""Atragon" is a work that was presented on December, 1963." "We have invited a person who took part as assistant director for Atragon and many other Toho's special effects works, Mr. Koji Kajita." " Mr. Kajita, thank you for being here." " A pleasure." "For "Atragon", did you participate in this work by Director Honda requesting you to be the assistant director?" "Yes, um..." "September of 1963." "Before the shooting started Mr. Honda asked me to be the chief assistant director and gave me the script." "The script was written by Shinichi Sekizawa, and after reading it we advanced our talks for this production which assigned Tsuburaya for special effects, and the story to Mr. Honda immediately forming the main staff adding a producer, Tomoyuki Tanaka for casting." "As you know, the role of the chief assistant director coordinates between the drama component and Mr. Tsuburaya's sfx component and had to know both schedules at all times." "During the main shooting, Mr. Tsuburaya has to be present and while Mr. Tsuburaya's shooting, Mr. Honda has to be present." "And so, you had to have a continuous grasp in both schedules." "That was the main job for an assistant director." "Both the main and the special effects productions went on at the same time..." "Did Honda director and Tsuburaya director, um show up in each other's sets often?" "Yes, both were discussed at the same time on storyboards saying, "Today, let me be present", or, "You don't have to be there today"." "Things like these were pre-arranged." "There were times when Tsuburaya was shooting without Mr. Honda presiding." "And there were times when Tsuburaya was at the main shooting sites and times when he didn't need to come and the shooting went on without him." "For you, Mr. Kajita, you had to constantly know what both schedules are as well as what was going on at each production sites." "Yes, it was always in my mind while this work was progressing." "We tend to call you assistant director, but for your case you are often credited as director's assistant." "Is it correct to think of them as the same thing?" "A director's assistant is, like I said before responsible for knowing both sides of the schedule." "And there are a second and a third director's assistants." "The second is in charge of the drama's costumes and props." "And the third, who's known as the assistant director writes out the itineraries everyday, and other miscellaneous jobs." "And running to get the actors were the third, assistant director's job as well." "So what we call chief assistant director today was credited as director's assistant." "Yes, correct." "You have been working as Mr. Honda's director's assistant since Godzilla." "In 1963, there were "Attack Squadron","Siege of Fort Bismarck" and "Matango"." ""Atragon" was your fourth work that year." "Right, in between those, there were "The Mysterians", "The Human Vapor", "Gorath" "King Kong vs. Godzilla" and "Matango"." "I was the chief assistant director for all these special effects." "For Honda director, you were a familiar face." "Yes... we've been at it together for a long time." "And with these films, what Mr. Honda and Mr. Tsuburaya always talked about was the fact that special effects are just one of the filming techniques." "So if it's effective in the work, it will tie into the success." "But the work isn't for the special effects." "The main drama of the work is always the center feature." "I hear that they always talked about this." "The thing called special effects or, for instance, kaiju (monsters) or, in the case of "Atragon", this mechanical thing will attract attention but these aren't the main attractions, so to speak, but there exists the drama and the special effects should support the main story." "Yes, correct." "Both Mr. Tsuburaya and Mr. Honda were in complete agreement while making these works." "In order for the main story and the special effects to coincide one must have had close contact with the other." "Mr. Kajita, that was your job, to be the go-between." "Right." "In order to shoot something, you've got to have storyboards." "It is necessary to have good storyboards during the preliminary meetings." "If we don't know when and where the cuts will be, we can't start shooting." "Both Mr. Tsuburaya and Mr. Honda were constantly discussing the storyboard." "If there were changes, you'd tell..." "I'd tell "There will be this sort of change in this scene." "Is that ok?" to the other." "And then Mr. Tsuburaya might think to take a look at the scene or there are times when he just okays it." "The resulting action was case-by-case." "Even in those cases, you had an important job." "Right, like a so-called coordinator." "That was the chief assistant director's job." "In the previous scene, a taxi is pulled from the water..." "That scene just ended, but where was the location?" "I think it was shot around the Tokyo bay." "Almost all of these scenes were shot on location." "Mr. Kajita, you are a familiar name in Toho's special effects series." "This film's main character, Tadao Takashima, and Yu Fujiki's double act they're also in "King Kong vs. Godzilla"." "I'm sure they were one of 'the usual gang' on the set." "Yes, they complimented each other so well." "I could watch them at ease, when they worked together." "And it was entertaining to the point where Mr. Honda bursts out laughing." "That's how good those two were in acting with each other." "Those two were veterans." "They were good." "They had such good timing in conveying their emotions." "Yes, and also, acting as the detective, Mr. Hiroshi Koizumi..." "Right." " Another regular in special effects movies." " He's an old actor, another veteran." "Come to think of it, we have a gorgeous cast." "Movies played during the New Year's holidays demand luxurious cast members." ""Atragon" was presented December of '63 and so it was for the New Year's of '64." "Right, we intended for it to be a New Year's movie." "Even on the set, because it was a New Year's movie, did everyone know it would be with a gorgeous cast?" "Yes, our intentions were announced from the beginning and we advertised it as such." "So people knew this was going to be a New Year's movie." "That's Mr. Ken Uehara." "Yes, Mr. Uehara appeared as well, widening the actors adding another layer making this worthy of being a New Year's movie with a gorgeous cast." "It should be a joy to watch." "This was Toho's golden age." "It was a good movie." "Fun." "This is something that I've heard..." "Manda, the dragon appears..." "Because 1964 was the year of the dragon, the kaiju took the form of a dragon." "I did hear that sort of discussion." "I've been told that they were debating what Manda should be and it became a dragon, associating with the year of the dragon." "Is that, for instance, the director..." "Did Mr. Honda and Mr. Tsuburaya makes these decisions?" "Yes, they were talking about the next year being the year of the dragon." " Oh, really." " Yes." "In this work, Mr. Kenji Sahara appears as the bad guy." "This is such a good character which supports the drama." "It's what one calls a Mu spy." "It's a great character." "Number one." "Mr. Sahara can handle any characters." "A good actor." "Normally, he has an image of a nice young man, having a lot of heroic roles." "He has vast capabilities." "He is also very funny." "I'll be with him for all the Ultra-Q movies later on." "For an actor, being the bad guy must be interesting, changing gears." "Yes, the movie made a year prior..." "Oh, it's the same year." "In "Matango", Mr. Honda used Mr. Sahara in another great role." "And I think this is the continuation of him with a unique character." "Was this intended for Mr. Sahara to widen his character images?" "Maybe there was." " And the heroine is Ms. Yoko Fujiyama." " Yes." "She's cute, and she was a good actress of that time." "She always tried her best." "Ms. Fujiyama was a lovely, good actress." "Yes." "As for the actors, Mr. Yoshifumi Tajima appears later on." "Yes, Mr. Tajima was one of the Honda regulars." "An actor who often works with Mr. Honda." "He appeared with a good role as well." "He really does many roles." "Yes, he does." "And around this time, I guess it's not only for the Honda group..." "Everybody who was acting for Toho films appeared in many movies, but among the special effects movies, the Honda group, with Mr. Tsuburaya's effects..." "I'm guessing they had a sense of comradery." "Yes, Mr. Honda always mentioned it." "The actors must grasp the concept of special effects and understand the core of these movies or else they will take it lightly and make fun of it." "A movie can't be made if the actors think that way." "So the actors have to take interest in special effects movies and understand how fun it is." "That's the first condition." "Of course, when the actors take part, we expect them to do their best but they need to understand these conditions for special effects movies." "Mr. Honda was most concerned about this." "Well, there's a sort of fairy tale, or science fiction fantasy quality to these films so the actors need to know and understand these qualities as well." "And they need to take interest in these fields." "Thinking in those terms, Honda thought very carefully and casted these actors." "For the first-timers, they'll think this is a children's movie or for show..." "those kinds of misunderstandings." "Here, it's Mr. Akihiko Hirata's big moment." "Mr. Hirata himself enjoys appearing in these kind of movies." "He has appeared since the first Godzilla movie." "He understands special effects movies." "He knows a lot, and is the type of person who calculated how he should act." "I think he is a fine actor." "Do you remember back then, when Mr. Hirata was thinking about the role?" "I remember in "Godzilla", as well as "King Kong vs. Godzilla"." "And also this "Atragon"." "As actors appear in numerous special effects movies they must have felt the fun of these movies and enjoyed taking part in these special effects movies." "Yes, I think all the actors feel that way." "If they feel like they can't act with these toys special effects movies can't be made." "These special effects movies, as I mentioned before must be understood first." "The actors must imagine these scenarios." "So they must understand, as well as be a good actor." "That's how it is." "Mr. Kajita, you yourself have a lot of special effects movies under your belt." "Among all the genres of movies do you like this sort of genre for special effects movies?" "Yes, I always liked chemicals, and loved science." "So I loved integrating these into movies." "I see." "So, when "Godzilla" came about I wondered what sort of movie will it become but at the same time, I also felt maybe a part of my dream will come true." "It was fun." "Mr. Honda was also very interested in science." "For "The H-Man", "The Human Vapor", and "The Mysterians" he visited Tokyo University's laboratory or attended at lectures of professors specialized in those fields and used them in his movies." "So I participated in these movies with great interest." "As a director's assistant, were you taking part in the research for for instance, the chemical aspects of a specific scene?" "Um..." "Was it "Battle in Outer Space"..." "pardon me, it was "Gorath"." "In "Gorath", the Earth was going to collide with another planet." "The planet had to move out of orbit no matter what." "We were discussing..." "We came up with a plan to place rockets on Earth, and move the orbit." "So Mr. Honda and I took this plan to Tokyo University's Department of Science's Astro-physics laboratory calculated the possibilities for one week." "Mr. Honda really like this sort of thing." "I went with him to learn as well." "With "Atragon", there exists a Mu Continent and Mu Empire." "Concerning these, did you have talks with Mr. Sekizawa, the scriptwriter?" "When meeting with Mr. Sekizawa..." "Mr. Sekizawa himself told me this about James Churchward, a civilization researcher around 1921." "He theorizes the sinking of Mu, the continent of Mu, or the Mu Empire sunk by earthquakes and volcanoes." "And after it sunk, they took advantage of geothermal power created the sun, and aimed to recapture the control of the earth's surface." "Mr. Sekizawa took a hint of that taking Mr. Shunro Oshikawa's original work to make this script." "So there was another book written about the continent of Mu beside Mr. Oshikawa's." "Yes, I've never seen it, but Mr. Sekizawa seemed to have read it." "He took some hints from the book, and written in this script as the sunken Mu continent." "This is actually the scene of the Mu Empire." "Where they use geothermal power to create super-scientific objects." " These are some of the references he took." " Yes, that's what I've been told." "I thought, wow, there are theories like these." "And to be honest, I was surprised, but the script was well written." "It was a good script." "This Mu Empire part and Atragon the survivors of what was Japan..." "so many ideas are packed..." "Yes, you're right." "This production was during 1963, where..." "What did you think about the drama concerning Captain Jinguji when you read the script?" "It really, um, back in those days, um, how can I say it..." "Among those soldiers, they thought they must make a comeback at any cost for the sake of Japan, and fight." "I thought, maybe there were people like them." "We did discuss this during the script stage." "And we thought, this was one of the military-like ways of thinking back then." "As time went on, those military-like ways starts to get criticized." "But maybe it was okay to have it like this, for this was the one of the ways." "Is it Kusumi?" "Rear Admiral Kusumi persuades him telling him that his way of thinking is wrong." "All this is one of the ways of life of a military man at that time." "Yes, those feelings can be understood by people back then but to us, it's such an old way of thinking." "Right, I do think it's difficult to understand." "But Mr. Sekizawa does state that it is indeed an old way of thinking." "There were scenes of the Mu Empire." "That image of the Mu Empire, their cloths and the scenery..." "How did these images come about?" "We were thinking various eras and costumes for creating Mu Empire." "We took some traditional historic ideas of Fiji and Easter Island debating what kind of costumes it could be." "That's how we came up with the design." "There was a temple..." "that set was so big..." "Oh, that." "We built that in one of Toho's biggest studios and came up with creative ways to make it look big." " It looks like it has depth, right?" " Yes." "That is a big studio... the 8th Stage and the 9th Stage are big." "To make it have depth, we used creative techniques to accomplish that." "For instance, what kind of technique?" "Um, like using wide lenses, or for depth perception, changing the set alignments." "We used pretty complicated techniques." "Um, watching those scenes before, there were people way in the back." "You'll see it later, but the factory of the Mu... it looks incredibly wide and big." "We used that set in a way that made it look big." "That was well done." "And also, the number of people in that temple was amazing." "Yes." "We used extras to increase the number of people." " Didn't it look like a luxurious stage?" " Yes." "Those who were dancing..." "were they dancers?" "We gathered dance teams from all over as well as dance students." "Oh, I see." "Did you use Nichigeki Dancing Team?" "No, we didn't use Nichigeki Dancing Team." "Really." "I think we used dance students most of the time." "I see." "Here, the high-tech American submarine gets destroyed by the Mu Empire." "Yes." "These actors were foreigners that were living in Japan for various reasons." "So they aren't real actors." "So they weren't professional actors?" "Right, but they did act very well." "Special effects movies and kaiju movies use foreign actors often." "But we're able to watch it without any trouble... smoothly..." "Yes." "There was an American actor who came back from the US, named Henry Okawa." "He was on the set, translating everything." "He also instructed them." "So, he was in between the director and the actors." "Piecing the two together." "And he was an actor in Hollywood, so he knew how things went." "Like the way they need to move." " So things went smoothly on location." " Yes." "His existence was huge." " These scenes show off the special effects." " Yes, it is done pretty well." "Were you present at these scenes as well?" "Yes, I did see all of them." "All of Mr. Tsuburaya's effects." "Oh, yes." "All of this is Mr. Honda's shootings..." "where actors are playing their roles." "The special effects here..." "the submarine's starting to get crushed." "This is Tsuburaya's." "The main scene and the effects scene are playing alternately to bring excitement." "We had Mr. Tsuburaya came and take a look at the scene, and told him that..." "We had Mr. Tsuburaya came and take a look at the scene, and told him that the scene with those actors would be inserted in-between the effects scenes." " A great collaboration..." " Yes, it's very well done." "This man is Mr. Susumu Fujita." "And Mr. Minoru Takada." "They're huge stars of Toho at that time." "They appear in many special effects movies as well." "They take part in this film as the leaders of the defense military." "Mr. Fujita, from what I see on screen, seems to have a quiet image, but..." " He is a funny and open minded person." " Oh, really." "He is just like Sanshiro Sugata." "In many special effects movies, he acts as an unrefined military man." "Yes, really, since the movie "Battle of Pearl Harbor and the Malay Coast"..." "He's just the man to play a soldier." "He did take the main role in "Colonel Kato's Falcon Squadron"." "He's such..." "the uniform suits him to a tee." "Does he have the same image on the set as on the screen?" "Yes." "He doesn't chat much?" "No, he doesn't say anything irrelevant." "The Toho actors are hard to approach, in a sense that is attractive." "It's strange to say that they are attractive and hard to approach but movie stars have dignity, and they do seem out of our reach." "And they also have charm." "Yoshifumi Tajima seems to be easy to get along with, from the movie..." "Yes, he's quite sociable." " These are all shot with a set." " Yes, they are all shot at the set." "A lot of sets have been made." "Yes..." "I think around 15..." "The number of times we had to make a set on a stage was 15." "I heard that you cranked in around September." "Yes." "How long was the actual shooting?" "Um, even with the special effects movies, the limit is about 35 days." "Limit?" "Yes." "The maximum number of days?" "Yes." "When forming the schedule for this project, we must fit them into 32-35 days." "The budget only allows for that." "Oh, I see." "So in that allotted time frame, we make our drama." "The special effects have their own time frame." "But it's almost simultaneously done." "Right, the special effects tend to start earlier." "It starts before the drama, and ends after the drama's done." "They are "in" earlier, and "up" later." "Right, it's longer, the special effects shooting duration." "For the main shooting, it's 35 days, a little over a month." "The drama part, yes." "From 32, 3 days to 35 days." "35 days being the longest." ""Godzilla" was shot in about 31 days." "It is a pretty short cycle." "Yes, I think so." "When you think about it, it's ample time, for the drama part." "Really?" "Back then, you made four special effects movies in one year..." "Yes, there were as much a four productions... but even at the most we don't shoot that much, 3 or 2 maybe." "Special effects movies take time, a lot of preparations." "This year was... 1963 had four, two war movies, "Matango", and "Atragon"." "Right, right." " Was this your busiest year?" " 1963, 64 was the peak." "Were you the director's assistant with the four productions?" "Yes, I was." "It must have been very tight." "It was pretty hard, but it's fun!" "Making a movie." "It's fun because I like doing these." "You yourself know and have seen the interesting parts of the special effects..." "Were there times when you were excited?" "Movies are... when the shooting progresses just as you imagined and you think, "wow, this has been created", you feel so blessed." "You're amazed at the final product, and you look forward to it." "All the movie people have visions, and I don't think these movies would be possible without visions." "Everybody worked, carrying their dreams." "Whether it's the lighting staff, the camera men, designers, actors, or directors." "Each one of them had their visions, and created." "Those are one of the joys." "This question pertains to a different work, but in 1966, you've worked as a director's assistant in "The War of the Gargantuas"." "And after that, you participated in the TV genre..." "Yes, after I finished making "Ultra Q" for Tsuburaya Productions I was called back to Toho." "Mr. Honda desperately wanted me to do it." "Sanda, Gaira, and Frankenstein..." " Oh, the was after "Ultra Q"." " Yes." "After "Ultra Q", he really wanted me to do it, so I temporarily went back to Toho and did my part as director's assistant." "And after that, the TV people wanted me to utilize what I did in the movies to TV." "And I was asked to use the same energy for the previous TV show, "Ultra-Q"." "I see, so, before changing to Tsuburaya Productions with "Ultra-Q" what other works did you do?" "Let's see... "Godzilla vs. Mothra" was 1964." "From February to the end of April." "I worked on it for four months." "Then, the production chief asked me if I could help Tsuburaya Productions." "And that's how I went to "Ultra Q"." "What were your feelings, changing from the movie realm to the TV realm?" " You continued working with Mr. Tsuburaya..." " Right, I did." "TV is another interesting genre." "It was a new way of living, and it interested me in taking that challenge." "So I went to the TV department." "And I tried the role of the producer." "So I put everything together, got my budget, and made it into 26 episodes." "I found it fun to do, so I was a producer in the TV realm." " That's after "Ultra Q"?" " Yes." "I moved to the TV department in 1967, and I was a producer throughout." "What works were you in charge of?" "I worked on shows on the Educational TV, what we call now TVAsahi." ""Husband, Man, Be Strong"." "This was... this was also on TVAsahi." "And, "The Man on the 37 th Floor"." "This was on NTV." "Back then, during the time when television was still new movies and TVs were competing with each other." "I've heard that there were times when the movie actors didn't work in TV." "Right." "In Toho ordered by Mr. Morizawa, he didn't let the actors work in TV." "It was limited." "I wanted to use Toho actors for TV, he didn't let me." "I told him that we were in the same Toho Company, but he still said no." "The guard was tight." "But I was given clearance to a few actors for TV." "But never the actors that were in the "movie star" relm." "It was disappointing." "But we thought of an alternative and made a movie for TV." "You had some difficulties, but after a while, the actors started to appear on TV." " Right." " Actors became independent." "Yes, TV was starting to influence the movie world." "The actors thought they needed to spread out from the movie genre." "Some created an independent production, and some moved to another production." "Slowly but surely the actors for movies started to take action." "At the same time, TV used more and more actors." "And those in the movie genre thought to take part in that." "The actors themselves became aware of the situation." "That's how our current situation came to be." "And also, the TV world itself created new actors from commercials so called TV actors." "For you, Mr. Kajita, you were in the midst of the golden age for movies and the moment when TV started to grow." "Yes." "I was able to spend the best career moments during the peak of the movie era." "It was really the golden age for movies." "It's a faulty expression to say "anything goes", but we could specify the type and budget of the movie, and make it happen." "But with TV, you weren't able to make anything if you went over the limits." "And then, eventually, the movie world started to have restrictions too." "However, those days, the '50s and '60s, we could spend any amount of money." "Any memories where you thought, "how luxurious this is"?" "Yes, the locations." "What you want the most in movies is to film it on location." "But, as things got tougher, we couldn't go to places, and were asked to film them on sets." "But, the image quality is so much better if it's filmed on location than on set." "And for the actors, it's weird to say that their performance wasn't the same but it was different." " Their enthusiasm..." "They feel at ease, and for the actors, the setting is crucial." "Acting on the set versus actual places makes a huge difference in their performance." "In the movie, this is the place where Atragon is being built." "Did you go to a location?" " This was... a set, yes." " This jungle part was a set." "We used a set to film this part, the jungle." " Before, where the jeep was... here..." " This is on location." "It's Ohshima island." "Ohshima." "When you connect the set and the location scenes correctly, it looks like this." " Um, here..." " In Ohshima..." "The scene where the Mu men emerge from the crater..." "Yes, that was in Ohshima as well." "All of these is Ohshima, too." "Mr. Honda and I... we used Ohshima when we shot "King Kong vs. Godzilla"" "We knew Ohshima so well that we decided to used Ohshima all the time." "For kaiju films, you tend to use uninhabited islands, or barren ones." "The jungle set looked real." "Yes, that was a set, but the Toho technicians can create that kind of wonderful set." "In site of Toho, toward the back there was an open air set to film this sort of jungle scene, until recently..." "There was, but it was easier to create it in the indoor set area." "For this movie, you built it in the studio..." "Yes, we built the jungle inside." "These kinds of scenes called matte painting are drawing composites..." "Yes, there are parts where they were composited." "This is a set." "Is this is an outdoor set?" " No, this was indoor, if I remember correctly." " This was inside, too?" " It looks so bright." " You can't tell, right?" "These extravagant set screams epic movie." "Art crew did indeed creat great sets." " Mr. Sahara shines in these scenes." " He's good, isn't he?" "He really makes us think it's really there." "Mr. Jun Tazaki..." "Mr. Tazaki, really does look good as the navy captain." "Just as one would expect." "What were your impressions with him on the set?" "He was a serious person." "He didn't talk when it wasn't necessary." "He was a fine person." "For me, back then..." "I remember Mr. Tazaki in a game show on TV, shouting out answers." "He was an interesting fellow." "When we have parties at Mr. Honda's place, we drink together." "He's a pleasant guy to be with." "At the director's home?" "Yes, when the project is done, all the actors and main staff get together and have a "completion party"." "Oh, really." "Mr. Takashima and others attend." " It was very pleasant." " I see." "We enjoyed those completion parties in a friendly atmosphere." "Such a stately figure." "Yes." "Did Mr. Tazaki refer to something to help create this Captain Jinguji character?" "I haven't heard anything about it..." "But being an actor of Mr. Tazaki's level, I'm sure he has researched on his own and how a navy captain acts." "That's why he wears the uniform well." "His posture is good, too." "Yes." "How did director Honda imagine this Jinguji character?" "He wanted the former soldier, the classic navy military person." "During this period after the war, there were many of these types of men in Japan who would fight until the end, no matter what the cost." "We did have that sort of imagery of a soldier." "I think Mr. Tazaki had his own, similar image." "I was born in 1964, so I know about the famous men, Mr. Yokoi and Mr. Onoda." "Were there other Japanese soldiers left at foreign places?" "Were there many other incidents like that?" "Um... as far as I know, the soldiers back then believed that they had to do everything the Emperor said." "So, many carried their discontentment inside, but they did stop the fighting." "They were strongly committed." "So, there were people like Jinguji, but this is one part of the story." "Yes." "I did hear there were these sort of people but not to the point where they resisted to the end." " These were all sets?" " Yes, they were sets." "It does have the depth." "In the Japanese Navy, a so-called commissioned officer is higher in rank and has two stripes on his hat." "And the non-commissioned officers don't have stripes, like that." "Unlike the commissioned." "For Captain Jinguji, unlike the scene we saw earlier his clothes change when he actually commands Atragon." "It is different." "The white uniform that he has..." "That is his Second Type of military uniform." "It's a type of military uniform..." "the Second Type of military uniform." "And then the ones around him are wearing the Third Type of military uniform." "They are all different, the military uniforms." "Mr. Tazaki is wearing the Second Type of military uniform." " Summer uniform." " That's... oh, I see." "So, he wore that uniform to meet with Admiral Kusumi, his former superior officer." "Yes, Mr. Ichiro Yamamoto was dressed like that as well." "And when ordering to sail, he will have his Third Type." "When leading." " What is the First Type..." " There are the First, Second and Third..." " Did he have the First Type?" " Yes, he has the First, Second, and Third." "This is the Third." "When working or fighting, you wear the Third." " This is where they start to sail Atragon." " That's right." "These are special effects." "Right, Mr. Tsuburaya filmed these." "These were miniatures." "Yes, these are all miniatures." "Isn't it made well?" "Yes, is it pretty big?" "This is a 4m 50cm long submarine." "The model." " I've heard that it was the largest of the models." " Yes." "Did Mr. Shigeru Komatsuzaki design this?" "Yes, Mr. Komatsuzaki did." "You're impressions when you saw it?" "Of course, I thought, "Man, he thinks of cool stuff"." "I thought the adults could enjoy this." "This submarine can change in five ways." "And at the tip is the hammer drill, where it drills the earth to move forward." "Hammer drill." "Underground, it runs at 20km per hour." " Five changes?" " Five types, five changes." "Also, there is air, land, on the water, and underwater." "This is underground, like I mentioned earlier." " Using the drill..." " Yes, drilling its way through." "A highly integrated, rock-crushing tank." "Will we see it in the air, land, on sea, and underwater?" "Yes, there are scenes where it flies." "That uses jets, and you'll see it on land." " There is a scene when it runs on land." " Yes, there is." "It moves on water, too." "Also, underwater, as a submarine." "Five levels of changes." "This is where Mr. Tsuburaya displays his work." "This is the exciting part!" "It is portrayed so delicately." "Yes, it is shot so well." "That was a commissioned officer, so there were two lines." "This is where the teamwork of the drama part and the effects part come in." "Yes." "Mr. Honda films the interior of the submarine." "And this scene, Mr. Tsuburaya shoots these." ""Atragon" also has a great soundtrack." "Yes, this is I think, Mr. Ifukube's music." "His music is great." "Mr. Ifukube really understands the contents of this movie." "Did Honda director relay the image to Mr. Ifukube?" "He simultaneously reads the book and see this film, and then he composes." "I see." "He does watch this film." " The music comes from the images..." " Right." "He has the contents of the book in his head." "Here, it floated out of the water." " Don't you like the music here?" " Yes, it's great." "Very dynamic music, unique to Mr. Ifukube." "Jet propulsion." "This is the fast tempo version of the theme." "Yes, it is." "Mach 2." "This is a supersonic jet." "Yes, something this size flying at supersonic speed very exciting." "In this scene, all the Atragon crew are wearing the Second Type of military uniform." "And in the forefront, the sailors..." "Yes, those are sailors, um, soldiers." "And when in assembly, you wear the Second Type of military uniform." "Yes, they're all wearing white." "This is the Second Type." "Those sailors..." "are they non-commissioned?" "They are soldiers." "Sailors." "Non- commissioned officers should be somewhere." " These are the non-commissioned officers." " Oh, I see." "In this setting, especially in the navy, do they wear those sailor uniforms?" "When in actual combat..." "They wear the Third type that we saw before." "It's a part of tradition." " They change for specific purposes." " Right." " This is the drama's core..." " Yes." "This is the most important part, the highlight scene." "Kusumi comments about the old thinking ways of Jinguji." "I'm sure director Honda poured extra energy into these scenes." "The actors are veterans, and huge stars..." "It's an acting match between these two, Mr. Uehara and Mr. Tazaki." "They understand each other's lines so well." "They both comprehend the contents." "I'm sure it was worth seeing at the set." "Yes." "That was a popular phrase "I'll devote my life to my country"" "Oh, really!" "As I watch this, that phrase will not be said by the people of today." "Right, Mr. Sekizawa used it well, "I'll devote my life to my country"" "Military men used to say it often." "You mean, even during the war, it was actually used?" "Yes." "The phrase "I'll devote my life to my country" was actually used." "In other words, you suppress yourself for the greater good." "You are such a small being, but you live for the bigger things." "That's what it means." " It hasn't been used after the war, has it?" " Right." "The phrase doesn't get used much." "But he uses the phrase..." "Right, that's how old-thinking he is, him saying that phrase." "This is the gap between the times that can't be helped." "The way Ms. Yoko Fujiyama thinks is modern." "Right." "How behind the times my father is." "There will be an exchange between Mr. Takashima." "There is also a big contrast." "There is, isn't it." "It's emphasizing it one more time with Mr. Takashima." "Right." " This is the level of father and daughter." " Right." "Then comes the third level." "Being contrasted." "Contrasted against Kusumi, against Tadao Takashima." "This is how Captain Jinguji's character is established early on." "Right." "The reason why we emphasize this much is because Jinguji changes his attitude later on." "These scenes make a point." "Because of that, Captain Jinguji becomes a hero." "Right, he changes his mind later." "That's why we provide a strong impression now, so his change will be recognizable." "And very memorable..." "Anybody who sees this movie becomes a fan of Captain Jinguji." " Such a powerful character." " Yes, you're right." "The previous scene was with Ms. Yoko Fujiyama..." "Concerning Ms. Fujiyama..." "Did you work with her in other projects, or any memories from back then?" "I think it was from "Bull of the Campus" where she was the daughter of Mr. Ken Uehara." "And Mr. Kayama helped her or something and then Mr. Ken Uehara praises him for being such a nice young man." "He praises his own son." "It was such a hit in the theater, and I wasn't even planning on this." "I wasn't expecting a comic moment there." "In the movie, he says it seriously, but the audience knows better." "The audience thought it was a little inside joke." "And she was the daughter." "Yes, I'm pretty sure it was Ms. Yoko Fujiyama." "In the "Bull of the Campus" you've written the lyrics to a song that was in that movie." "Yes, correct." "I wrote the lyrics to "A Child of a Kappa"" "And Kayama played the guitar." "It was a song where Mr. Kayama played and sang with his guitar." " You use many of your talents." " No, no." "Being the director's assistant, it was part of your job to write lyrics." "My real job was director's assistant." "All of these were on sets." "It's done very well..." "This part is special effects." "A miniature." "Nicely done." "This part is another cooperative effort between the special effects and the main drama." "It is put together in a way that is very easy to understand." "The main picture and the special effects visuals are combined in a way that even a child can understand it." " You were conscious about the children." " Yes." "It's very easy to understand what's going on." "These special effects movies..." "What kind of people did you expect to see in theaters back then?" " We thought of everybody." " Every member of the family." "Yes, with "King Kong vs. Godzilla", children and adults of all ages enjoyed it." "This is what Toho was known for." "They had such a wide target base." "Adults can enjoy watching it just as much as the children." "Right." "Now we see here, the..." " Mu Empire." " Right." "Queen of Mu Empire." " Ms. Tetsuko Kobayashi plays this role." " Yes, Ms. Tetsuko Kobayashi." "With Tetsuko Kobayashi, um..." "There was another assistant director that worked under me named Mr. Tani." "Mr. Tani?" "He was my junior in college." "While Mr. Honda and I were looking for the queen of Mu Empire he told me that he knew an actress named Tetsuko Kobayashi and wanted us to meet her." "So we wasted no time and called her up, and met with her." "She stated her lines very precisely." "We thought maybe we can use her, so we put her on the possibility list." "We met her several times and had her read some lines." "As a result, Mr. Honda decided she was the right person and so the part went to Ms. Tetsuko Kobayashi." "The decision was correct." "She is magnificent." "Her grace, as well as her commanding manner." "Very impressive." "I was very impressed in seeing what an actor is capable of." "You were calling up various actresses, trying to find the perfect person for the role." "Yes, this is such an important role, being the queen of the Mu Empire." "She can't just sit there, she needs to play her part in such a high quality." "Right." "She needs to have elegance too." "Casting somebody for this role took a lot of deliberation for Mr. Honda." "She is just as attractive as Captain Jinguji." "Yes, very fascinating actress, Ms. Kobayashi." "She's great, no matter how many times I watch it." "This is another Mu Empire scene." "You use a lot of non-Japanese people amongst the empire." "Right, we used a lot of people from foreign countries." "Such variety." "Yes, a multiethnic country." "We wanted it that way." "Because Mu was spanned from Hawaii up north, to Fiji in the south all the way to the Easter Islands." "It was a huge continent." "So it's not strange to have all these different people." " Many cultures existed in this empire." " Right." "Previously, you mentioned these dancers were not from Nichigeki." "Yes." "But for "King Kong vs. Godzilla", you used the Nichigeki dancing team." "So for this production..." "We called upon the dance schools, and students danced for us." "Any reasons why Nichigeki didn't take part in this?" "Nichigeki has its own theater." "And this was filmed during the day, and it was hard for them to do both." "So we called upon the dance students." "They did dance pretty well." "The choreographer was from Nichigeki." "The choreographer was from Nichigeki..." "If we take our time, we can get it right." "So we had a few rehearsals." "Filming this portion took a little time?" "We practiced a few times to make it like this." "Using this amount of extras is tough." "It's necessary to dress and apply make-up to them." "They had to assemble around 6:30 in the morning." "It took about 2 hours to prep them, and they were on the set at 9." "At 9, we had to start filming." "The make-up artists had their hands full." "I see." "They had to deal with the stars as well as the extras." " There were just a lot of people." " Many." " And everybody had to have make-up on." " Right." "This is Manda's first appearance." "This scene is very easy to grasp as well." "Right, we used a blue screen..." "We used special effects against the blue screen." "By showing the real Manda outside the window..." "Right." "...it's easy to understand the introduction of Manda." "From this scene, they are trying to dig out and gain access to Atragon from the exploded dock." " Are these sets?" "Such a large-scale..." " Yes, they are." "But some parts are composited as well." " The steel frame in the forefront..." " Those have been added on." "This is at the set, really looking like a cave." "The scene where you insert a matte painting in the forefront like before..." "You have to calculate where the composite will lie, and film accordingly." "Here, you are on location, at Miharayama, Ohshima." "Yes, this is Ohshima location." "This is the other side of Ohshima." "It's where the lava solidified." " Is it near the crater?" " Right, near the crater." "You added more extras." "Yes, we took a vast number of actors to this Ohshima location." "Many extras, too." "This cost us a lot." "I see." "You've asked the local people to participate as well." "Yes, they've supported us and participated." "This part only has the Toho actors." "Oh, I see." "After this, where we see a lot of people, the locals are in it." "Right, we asked the locals." "This is Mr. Tsuburaya's special effects that he's good at." "The miniatures." "Oh, from around these scenes, the locals came through for us." "We called them up to the scene, and they participated for us." "All these as well." " Yes, there are so many extras." " Yes." "But we still didn't have enough people, so assistant directors dressed up as police guiding the crowd." "Assistant directors?" "Yes, the assistant directors were dressed up as police officers." "All this where the locals as well, running to the ships." "The number of people is astounding." "Enormous amount of people." "When the scene pans, you can tell how large-scale this was." "Wow, this, too." "They all cooperated, and took part." "This was composited." "Mr. Tsuburaya's..." "Amazing." "We combined the explosion to the scene where everybody was running." "Right before the explosion, you switched it to..." "Yes... to the miniature model." "When you film mob scenes..." "I read your conversations about "Godzilla", the first Godzilla filming." "There were people who couldn't help but laugh, so you asked them to be serious." "Yes, the assistant director used to shout "Don't laugh!" "Don't laugh!" "Look angry!"" "Some people were smiling, or looked like they had no clue while running." "We had to make them look serious, shouting "This is the scary part!"" "That's how we asked the extras." "During the time when the first Godzilla was shot, people couldn't imagine the kaiju." "Right, it was tough to explain to them." "We went to Ijika in Ise to shoot "Godzilla"." "We explained to the extras, "It is as big as the Marunouchi Building"..." "But they had never seen the Marunouchi Building, so they had no clue." "We said, "It's huge, as big as those mountains!" "It can climb over them. "" "And they ended up laughing." "And of course we hadn't seen Godzilla as well at that time." "Only by models." "We only knew the size by looking at the models." "It was difficult to explain to anybody." "On the other hand, around the time of this movie, people were familiar with kaiju and special effects movies that, the extras understood what to do." "Right, and it couldn't just be the extras themselves, so we added in Toho actors." "Oh, I see." "So the actors lead them." "That's how we were successful in making it work." "I see." " Those actors became the example." " Right." "The actors told extras, "This way, this way!" and ran with them." "The actors knew, so they ran looking serious and frightened." "This is the Self-Defense Forces..." "These are all real." "It's from the stock film that Mr. Tsuburaya took a while ago." "It's from the stock film that Mr. Tsuburaya took a while ago." " A new image wasn't filmed for this movie?" " No, I don't think so." "But for other works, he must have went through a lot of trouble for the Self-Defense Forces, or the Maritime Safety Agency to cooperate." "Right." "To ask them to cooperate, was it your job?" "Yes, I asked the Defense Agency, or the Maritime Safety Agency to cooperate." "That was part of my job." "The Defense Agency didn't know what kind of movie it would be at first." "I showed the script and explained to them how we wanted them to collaborate." "They were very compliant." "But they didn't comply right away, did they?" "Um, but, back in those days, they wanted to spread their image and let the people know more about them." "And they were cooperative, the Defense Agency." " It was also for their PR." " Yes." "We let them know when their images would be used." "But what I feel bad about is that in films like "Godzilla", they always retreat." "Right." "I feel really bad about that." "If Godzilla was overcome by the Self-Defense Forces, that's one thing." "But they always retreat, which makes me feel guilty." "But they still cooperated with us." "Oh, really." "Come to think of it, they don't usually save the day, but get beat up often." "I bet the person who had to negotiate with them felt a little ashamed." "I did feel guilty." "But they said, "sure", and worked with us, when I went to the Defense Agency." "When you film with a lot of extras, like before, did you speak with the locals?" "First a person who is in charge of the actors, goes to the location and explains to extras, "It's this kind of scene and we need your participation. "" "They all comply without hesitation." "I'm sure they wanted to see the filming as well." "They helped us out." " Finally, Atragon is about to sortie." " Yes." "This is where Jinguji is certain of his decision." "Yes." "This scene is great." "Magnificent." "This is Mr. Tsuburaya's specialty." "Something that enormous flying in the air and making it look that fast..." "That's the mid-air jet propulsion." " Flying at Mach 2." " Right." "While making special effects... was there anything Mr. Tsuburaya kept in mind?" "Or anything you noticed while watching him in action?" "Mr. Tsuburaya makes detailed calculations." "He constantly calculated, thinking how it should be filmed." "And, of course, how real can it look." "These special effects all use miniature models but they make it look real by pairing it up with the drama footage." "So, Mr. Tsuburaya really comprehended the process." "I see." "The Mu Empire attacks Tokyo." "Yes." "The attacking scene." "And after this, there's also the scene that caves in." "And also the attack of Tokyo Bay." "But before getting there, there are many detailed depictions of tension." "Yes, the layering." "It's very important." "It's the building up of the action later." "Right." "Right, there, the roving planes flying about and that noise makes you tense up." " It is very detailed, and thorough." " Right." "This Tokyo mega-collapse is one of the highlights." "How did this get filmed?" "I heard one theory of the caving in process was that they pulled the set but I think they had some explosives and did it that way." "So, the set was made on top of a platform, and have something underneath to support the platform." "And we pulled out the support and collapsed the set." "I've heard that during the filming of this part, it was close to a failure." "Yes, but this part looks very well done." "Yes, it doesn't look like it failed." "They pulled it and made it look like it caves in." "After this, at the Tokyo Bay, the Mu Empire's submarines attack ships." " Was this filmed at the Large Pool?" " Yes, the at the Large Pool." "Did you see the filming of these?" "Yes, I did." "It's really well done." "It's great filming." "It's very impressive." "Where there a few cameras..." "multi-camera action?" "Yes." "Using a few cameras, and panning." "Yes." "This is Mr. Eisei Amamoto." "Yes, this is Mr. Eisei Amamoto's highlight scene." "He is also a familiar face." "Any memorable instances with Mr. Amamoto?" "I have worked with Mr. Amamoto in quite a few productions." "He is an actor with character." "He was in "The Mysterians"." "An old actor with character." "His role is that of an old man, but he wasn't really old when this was filmed." "No, he's not old." "He's fairly young." "He's been made up to look like one." "Acting as an old man at a fairly young age, but it really doesn't look forced." "True." " He was having fun?" " Sure." "I think the moment Atragon dives underwater shows off the ability of special effects." "Yes." "This is..." "This is called "Super deep nuclear power submarine"." "It supposedly goes 50 knots with a high-pressure steam engine." " 50 knots." " Yes, it's fast." " Here is Ms. Tetsuko Kobayashi's big scene." " Right." "Her acting is good." "The character is arrogant." " But at the same time she is noble." " Yes." "Her make-up makes her look mature..." "True." "But her facial features are still young." "Yes, right." " The imbalance is attractive." " Like a queen." "She is pretty short..." "Yes, not tall." "I'm sure she was beautiful on the set." "Yes." "Finding an actress that can do this..." "the right actress that fits this image..." "Yes, Ms. Kobayashi's an excellent actress." "Shortly after this, in order to change into a diving suit she takes her top off and shows her shoulders..." "Right." "A memorable moment on the set." "Yes, it was." "Her age is unknown and there exists both a young and mature image of her." "Yes, she uses her eyes well, don't you think?" "Yes." "That is impressive." "Manda appears..." "Yes, it's the Manda's appearance." "How were the special effects around here?" "Manda was probably on wires." "Yes, we used wires." "It's here, after this..." "Yes." "This costume, she's wearing a cape-like costume right now..." "The costume when she was at the throne in the temple actually has a plunging neckline." "Yes, and she was hiding it with a fan in a certain way..." "That is one aspect of acting as well, I think." "However, this is a movie even kids would love." "Right." "But adults can watch it as well and, it's done elegantly, but there are moments where adults react." "True." "It is an amusing movie." "Absolutely." "Another scene where Atragon is in action." "After this, they use the Cold Air Cannon." "Yes, the Cold Air Cannon." "It will be used extensively." "When filming, um, like, what sort of image..." "Well, when Mr. Tsuburaya was shooting the scene he said to me, "This is a new weapon that can freeze everything!"" "How do you make an image of this instant freeze cannon?" "I was watching with intense interest as well." "He deals with this very interestingly." "As a special effect, smoke was used to make the beam I'm mean, image it like the fog and then freezes their enemies." "Even in the main drama, the..." "volunteer corps?" "They carry the Cold Air Guns in their hands and moves into enemy areas." "In those cases, you try to match the beams of Atragon and the hand held ones." "Right, those are two different kind of the Cold Air Cannons." "But, in the filming the main drama, it was hard to capture things being frozen up." "Yes." "In the actual movie, a line drawing..." "The drawings were composited to image the frozen parts." "Yes, people are actually in the image, and you can't freeze them." " Right." " So we used drawings." "These parts are all models, so it can be dealt with in a variety of ways." "Right." "But, until arriving to the decision to use drawings you had many trial and errors ... there must have been all sorts of ideas." "Mr. Tsuburaya seem to have researched this extensively." "That method worked out the best..." "his method of using drawings." "Although the method was used in main drama, it was still Mr. Tsuburaya's idea?" "Yes, everything was Mr. Tsuburaya's." "Here, the special effects filming of Manda, and the actors with their underwater suits the trading off between those two..." "The undersea water texture is perfect." "Yes." "This is where Mr. Tsuburaya's special effects techniques shine through." "The actor with the underwater suits, acting as they were underwater..." "Did they have wires?" "Um, filters and water tanks were used." "The reconciliation scene of father and daughter." "During "Bull of the Campus", she was the daughter of Mr. Uehara." "During "Bull of the Campus", she was the daughter of Mr. Uehara." "Right." "And this time he is her uncle, whom he took care of." "For Ms. Yoko Fujiwara, working with Mr. Ken Uehara was her second time." "Yes." "Must have been a little easier to work." "This is sort of the face off between Captain Jinguji and Mu Empire's queen." "This is the best part." "The queen's acting was overseen by Honda director?" "Right." "The climax was calculated and executed well by Ms. Kobayashi." "This red hair creates such an impact." "In the pre production, we were discussing what kind of hair she should have." "We wanted something that stands out and creates a strong impression." "We thought red was the best." "This is the result." " It really does make a strong impression." " It does, doesn't it?" "Yes." "In the mob scene, you know where she is right away." "Yes, you can." "Among the special effects, using water is difficult." "Yes, it is difficult." "You film in a pool or use filters..." "There are many different ways of shooting it." "This was filmed in a pool." "Yes." "Atragon's fighting scenes are mostly underwater." "Right." "Mr. Tsuburaya took the challenge to do it which shows his eagerness and determination." "Doing it in the pool creates a realistic experience." "Filtering the images creates not just realistic experiences, but you feel the weight." "There is water pressure, and the images show the depth and weight." "I see." "The overall feel of it, I guess you can say the feel." "You used the filtered image and the pool image together." "Yes." "This is the special effects part where things freeze." "This is the best part for Mr. Tsuburaya." "Around here, where the Cold Air Cannon freezes the dragon." "This was dealt with really well." "Um, having a kaiju named Manda appear in this film..." "The main story is about Atragon and its enemy is the Mu Empire." "Is a kaiju an extra something for the viewers?" "Yes, right." "We threw in something the kids would love." "Yes, it being a New Year's movie." "This makes it even more large-scale." " At last, it goes underground." " Yes." " It becomes a rock-drilling submarine." " Right." "It uses a hammer drill." "This, from the end..." "It's great that the rocks excrete from there." "This is Mr. Tsuburaya's idea." " The realism of the mechanics." " The realism is great." "A machine that has drills and digs underground, exists in for instance, the Ultraman series..." "And with foreign movies, the Jet Mole in "Thunderbirds"..." " This preceded all of those." " Right." "This is all miniature models." "This is a composite, with a blue screen." "The people running away with the blue screen and then we combined it into one." "This is the main shooting." " They have their Cold Air Gun in their hands." " Yes." "Another great part where the special effects and the main drama are matched well." "The set at the power plant, not as detailed as the set for main drama but as a miniature, it is made really well." " Yes." "These are the Cold Air Guns that we mentioned." "They freeze their enemies." "Yes." " A matte painting is inserted." " Right." "The sound is also shocking." "This "freezing sound"..." "These are sound effects." "Mr. Minawa created sound effects and came up with this." " Mr. Minawa?" " Yes, Mr. Minawa." "There was a sound effects technician named Minawa." "A lot of thought went into making the freezing sound." "I heard that they miked a cymbal and ran it backwards." "I've heard that too." "All sorts of images." "Yes." "These are composites of the miniature set and the original shoot." "We filmed the people running first, and then composited it." "They're setting up the bombs." "Right." " Such a big image." " Doesn't it look enormous?" "Atragon in the back..." "It was made." "Miniature..." "Yes." "These scenes, too, special effects and the main drama footage are blended in a same frame." "Yes, very well done." "Yes, very well done." "This is the part where it continues on to Atragon's last scene." "Yes, the last big scene." "I want to ask you ahead of time..." "What was the reaction of the viewers when this was done and released?" "When this was done, and I saw it in theaters." "Everybody cheered when they were supposed to and were amazed at the right scenes." "We saw this as well, and realized what a great special effects movie it became." "I was very relived." "When the filming was done, I'm sure the staff members had a screening." "What did you think about the workmanship, or the result?" "We worked so hard, and seeing how effective it was." "I was just really impressive." "It is a fun movie, and as an adult fairytale, nothing is as thrilling as this one." "The original story by Mr. Shunro Oshikawa and the scriptwriting by Mr. Sekizawa ... it's an entertainment master piece." " A compilation." " Yes." "This impressive, very memorable last scene." " The massive explosion from under water." " Yes." "The method of filming..." "back then, was it difficult to film it?" "It was really difficult to blend in the special effects scene to the main shooting." "I'm glad this was successful." "How did you film the fire that comes out of the water?" "This, um..." "We dropped some watercolors in a tank, and set the camera upside down." "And we shot it." "Oh, you filled the tank with water, added some water colors..." "Right, we turned the camera upside down, and filmed it." "When you look at it correctly, it surprisingly looks like and explosion." "This type of filming hasn't been done before." "Right." "It was planned for this last scene only." "Oh, this scene." "Mr. Tsuburaya's excellent filming..." "He is so talented." "This part, the submarine itself is turned over." "It's underwater." "Right." "The ending, with the drama as well, is the climax." "The last climax." "This scene, even while shooting, was dramatic." " Yes." " I'm sure it was memorable." "Such a heroic scene." "You mentioned earlier that the special effects and the main film were blended in a way that was easy to understand." "And for Honda director and Tsuburaya director it was a compilation of what they have done before." "Yes." "I did say this before but the main film and the special effects connecting each other so that the children can understand easily and visually." "That's the special effect movie's mission." "In that sense, this movie is very well done." "Plus the adults enjoy watching this as well." "We have invited Mr. Koji Kajita." " Mr. Kajita, thank you so much." " Thank you."