up so I'm good enough for the Almighty." " Is that what you want?" " You need to leave." " I'm not gonna go." " You need to sleep it off." " I'm not gonna leave my own house." " Sleep it off." " Sleep it off." " No." "This is my house!" " I'm not gonna leave!" " Lee, get out!" " It's my house!" "It's my family!" " Get out!" "Daddy, stop being mean to Mommy." " Alison, what are you doing?" "Get upstairs now!" "LESLIE:" "Hey." " Keep your voice down!" " Go!" " (baby crying)" "You just go to California." "Just go." "You and only you, hon, right?" "!" "You and only you." "Until something better comes along." "[♪♪]" "LEE:" "Hi." "Daddy's sorry." "Daddy's sorry." "He didn't mean to scare you." "Hi." "[♪♪]" "(door creaks)" "(tires screech)" "[♪♪]" "LESLIE:" "Father... give Lee a new heart." "Put a new spirit in him." "Remove from him his heart of stone and give him a heart of flesh." "METHERELL:" "So, forgive me for making you travel all the way out here, but... when someone rings me up and says he wants to dispute the most significant event in human history," "I feel it's important that we do it face-to-face." " Don't you?" " Yeah, that's fine." "I, uh..." "I-| appreciate your time." "(clears throat) So, my line of attack is this:" "The reason the eyewitnesses were able to see Jesus after Golgotha is because he never died on the cross." "Because, if he doesn't die, there's no resurrection." " Yes?" " That's right." "So... so, whether or not Jesus himself or, uh... or someone else took him off of the cross early or if he fakes his own death, it doesn't matter." "It completely discounts every aspect of the Resurrection." "Right." "The swoon theory." "Yeah, well, he passed out." "He didn't die." "I'm afraid there's a long line of skeptics in front of you with that hypothesis." "Including only a billion Muslims the world over who also don't believe that Jesus died on the cross because the Koran says so." "With all due respect to Islam, the Koran was written six centuries after Christ." "I prefer my historical sources" " a bit closer to actual events, yeah?" " I understand." "But-but you concede that it's possible." "(Metherell chuckles)" "Mr. Strobel, I am a medical doctor and a scientist." "I have seen a great many strange phenomenon" " in my lifetime." " Mm-hmm." "But the swoon theory is rubbish." "(chuckles) "Rubbish."" "That's a... is that a..." "a medical opinion?" "(chuckles) Yeah." "It is, actually." "Um... swoon theorists tend to skim over the fact that Jesus was flogged prior to his crucifixion." "Do you know what happens in a Roman flogging?" "Um, yeah, the person is lashed with a whip." "No, not lashed." "Scourged and pummeled savagely." "You see, the..." "the cowhide whip is braided with metal balls and bone fragments." "The flesh on Jesus' back would've been shredded." "The very muscles and sinews themselves laid open to exposure." "The flogging itself would have left Jesus in critical condition from massive blood loss." "Which is why he collapsed under the weight of the cross that the Romans made him carry through town." "Mm-hmm." "Okay, so is it possible that Jesus survives being spiked to the cross?" "Well, yes, you could survive it, but it's child's play compared to what comes next in a crucifixion." "Slow, agonizing death by asphyxiation." "Come with me." "The stress on Jesus' chest muscles would have locked his lungs into the inhale position." "Right, so in order to let the breath out, he would have had to shove himself up using his spiked wrists and feet, scraping his shredded back against the wood of the cross." "And then sagged back down again in order to draw his next breath, which he would have had to have done over and over and over again until utter exhaustion just made it impossible." "And then, inevitably..." "He dies." "Uh, in... in theory." "But let's-let's remember, these soldiers, they're not doctors, okay?" "So maybe, uh... maybe they took him off the cross and they... they thought he was dead but, in fact, he wasn't." "No, of course they weren't medical doctors." "They were professional killers." "Right, and they were quite good at their jobs." "They had to be." "If a prisoner escaped alive, they themselves would be executed." "(sighs) Mr. Strobel, the crucifixion of Jesus is one of the best-attested events in the ancient world." "And, if you will, the final nail in the coffin in the swoon theory is this:" "When the soldiers thrust their spear between Jesus' ribs, do you know what came out?" "Blood and water." "Which we now know is a description of pericardial effusion as a result of death by asphyxiation." "This is not a condition anyone could fake." "And so, to answer your question, yes, it is my medical opinion that Jesus Christ died on that cross." "WOMAN:" "Excuse me, Doctor?" " I just need your signature." " One moment." "Yeah, but-but-but..." "I got a..." "I-I have a real problem with most of the experts that I've talked to here." " Which is?" " (sighs)" "Which is that most of them are not impartial." "And if I'm gonna take a guess," "I would say that you are not, either." "And you would be correct, sir." "Though I have learned that most impartial travelers who undertake this journey rarely remain so." "However, I can refer you to one of the most impartial sources that I know." "Would you trust the Journal of the American Medical Association?" "(chuckles)" "Of course." "It is a stellar scientific journal." "Even I will admit that." " "On the Physical Death of Jesus."" "Mm-hmm." ""Clearly, the weight of the medical and historical evidence" ""indicates that Jesus was dead before the wound" ""to his side was inflicted." ""Accordingly, interpretations based on the assumption" ""that Jesus did not die on the cross" ""appear to be at odds with modern medical knowledge."" "Doc, I gotta tell you, you're, uh... you're not telling me what I hoped to hear today." "(pager beeping)" "(phone ringing)" "Lee?" "Hey, it's me." "Everything all right?" "Kids okay?" "LESLIE:" "Sweetheart... it's your father." "MINISTER:" ""My help comes from the Lord," ""the Maker of Heaven and Earth." ""He will not let your foot slip." ""He who watches over you will not slumber." ""Indeed, He who watches over Israel" ""will neither slumber nor sleep." ""The Lord watches over you." ""The Lord is your shade at your right hand." ""The sun will not harm you by day, nor the moon by night." ""The Lord will keep you from all harm." ""He will watch over your life." ""The Lord will watch over your coming and going both now and forevermore."" "In the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit." "(quiet chatter)" "[♪♪]" "(sniffles quietly)" "(footsteps approaching)" "You Okay?" "Did you know he had this in his wallet?" "Yes." "(sniffling)" "You know, your father, he was proud of everything you ever accomplished." "Look, he didn't know how to say it very well, but he loved you, son." "(sniffles)" "He really loved you." "Okay?" "(footsteps departing)" "[♪♪]" "(crying softly)" "(sobs)" "REPORTER (over radio): 80 nations were represented..." "LEE:" "I'm going camping, and I'm bringing an apple..." " (baby crying) - a banana... and a chinchilla." "I'm going camping, and I'm gonna bring an apple..." " (Lee shushing) - a banana, uh..." " ls he okay?" " Mm-hmm." "ALISON:" "whatever you said and..." " A chinchilla." " A chinchilla..." "REPORTER: savagely beaten in a prison fight" " at Cook County Jail today." " And a donkey." "Sweetie," " hold on, hold on, hold on." " Sources inside the prison say Hicks was targeted by gang members as a result of recent news identifying him as a police informant." "It is believed that the prison guards did little to protect Hicks, a fate not uncommon for cop shooters." "Hicks was immediately taken to Mercy Hospital, where he's in serious condition." "Elsewhere in Chicago, the wind is expected to kick up this evening over the lake and continue... (radio shuts off)" "(machines whirring, beeping)" "(indistinct radio communication)" "How's... how's he doing?" "Been in and out." "Mostly out." "Mr. Hicks?" "Mr. Hicks, it's Lee Strobel." "Just wanted to say that, um... that it's my fault." "(sniffles)" "I..." "I'm..." "I missed the..." "the truth." "I'm-I'm sorry." "I just..." "I-| didn't see it." "(sniffles)" "HICKS (softly):" "You didn't want to see it." "What's that?" "You didn't want to see it." "LEE:" "I've hit a brick Wall." "I have read through every book you've given me." "I've gone through every argument." "I've followed every lead." "At some point, young man, you're going to have to plant your flag on a mountain of uncertainty, where not every question is answered." "The human mind will never get to the bottom of every mystery in the cosmos." "Believing in God, not believing in God..." "Either way, still takes a leap of faith." "So you're saying, even in our disbelief, that we still take a leap of faith." "More or less." "Me, well, I've come to my own conclusion." "You're gonna have to do the same thing for yourself." "What are you doing here?" "I thought you were banished." "(chuckles)" "Hey." "What's the matter?" "You people and your God." "You just... you know, you talk in circles." "You offer... you offer just enough evidence but never enough to be conclusive." "Then you fill in all the gaps with," ""Oh, well, yeah, you just gotta have faith."" "It's a bunch of nonsense." "You're really irritating, you know that?" "(Lee groans)" "Don't start with me, Kenny." "You don't waste a lick of time bragging to all of us how great a reporter you are." "So, why can't you put up or shut up on this story?" "What are you even talking about?" "Here's where the chili meets the cheese, my friend." "One of my heroes was C.S. Lewis, a man who began as a skeptic, much like yourself." "At the end of his journey, you know what he said?" "He said, if Christianity is false, it's of zero importance." "But if it's true, there's nothing more important in the entire universe." "So, you want your wife back?" "Well, hey, guess what, people in hell want ice water." "Not everybody gets everything they want." "(slams table)" "Stop blaming me and the Church and God, and do your job." "Stack up the evidence, follow the facts, and write the story, win or lose." "Good night." "[♪♪]" "LESLIE:" "Father, please... please soften Lee's heart." "Put a new spirit in him." "Remove from him his heart of stone, and give him a heart of flesh." "[♪♪]" "LEE:" "The only way to truth is through facts." "KENNY:" "The entire Christian faith hinges on the resurrection of Jesus." "If it didn't happen, it's a house of cards." "HABERMAS:" "No, you just have to show that Jesus died and he was seen afterwards." "LEE:" "How can we be sure of the reliability of those manuscripts?" "MARQUEZ:" "Archaeologists have recovered 5,843 Greek New Testament manuscripts." "Nothing else in history even comes close." "METHERELL:" "Would you trust the Journal" " of the American Medical Association?" " LEE:" "Yes." "METHERELL:" "Jesus Christ died on that cross." "LEE:" "You're not telling me what I hoped to hear today." "LESLIE:" "What if it is true?" "Wouldn't you want to know that?" "CRAIG:" "The first recorded account tells us that he was buried in a tomb." "The empty tomb is based on evidence." "Isn't evidence your trade?" "LESLIE:" "Faith is the evidence of things we can't actually see." "CRAIG:" "Any careful historian will see that the core account is consistent even if a... a few of the secondary details are told from different perspectives." "HABERMAS: 500 separate people saw Jesus at the same time." "WATERS:" "That would be an even bigger miracle than the Resurrection itself." "CRAIG:" "The disciples reported what actually happened." "LEE:" "People with zero motivation to lie." "CRAIG:" "Do you really want to know the truth?" "When is enough evidence enough evidence?" "LESLIE:" "I felt something that is maybe more real than anything I've ever felt in my life." "METHERELL:" "This is not a condition anyone could fake." "RAY:" "Still takes a leap of faith." "LEE:" "But why would he do it?" "MARQUEZ:" "It's really very simple." "Love." "[♪♪]" "[♪♪]" "All right, God." "(gulps)" "You win." "(door opens)" " Hey" " Hey" "Are you okay?" "Yeah." "Yeah, I'm fine." "How's he doing?" "Good." "All right." "Come over here." "I want to talk to you for a second." "Are you..." "are you sure you're okay?" "So, I have not been, um... completely honest with you over the last few months." "That's a really scary way" " to start a conversation." " I..." "Just-just-just... hang with me here, okay?" "When you became a Christian," " I freaked out." "I mean..." " Mm-hmm." "Yeah, I was scared, um..." "And I felt like that I needed to, um... to save you." "And so I decided to set out to prove this was all a big con." "And so that's what I've been doing all this time." "Your research?" "Yeah." "I-I mean, look at this." "It's... this is all... all that stuff." "That's why I've been so distracted." "That's why I went to California." "I just had to prove this whole thing wrong." "But I couldn't." "The evidence for your faith... it's more overwhelming than I could've ever imagined." "But it wasn't just the evidence, okay?" "It was you." "You never stopped loving me." "You never gave up on me." "And I think, because of that," "God didn't, either." "(Leslie chuckles)" "Wh... (laughs)" "What?" "I mean, I don't..." "I don't think God gave up on you, either, but what... (laughing):" "what are you saying?" "(chuckling):" "Uh..." "I can't even fathom that I'm gonna say these words out loud." "I believe." "Oh, hey, hey." "Okay." "Let me show you something." "Show you..." "(sniffles)" ""But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God."" "LEE:" "Mm-hmm." ""To those who believe in His name."" "And what does that mean?" "(chuckles) That... means..." "Believe... plus receive... equals become." "(inhales deeply) Okay." "Um..." "So, then, how do I..." "how do I receive?" "What do I..." "What's-what's the protocol for, uh... for that?" "There's no wrong way or right way." "Just... you." " You talk to God." " Mm-hmm." "You tell Him your heart." "Mm-hmm." "A-And we do that right now?" "I mean, shouldn't we go to church or...?" " Mm-mm." "Mm-mm." " (Lee chuckling)" "Right here, right now." " This is church." " Okay." "Come here." "(sighs heavily)" "(sniffles)" "God, um..." "Mm..." "I have no idea what I'm doing." "(chuckles softly)" "But I cannot ignore the evidence." "And I don't know everything." "Uh, I-| never will know everything." "Um, but I..." "I know enough." "And I believe it." "And I'm sorry for what I've... what I've put my wife through, um, for what I put my family through, uh..." "But I believe You're real, and I don't know what comes next." "I don't know..." "I don't know what it means." "I just know that I want..." "I want that." "I want..." "I want whatever's next." "Um..." "So let's do that." "Amen." "(sniffles)" "Amen." "LESLIE:" "Thank you." "(sniffles)" "I guess I'm crazy, too." "(chuckles)" "Pitching him today." "Don't blow it." "Watch this." "(knock at door)" "I got a pitch for you." "(Dubois grunts)" "Well, that didn't last long." "Piece of junk." "You hear about Hicks?" "Released from the hospital." "No longer a resident of Crook County Jail." "I did." "That's great news." "Mm." "(rustling)" "(chuckles)" "Come on, this is a joke, right?" "No." "No, it's not." "I-I-I-I want to do a first-person feature story, okay?" "An odyssey." "Uh, one man's journey from skepticism to faith." "Forget it, Lee." "(laughing):" "I mean... good for you, I guess, but... we can't publish something like this." "We'd lose all credibility." "So would you." "I really wish that you would reconsider." "Stick to what you know, Lee." "Go on, now." "Get out of here." "Not until you've at least heard me out." " ALISON:" "Hi, Daddy." " LEE:" "Hey, you." "How are you?" "ALISON:" "Good." " LESLIE:" "Hi." " LEE:" "Hi." " 30?" " (Lee sighs)" "Dubois said no." " He did?" " Yeah." " LESLIE:" "Oh, no." "Sorry, hon." " ALISON:" "I did it!" "I did it!" "LEE:" "What did you did?" "ALISON:" "I can finally reach the faucet." " LEE:" "Oh, my Lord." " ALISON:" "I'm tall enough now." "LEE:" "Look at you!" "You're a big girl now." "Oh, no, you need to stop that." "That means you're growing up." "You're not our little girl anymore." "It's not that big of a deal, Daddy." "I think it's a big deal." "Hey, how 'bout a book?" "A What?" "Instead of an article, how 'bout a book?" "LEE:" "What do you think about that?" " ALISON:" "Yeah!" "Definitely!" " LEE:" "Yeah?" "(Lee chuckles)" "[♪♪]" "[♪♪]" "(ding)" "(ding)" "[♪♪]" "[♪♪]" "♪ 'Cause I have seen ♪" "♪ Heaven's door is open to me ♪" "♪ And I have shook to the bones ♪" "♪ And I've seen your face ♪" "♪ As I lay on the floor ♪" "♪ And I have cried ♪" "♪ And I have sought ♪" "♪ Like a beggar in my soul ♪" "♪ Like a beggar in the world ♪" "♪ Just to find you, Lord ♪" "♪ 'Cause, Lord, I believe ♪" "♪ Help me believe ♪" "♪ Lord, I can see ♪" "♪ But I still can't see clearly ♪" "♪ Lord, I believe ♪" "♪ Would you help me believe ♪" "♪ 'Cause I want it so bad ♪" "♪ 'Cause I want it so bad... ♪" "♪ 'Cause I want it so bad ♪" "♪ Like a beggar in my soul ♪" "♪ Like a beggar in the world ♪" "♪ Just to find you, Lord ♪" "♪ 'Cause, Lord, I believe ♪" "♪ Help me believe ♪" "♪ Lord, I can see ♪" "♪ But I still can't see clearly ♪" "♪ Lord, I believe ♪" "♪ Would you help me believe ♪" "♪ 'Cause I want it so bad ♪" "♪ Yeah, ah ♪" "♪ Oh, oh ♪" "♪ Yeah, ah ♪" "♪ Oh, oh, oh, oh ♪" "♪ Yeah, ah ♪" "♪ Oh, oh ♪" "♪ 'Cause I want it so bad ♪" "♪ 'Cause I want it so bad... ♪" "♪ 'Cause I want it so bad ♪" "♪ Like a beggar in my soul ♪" "♪ Like a beggar in the world ♪" "♪ Just to find you, Lord. ♪" "(song ends)" "[♪♪]" "[♪♪]" "[♪♪]"