"Hey!" "Over here!" "Please!" "911, what is the address of your emergency?" "Waukesha County, I'm gonna transfer over a caller on Big Bend." "That's a dead end just south of Rivera." "Okay." "He came upon a 12-year-old female." "She appears to have been stabbed." "She appears to be what?" " Stabbed." " Stabbed?" "Correct." "On Saturday, May 31st, 2014, at approximately 9:50 a.m., the Waukesha Police Department was notified by a concerned citizen that a 12-year-old girl was stabbed in the area of Big Bend Road in the city of Waukesha." "The stabbing brought a huge police presence to the area, a major search by ground and air looking for two other girls." "Anissa Weier and Morgan Geyser are accused of stabbing their friend and leaving her for dead." "Weier and Geyser lured Payton into the woods" "Police say that's when Geyser, holding the knife, was told by Weier, "Go ballistic, go crazy."" "And what happened?" "Payton said, "Then she started."" "Geyser began to stab the 12-year-old, as she screamed, 19 times with a five-inch blade." "In the arms, legs, and torso." "One of the knife wounds missed a major artery near her heart by just a millimeter." "Payton somehow survived." "She crawled out of those woods." "A bicyclist found her on the sidewalk, covered in blood and begging for help." "When asked who attacked her, she said, "My best friend."" "Police say the suspects were inspired by a character on a website called Creepypasta, a site filled with scary stories." "Now, the story they followed was about a character called Slenderman." "A tall, fictional boogeyman featured on Internet blogs." "Slenderman, a faceless ghoul many parents have likely never heard of." "If you don't know who Slenderman is... well, we didn't either, but plenty of young kids do." "If you don't know who Slenderman is, you live under a rock." "Who's that?" "Run!" "Run!" "Run!" "Oh my god, run!" "No, run!" " Oh my god!" " Oh my god!" "Anissa Weier and Morgan Geyser were found walking near the interstate." "They later told police they planned to walk to Slenderman's mansion." "Police say it's also who the young suspects claimed they wanted to please." "Anissa felt as though she needed to prove that Slenderman existed and would be able to do that by killing somebody." "And Morgan said that her family would be in danger if they didn't." "Prosecutors have charged the girls as adults." "If convicted on the charges, each 12-year-old faces up to 65 years in prison." "Did it seem to you at any point during your interview with Morgan that she was remorseful about what she had done?" "Absolutely none." "Did she cry at all at any point during your interview of her?" "There was no emotion from her at all." "Did you, after discussing the incident itself, have any conversation with Payton about how she felt about Morgan and Anissa at this point?" "She said that Morgan should go to jail for the rest of her life... and that Anissa should go to jail too, but not as long because she was involved but she didn't stab her." "She just stood there and watched." "Hi, Morgan." "Hi, Morgan." "Morgan was a surprise." "And I didn't know how to feel about it at first... but I knew that I loved her." "Yay!" "And she changed our lives drastically and for the better." "Morgan's always been quirky, and she's always marched to the beat of her own drum." "Even from..." "from little on... she didn't care what people think about her, which I think is a wonderful trait, especially for... for a girl." "Girls are usually so... so self-conscious and concerned about... about what others think of them, and Morgan was never like that." "You know, she just..." "She always just did her own thing, and if people didn't like it, well, that was their problem." "Kitties and puppies aren't wild animals." " No, that's right." " They're not." "They're pets." "I had a camera in her face for a good portion of her childhood, so I think she got sick of it sometimes." "She got a real miniature baby grand piano for Christmas one year." "And she would sit there for quite a long time, just making up sweet little songs." "And we tried to capture as many of them as we could on video, but usually as soon as she realized that we were paying attention or recording her, she would stop." "They'll stay stray forever" "One thing about Morgan that always struck us... as a little..." "odd was that she..." "She didn't react the way that you would expect her to react... like at the movies." "Like, if something bad happened to the main character, she... she wouldn't have empathy for them." "Bambi, come here!" "Look." "New spring grass." "I remember watching "Bambi" with her for the first time." "We were so worried to watch it with her, because we thought she was gonna be so upset when... when the mother died." "Bambi, quick!" "The thicket!" "Faster!" "Faster, Bambi!" "Don't look back!" "Keep running!" "Keep running!" "But the mother died, and Morgan just said," ""Run Bambi, run!" "Get out of there, save yourself!"" "You know?" "And she wasn't sad about it." "We made it!" "We made it, Mother!" "We..." "Mother!" "And I could think of... a lot of other examples along those lines where she hasn't reacted in the way that we would expect a little girl to react." "We were aware that Morgan was interested in Slenderman." "She would show us some of the characters and some of the stories." "While I wasn't thrilled about her interest," "I didn't really see the harm in it either." "We never thought for a moment that she..." "She could possibly believe that it was real." "When I was Morgan's age, I..." "I remember biking home from the library with Stephen King's "It."" "You know, so I liked that sort of thing too when I was her age, and I think most kids her age do like scary stories and horror movies and... scary stories on the Internet, you know?" "So, that's all that we... that's all that we thought that it was." "I just can't imagine her..." "I can't imagine her coming up with that plan on her own." "My bonnie..." "My bonnie lies over the ocean" "My bonnie lies over the sea" "My bonnie lies over the ocean" "So bring back my bonnie to me" "Bring back, bring back" "Oh, bring back my bonnie to me" "Bring back!" "Bring back Back" "Oh, bring back my bonnie to me Bonnie... me" "She lost a tooth, so the tooth fairy gave her a dollar." "It was that tooth." "I was telling her..." "I was like, "A dollar?"" "I said, "I only ever got quarters from the tooth fairy."" "She was happy." "The tooth fairy gave her a dollar." "This was the last video I have." "This was at the end of her sixth grade year for school." "Hush, hush, somebody's callin' my name" "Hush!" "Somebody's callin' my name" "Hush, hush, somebody's callin' my name" "Oh my Lord, oh my Lord, what should I do?" "Yes, this is Anissa's very pink bedroom." "At the time that we painted this, pink was the thing." "Anissa's his person." "Tiger is Anissa's cat." "After Anissa left... he would come up here and he'd spend a lot of time just walking around, nosing around, looking for Anissa." "You know, nobody uses... the bed while she's gone." "I don't know, maybe the cat does, but..." "I guess it just made more sense to take everything apart and wash it and when she comes home, it's all clean and ready to go." "It's just a matter of when." "She would come in here to practice choir." "She did projects that she would have to FaceTime with two or three different kids from this flight academy class she was in." "'Cause I'd pop in on a regular basis." "I'd just you know, "What are you doing?"" "I see a face on the iPad." ""Okay, who are you talking to?"" "You know, "What are you guys working on?"" "And then you know, most days... you know, 7:30, "Anissa, you're done with your iPad."" "Shut it down, come downstairs, be with your family."" "And she never argued." "People have asked me if I saw any signs in my daughter and this and that." "And I'm just like, "No." "I knew what she was doing in here."" "Because when she wasn't doing her choir practice, that door was open."" "You know, all of the kids... not just Anissa, all of them... they know... there's no closed doors in this house unless you're... fresh out of the shower or getting ready for bed." "So... for people to say..." "I wasn't involved..." "Apart from sitting in the corner and watching every move she makes," "I don't know how much more involved I could've been." "My focus is Anissa... not Slenderman." "And what is your name?" "Anissa Weier." "Anissa, okay." "Okay, Just kind of... give me a look." "Give me a look." "Morgan." " How you doing?" " Fine." "Come on up." "Morgan, all right." "Hmm." "Okay." "All rise, please." "I thank you." "Please be seated." "Court will call the matter, State of Wisconsin versus Morgan E. Geyser and also State versus Anissa E. Weier." "Good morning." "The case is here today on a number of matters." "The first matter I'll address is the issue of... competency." "They're glad..." "they're..." "Uhh..." "So..." "There was a sleepover the prior night for Morgan's 12th birthday." "We knew that there was Anissa, Morgan, and a third girl that we've never met... and that they were all at Morgan's house." "Morgan and Anissa have only known each other since they started sixth grade." "They met because they..." "they rode the same bus." "We were so happy that Morgan had made a good friend so... so close, someone else in the neighborhood." "We were..." "we were so happy for her... to have someone to play with." "Uh-huh." "Okay." "My name is Bella, and I was nominated to do the Ice Bucket Challenge for ALS by..." "Morgan and Bella have known each other since kindergarten, and they've been best friends since fourth grade." " Are you guys ready?" " I guess." "Let's go." "One, two, three." "One, two, three." "Oh my god!" "Umm..." "Okay." "Umm..." "Hello, Dr. Zipes!" "I..." "I don't have..." "I... uh, wait." "Hello?" "Actually, the quality seems fine on my end." "And yeah, my Skype is just not having it today." "You... have we started now?" " Yes, yes." "When... when did we start?" "Hello." "Hello." " How are you?" " Good." "Who are you Skyping with?" "Someone..." "I'm getting interviewed for a documentary." "Okay, then... what... so let's start..." "start with the question then." "Slenderman is the modern-day boogeyman." "Because it's faceless, because it's quiet, because it doesn't speak words, it's open to a lot of interpretation and open to a lot of possibilities and to a lot of projection." "It varies from person to person as to what Slenderman actually is." "He's the creature that lives in my closet." "He's the guy in the windowless white van." "The faceless stranger who kidnaps kids." "It encapsulates, symbolically, a lot of these other kind of societal fears that we've had for ages and ages and kind of conveniently wraps them up and makes it really malleable." "Because, really, Slenderman can be whomever you want him to be." "We can empirically look back and find out where Slenderman was created." "It was created in 2009 by Eric Knudsen under the screen name "Victor Surge"" "as part of a Photoshop contest to try to create something that looked real that really wasn't." "Urban legends on the Internet has been a thing for decades." "There was already a base audience that was ready for a globalized project to kind of build a myth." "It actually began with the games that spun off from Slenderman." "It's so heavily visually oriented that it's replicable without really having to understand too much cultural context." "And from there, it spread to every available platform and medium on the web." "Tumblr..." "DeviantArt..." "YouTube... and also the 4chan's Paranormal Board." "All of these websites have a really strong affinity with fan art in general." ""Slender is coming"?" "YouTube was the international hub for non-English speakers to kind of break their way into the myth." "Creepypasta is this generic term for horror stories that gets copied then pasted because it's good." "As it spreads, people start tweaking some parts of the story or pick up where they left off." "These are stories that branched out of the main canon of Slenderman." ""Oh, should I travel through the woods,"" ""Or should I not wishing I would?"" ""For above me lurks within the trees"" ""No one could hear my deathly screams"" ""The palest man, the blackest suit"" ""Bigger than the tallest brute"" ""Six black arms will grab you up"" ""Or stalk you till you just give up"" ""He'll leave your body not to eat" "But to staple your corpse upon a tree."" ""Fear the man, the Slenderman" "For he can do what no one can."" "Slenderman kind of represents an opportunity to see where people are nervous about certain things and what excites them and what brings them together, because it changes." "It changes based on who's telling the story." "Often in the adult world we forget how much it sucks to be a kid." "Slenderman can also be seen as a guardian angel." "Slenderman is the Grim Reaper but with a heart." "These pictures are not so much him showing up on the playground to snatch kids away, but to rescue them." "Stories like this can be a powerful aphrodisiac for... for somebody who is lonely or is troubled, or is trying to find their way in the world." "Slenderman has this entire community of people online who are feeding into the narrative and creating their own versions of it." "It's constantly..." "it's exponentially growing." "That's the definition of a good meme." "In human culture, if it's copied from one brain to another, that's a meme." "Hi, my name is Valerie, and I've decided to do the Ice Bucket Challenge." "I'm doing the ALS Ice Bucket Challenge." "I'm here to join the people bringing attention to Lou Gehrig's disease." "It can be an idea." "It can be a tune." "It can be a style of dancing." "Tired?" "What do you think he's doing?" " Planking." " Oh, you know?" " Yeah, I do." " Yes!" "I am from the Internet." "The Internet provides a very, very fast, efficient, universal, worldwide medium for memes to spread." "That'll never catch on." "No doubt." "There may be some memes that spread like a very rapid epidemic and then die away." "But others may have strong persistence." "People are captivated by Slenderman and wish to pass on images or to modify images of him." "This horrifying story of two girls who thought that it was their duty to Slenderman to go and kill someone." "Well, that's what I call power." "That's very substantial power, very horrific power." " Unconsciously," " Slenderman stems from a tradition that..." "that goes way, way back." "To a great extent, the Brothers Grimm collected tales that deal with what I would call universal human struggles that we continue to have today." "I think that's one of the reasons why people are responding to this tale, and they're telling their own versions, their own horror stories about what is happening in the world today." "Slenderman is a tale about a character, a strange weird character, who may feed upon children." "It made me think of a legend that Jacob and Wilhelm Grimm collected called "The Pied Piper of Hamelin."" "Many years ago a town was being devastated by rats... in the gutters..." "on the streets... in the cellars." "The Pied Piper comes out of nowhere." "And he's a very odd, strange-looking person, but he has a flute or some type of pipe that he plays." "The man said, "If you want me to get rid of the rats, you must pay me."" "So they said, "Yes, as much as you want if you can get rid of the rats."" "The Piper began blowing on the pipe." "The rats began following." "The Piper had all the rats jump into the river." "But the mayor and the councilmen cheat him." ""And the Piper said," You know," ""there are other tunes I can pipe" ""and ways that I can repay you in a way that you will never forget."" "So the Piper took his pipe to his lips again and he began piping." "The people froze, but the children followed him." "There was an opening, a sudden opening in the mountain." "And all the children headed toward this opening." "And as the last one entered, the mountain closed, and the Piper went inside as well." "Depending on the times and the person who is telling their version of "The Pied Piper,"" "he can be many different things." "So he is a very mysterious figure." "We don't know whether he's evil or good." "We don't know whether he's going to do anything to these children." "The children never return." "Nobody ever hears about them." "But the Pied Piper does live on." "Umm..." "It's almost like she was living a whole nother life inside her head that we just..." "that we just didn't know about." "It's hard with kids because... they don't necessarily know how to differentiate between fantasy and reality to begin with." "So, it's just hard to know... where... where to draw the line." "Where does that become... abnormal?" "So even though, you know, looking back, maybe there were some signs." "It's everything in retrospect." "It's been two months to the day on the calendar that she's been in Washington County Juvenile Detention Center." "The first day was rough." "You know, you get in there... you have to learn all your check-in procedures and everything." "You know, you get back there, and you don't know what to expect." "There's you, there's a pane of glass with metal bars behind it, and then..." "there's our daughter." "That's how it works." "This is the first time we are trying this." "We got him something." "He doesn't know yet." "It's a little mouse." "You can see him in there." "You ready?" "It's the circle of life, okay?" "Right, Cole?" "Yep." "It's just like "The Lion King." Yeah." "Let's see how he reacts." "It's the same color as the..." "as the bathtub." "Look, baby." "Look, baby, look." "See if he notices it." "My voice is going to take you to a very calm and peaceful place." "So this part, striking into any soft tissue in the body... the eyes, the cheeks, cut right through the blood and air vessels into the throat, get it in and out, in and out, in and out." "Meow, meow, meow!" "So with the first one, why do you think the pig passed out when the kitten was put on it?" "He's playing with it." "Dog goes woof, cat goes meow, bird goes..." "Ah!" "Why do you stick a baby in the blender feet first?" "So you can see the expression on it's face." "Shh." "I don't know if I should say, "I hope you enjoyed it,"" "but there's the circle of life for you." "Talk to you later." "Thanks for watching." "Ever since she got that iPad, she liked to spend a lot of private time up in her room and... she watched a lot of things that were... funny to her." "Nothing that was gross, or depressing, and emotionally degrading..." "She liked..." "that iPad just gave her a way kind of not to..." "to socialize with the family." "And I totally... regret the iPad." "Anissa showed me a picture once." "She was in her bedroom, and I went up to see what she was doing, and I looked." "It was a picture of this Slenderman character and Jack Skellington." "At the time, it doesn't seem to be anything inherently dangerous." "I had no inklings that I would need to research this further." "The iPads will be moving into elementary school levels this year." "So, at least, our fifth-grade son is going to be coming home with one." "His own." "So this is the yearbook from Anissa's fifth grade year." "And this is what Anissa wrote." "It says, "You're like a second dad to me."" "So that was really sweet." "It's kind of tough looking back on it, 'cause if she felt that strong, you know, just... maybe I could have done something else." "Anissa was definitely one of the biggest outliers I've had just because she had no solid connections with other 4th and 5th-graders." "Anissa would definitely cry once every couple weeks, I would want to say." "Mostly about... kids being mean to her at school." "She wouldn't be able to contain herself in front of the whole class, and sometimes she would just cry." "So other kids were aware of her... emotions, and being upset." "And there's times she would come in from lunch/recess and cry about not having friends." "I've guessed that Anissa made a connection with Morgan and was happy that they both were into Slenderman, was happy that she made a new friend, shared a connection, shared interest, and it may have spiraled out of control from there." "You couldn't set up a better system to fail" "In terms of "No one at school likes you"," ""but here's this open-ended monster who will embrace you."" "The worst time to be socially isolated is the time when your brain and body are begging for camaraderie, for kinship, which is adolescence." "It's the hardest time to be alone." "I think in the absence of social contact, the Internet can sometimes serve as a peer in a way, or a peer group." "Those two girls in a tight-knit group of eight friends," "I don't think this would've happened, because they wouldn't have only been talking to each other and they wouldn't have been relying so heavily on information from the Internet." "Bill and I separated in the summer of 2012." "It was my decision." "I asked for a divorce." "But when a situation got really bad, he was willing to still be there and stuff." "She's not allowed to see her brother or sister." "She's not allowed to see any aunts or uncles, or cousins or anything, so I wanted to have as many people as she could have as often as possible." "I try to bring her mentally out of the environment and try to bring her some sunshine in her day." "But then when I leave, I kind of feel..." "I feel happy that I was able to see her and... make her smile for a few minutes in a day." "But on the other hand, I'm still kind of sad that I'm leaving without my daughter, and..." "The drive home is sometimes heart-breaking... but..." "I know that I'll be coming up and seeing her in a couple days anyways, and I'll just repeat the performance and... and hopefully, someday, this might be my last trip and... and..." "And then she'll be home for good." "But that might be a while off." "You have a prepaid call from..." "Anissa..." "An inmate at..." "Washington County Jail." "This call will be recorded and subject to monitoring at any time." "You may begin speaking now." "Hello, Anissa." "So, how was your day?" "Yeah?" "Define "pretty good."" "Do you know who's sitting here?" " Yep, Tyler's sitting here." " Hi!" "How are you?" "I've been... pretty good despite the cold." "Hi, Ani!" "What's up?" "Anissa!" "Anissa." "We can all tell you're a little spun up." "Are you excited to be talking to everybody?" "Yeah?" "Hey, hey hey!" "Anissa!" "Dial it back a notch." "So, besides what you've already like mentioned, what's up with you?" "Okay." "Yeah." "Just don't smile too much." "One minute remaining." "All right, we've got one minute, so you have a good night." "Love you too." "All right?" "And I will see you tomorrow." "So... all right." "Thank you for using IC solutions." "Goodbye." "And there you have it." "I don't know where the whole Slenderman thing... started because Anissa never talked about anything like that." "Nobody ever talked about Slenderman." "Unless she was, like, constantly Internet surfing, she never really showed me anything that was bad... or anything scary." "She... she is easily frightened, though." "Maybe she did it because she wanted to be noticed." "Because, honestly, at her school" "I didn't know that she didn't have many friends." "She told me that she had lots of friends, lots of guys liked her, and a bunch of..." "and she was accepted, and she was having a great time at school." "But... she was constantly picked on, and she never really fit in." "She was a follower." "All rise." " Okay, thank you." " Please be seated." "I think some kids are just... big believers." "They can't help but believe everything they hear." "Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God?" " Yes, I do." " In this case were you assigned to interview the victim, Payton Leutner?" "Yes, I was." "At some point, your discussion got into the area of a birthday party that was planned for Morgan?" "Payton said that the birthday party had been planned for several weeks, and it was for May 30th, and that they had planned to go do Skateland and sleep over at Morgan's house." "They were being normal little girls." "They were running up and down the stairs, holding hands and giggling." "There was no... indication that anything was... was off or that we had anything to... to be worried about." "After Skateland, they came back to Morgan's house and they went into the basement." "And we... we woke up in the morning, and we had donuts and strawberries for breakfast, and everything was very normal." "The girls were laughing and... having a good time." "And they asked if they could go to the park, and I didn't think anything of it." "I said, "Yeah, of course you can go to the park."" "And, you know, Morgan said goodbye and told me she loved me." "After playing on the playground equipment for a while, they went into the bathroom, all three of them." "She didn't want to go to sleep, so she didn't sit there with her eyes closed, and at some point, Anissa hit the front of her head and caused the back of her head to... slam against the wall." "Basically." "And Morgan said, "I thought we agreed that you were going to do this."" "Did Payton tell you anything about what Payton was thinking about that?" "I don't think she understood what was going on." "Thank you!" " Hey, that's what I wanted." " Ooh." "It's a super-fancy touch screen one." "I want that one." "It's already charged... and there's already some books on it for you." "Wow." "Can we put it together?" "Mm-hmm." "What do you think?" "Pretty cool?" "Yeah?" "I had the conversation with Morgan... the birds and the bees conversation." "I explained about the changes that you go through during puberty, and I explained about getting your period." "And I finish, and she looks at me, and she goes," ""Mommy, I don't think I believe you."" ""That doesn't really happen."" "Thank you!" "You're welcome!" "Morgan did believe in Santa, the Tooth Fairy, and the Easter Bunny, and actually believed in Santa until she was 11." "And I guess I just thought," ""What parent tells their child that Santa's not real?" "Who's... who's in a hurry for their child to grow up?"" "There are a lot of strange things in the world that we just can't explain." "So we just make up things to try to help explain them." "To believe in something..." "I don't know, the Loch Ness Monster or the boogeyman..." "isn't... that hard to believe that people actually do believe it." "You can't say for sure that it is real or not." "And I do believe that they did believe that it was real." "What is it about certain kinds of storybooks that make kids more or less likely to believe that they're real?" "What is it about aspects of the Internet that affects whether kids think things on it are real or not real?" "I think the concept of what's real has always been pretty messy." "Technology is creating these new situations in which it's becoming even messier." "These two girls, maybe they were both strong believers, but then the fact that they were both together was creating an even stronger context for belief." "That's kind of how Santa Claus works or is perceived to work." "Sort of like "The Believers' Club."" "There's this big fear that if I stop believing I won't get the presents." "What is the benefit of being a believer?" "Feeling like you're special, you're a part of something, that you can become a part of just by believing." "That's a lot easier than a lot of other clubs, you know, especially at that age." "But all you need to do for the Slenderman club is just believe." "If there's one thing the cult of Slenderman is about, it's about making it all believable, especially by remaining unverifiable." "And that's really kind of how folk belief works." "Because you can't prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that Slenderman is fake or real." "Hey, guys, it's Shane." "So, ever since I found out about Slenderman, he's been haunting my dreams, like every single dream." "And I'm really scared, so I'm going to show you a picture..." "I'm..." "I'm just going to show you some pictures that I got of him." "There it is." "Look at this." "Look right there in the background." " Right there." " See, it's Slenderman." "That's my... that's my sister when she was young." "And then we found that in the background." "Oh, it's really scary." "Um, Bye." "Cartwheel." "Round off." "Oh my god, my stomach is killing me." "Back walkover." "Crappy back walkover." "Mine... ugh." "Mine, too." "Back walkover." "Oh my god." "Round off." "Sam, we need to do..." "Sam, we need to do this later." "Can you go a little bit longer?" "No, we'll just stop this one and then we'll... and then we'll just do another one later, 'cause my st... oh my god, I feel like I'm about to throw up right now." "All right, just hurry up and do one more." " What the fuck?" " Oh my God!" "Run!" "Run!" "Run!" "Run!" "Oh my god, run!" "No, run!" "The moment you know about him, he knows about you." "Oh my god, I'm so scared right now." "Like there's no way to summon him, but there's no way to get him to, like, stop following you around." "I remember when I was like 13, one of my birthday parties, we had this big plan me and three of my friends were all going to get together, we were going to bring our cameras and sneak out into the woods" "and try to find him with our cameras." "And I was out there for like two hours." "If I encountered him..." "I would explain myself and be like," ""I don't think you're that bad." ""Personally, I think you're kind of cool." "I wouldn't mind doing what you're doing."" "Since I had no social life back then, basically my whole life was on the Internet." "And since it was there, like, 24/7..." "I would just gradually get more and more attached to it." "And the thing that kept coming up would be Slenderman." "Back then I believed, like every fiber in my body, he was real." "All right, and the game has started." "If everybody knows that is Slenderman, then I think that's sufficient to define it as a replicator." "Genetic viruses spread from body to body." "And so... a meme that has great spreadability... deserves to be called a virus of the mind." " Ooh!" "A note." " No!" "No, I don't wanna get it." "No, you have to get it." "You have to get it." "You have to." "You get it." "Then he's gonna come." "Get it." "Okay." "Just keep walking." "Just keep walking." "Why?" "Because he's finding you!" "A virus of the mind spreads by being listened to or seen by the sense organs." "When one brain picks it up, it will have a tendency to pass it on to another brain and another brain and so on, so it will spread exponentially." "And it's empirical fact that this happens." "The Slenderman case is a very powerful example of peer-to-peer horizontal transmission." "It does happen." "Meow, meow, kitty." "That's right, come here." "Were you sleeping as usual?" "Yes, you were." "Stand up straight." "I think you should wear your badge from Webelos Camp... because there's only two people in your whole pack that have that badge." "Okay." "All right." "All your pins are secure?" "Yes." "You don't want to be losing them." "Right?" "Yeah." "Life is good." "You're all geared up, all right?" "Okay." "Get ready to put that thing away." "All right?" "Okay." "I don't want to get any grief about," ""Oh I just got to finish this level," or whatever else." "All right?" "Aiden?" "Yeah." "Yay?" " Are you okay, Aiden?" " Yeah." "You sound a little sniffley." "This whole event, from start to finish, has been a tragedy." "But you have to be angry at the situation." "I'm angry at the situation... and my daughter is not the one... that spent upwards of seven days in the hospital recovering from this." "And I'm angry about the situation." "So, if I'm angry about it... you know, this other family sure as hell has a right to be angry about it." "You know, they could... you know, slam the door in my face, or, you know, punch me in the face and knock me on my ass and you know... they would probably be justified in doing so." "I'm sure they have a lot of the same questions I do." "Did you come to any conclusions about Anissa, as far as a diagnosis?" "The predisposing characteristics that... made her susceptible to the delusional disorder... is what's referred to as a schizotypy." "It's a diminished ability to determine what's real and what's not real." "A lot of people have varying degrees of this." "Adults may have, simply, eccentric religious or spiritual beliefs or... conspiratorial beliefs or things like that and live out their life with no problems at all." "I've done quite a bit of research on the early stages of psychopathic personality in adolescents over the last 20 years." "Based on your experiences and testing of Anissa, she does not carry that particular diagnosis." "No." "She doesn't have... she has, really, no characteristics of a psychopath or a sociopath or anything like that." "Okay." "Morgan and Anissa came out of the bathroom." "Payton said that she didn't want to play hide and seek, but Morgan said that the next game that they played could be her choice." "Payton said that..." "Anissa pulled her deeper and deeper into the woods." "And then..." "Anissa says, "Now!"" "And Anissa turns her back." "Morgan got on top of Payton's legs." "She sat on her legs, and then she got her face real close to Payton and whispered in her ear, "I'm so sorry."" "And then started stabbing her." "What, ultimately, was Morgan diagnosed with?" "The final diagnosis, both in the psychological report and in my report are schizophrenia, unspecified, 295.90... oppositional defiant disorder, 313.81... and bronchial asthma, mild, intermittent, J45.2." "What is schizophrenia?" "Schizophrenia is one of the most serious and one of the most studied mental illnesses of human beings." "Approximately 1% of the population succumbs to schizophrenia." "It is a psychotic illness." "It's through a combination of genetic predisposition and then stress placed on the person to begin manifesting symptoms." "Patients lose track of reality in a number of ways." "One would be hallucinations." "One could hear voices, one could see visions, one could feel things crawling on them." "Delusions, on the other hand, don't have to do with sensing something, they have to do with a thought." "So, for example, believing that Slenderman is real is a delusion." "Saying that you saw Slenderman is a visual hallucination." "Is the pile getting bigger?" "Ha!" "Jumping in the leaves." "And that's one of my favorites." "I raked up a bunch of leaves in the back yard and... she came flying in." "Nice action shot." "Yeah, it's hard for us to imagine that she was having problems." "It's hard to process." "None of us..." "saw this coming." "Morgan recalls having hallucinations as early as three." "She remembers... seeing ghosts at night, as young as three, that would bite her and pull her hair." "But from what I understand, for the most part they were friendly, too." "She even said that she... she tried to tell us about it once, and that we just told her to go back to bed, but I don't have any recollection of that." "And really, how often do your children tell you at bedtime that they're seeing something or hearing something when they're that age?" ""A monster's in my closet," or "something's under my bed,"" "you know, just because they don't want to go to bed." "It's hard because I haven't been able to discuss these things with Morgan, because she's been incarcerated... for the entire time that I've..." "I've known... that she's... that she's had these symptoms." "She expressed the ability to see and hear things that other people are not able to hear or see." "Things like unicorns." "She at one point digressed into fairly rambling discussion about a student in her class being a pegasus." "When I saw her last week, a few days before," "Snape had come to visit her and kept her up until 3:00 in the morning, by Morgan's report." "Snape?" "Snape." " Who is that?" " A "Harry Potter" character." "She also will say not just that she's heard things, but that since as early as three, she's had some sensory-perceptual distortions." "She might see a person change slightly or see colors." "She doesn't..." "have much concern about whether she gets a long prison sentence, because, wherever she is, she will use Vulcan mind control to make herself feel, to make herself believe whatever she likes." "And so, even under very stressful circumstances, she doesn't feel the stress because of this... what she described to be Vulcan mind control." "How about her... her cell?" "I would consider her cell disorganized." "She has papers scattered about the floor." "Have you ever suggested picking them up?" "Yes, I have." "And she stated that she liked the papers there because they made it feel less empty." " And she is in the room alone?" " Correct." "She said, "Seeing my friends"," ""none of these things are dangerous." "These friends can't disappear." "They're important to me."" "Was she referring to real world friends or fictional friends?" "Fictional, I believe." "She's not allowed to hug her family or touch them?" " Not in our facility." " Right." "She made clear that her primary concern was with her relationship with Slenderman, and she felt like if she says the wrong thing, if she somehow upsets Slenderman, not only hers but her family's lives could be in danger." "With childhood schizophrenia, almost everyone develops, eventually, negative symptoms and cognitive symptoms." "What's unique about Morgan's circumstance is that a severe course is so predictable." "Well, we knew her diagnosis before we went to meet them at the hospital." "We had a conference call with two of the doctors, so we were..." "we were prepared." "And the reason that we all went up there, actually, was so that we could tell Morgan what her diagnosis was." "And we thought that it would be helpful for her to know that her father also... had the same mental illness, because we had never told her previously that Matt had schizophrenia." "We were very worried about the way that she might react to learning that she has schizophrenia because Morgan..." "Morgan's a very smart girl, and she's been reading..." "Which makes me think that she knew." "Yeah." "I think when they told her, she was probably like..." "Not surprised..."Well, that's what I would've guessed... if I had to diagnose myself."" "What I think is that Morgan knows that other people don't see her hallucinations, but they're still very real to her." "Like, in her head they are real, and they're there with her." "They're there." "But I think that she knows that other people don't see them." "Otherwise, why would she make an attempt to..." " Cover it up." "Mm-hmm." " ...hide them from us, exactly." "It's because she doesn't want to lose them." "She's afraid they would be taken from her." "This is the doll house, or the components for a doll house, that Morgan made while she was housed at Washington County Juvenile Detention Center." "And she just put so much... detail into it, it's amazing." "She's not allowed to have scissors, so all of these... all of these tiny little pieces she ripped by hand." "This is a television, and these are some of her little cartoon characters that she likes to draw." "This actually, I think, is a character that's modeled after Spock." "When I watched her do a couple of the dolls and the..." "and the clothing, and she said what was surprising is how few times she had to start over." "Like, she was able to just be meticulous about..." "Here's some food." "I think this is salad and a piece of pizza." "A salad and a piece of pizza." "Here's a little laptop computer." "See there's even detail on the screen." "Look at the cute little heart on the front of the computer." "This looks like it's another TV." "Oh, and there's..." "how appropriate." "There's a courtroom drama playing in the background." "When I ask her what she wants to watch on TV that night... it's one of the things I usually ask her when I talk to her on the phone... she'll say that it depends on whose turn it is to decide." "And she's in a cell by herself, so she's the only person there." "I do a lot of stuff with running numbers in my head." "I do..." "I try to put up static, almost, is how I describe it." "I wish that I could talk to her about... like, I have... right now, there's like patterns of light and geometric shapes that's, like, always racing." "Like always, like right now." "Pshew, pshew, pshew, pshew, pshew, pshew." "I always wanted to know if she sees that stuff, too." "Everything seems normal to me, because it's... it's my everything." "This is how I've always seen things." "So, it doesn't seem weird to me that like," ""Oh that's not how you see street lights?"" "or "Oh, that's weird."" "I don't know if that was everyone that had like a weird little visual... thing going on... like the glaring demon, devil." "Like that you're like, "Okay, this is clearly not real."" "But it doesn't matter." "Like, I've had where... like you... you can see it and you know it's not real... but it totally doesn't matter, because you're still terrified of it." "Like, I know that there's..." "I know the devil's not in the backseat, but the devil is in the backseat." "You know?" "Yeah, sometimes you know it's not real, but it still smells, tastes, and looks real, so it's real." "Could you just describe, in general terms, what you found in the bedroom when you went through it?" "There were..." "numerous... notebooks and pieces of paper with drawings and writings pertaining to the Slenderman character." "Where was all this stuff located?" "All in Morgan's bedroom." "When you ask Morgan..." ""What if Slenderman doesn't exist?"" "She can't tolerate that." "She becomes somewhat oppositional, and says she knows it's true, and it can't be proven untrue, so it's true." "Did Morgan use the words" ""It had to be done?" Yes." "Did you tell her to say that?" "I did not." "She's volunteering this to you?" "Correct." "That seems like an unusual thing to say." "It does." "Did you ask her what she meant by that?" "I did." "And did you have to ask her multiple times?" "I did." "Okay, after you asked her multiple times what she meant by "It had to be done,"" "what did she offer you or what did she say?" "She told me that the man ordered it." "Yes, I did." "She held up three fingers." "Like three?" "Three." "What did that... did you try to understand what that meant?" "I asked her if that meant three years ago, and she said, "No, at age three."" "She believed that she communicated telepathically with Slenderman, and that... once the communication began, that she had to do what it was that Slenderman demanded." "And if she didn't do what was demanded, her family wouldn't be safe?" "She wouldn't be safe, her family wouldn't be safe." "Dr. Robbins, was Morgan's entry into this particular crime because of her psychosis?" "I believe so." "It bears saying that schizophrenia, in and of itself, is not a dangerous illness." "There are many 35-year-olds who have schizophrenia who don't have to be incarcerated, who can be managed in a community." "However, there's a second part to that." "When your delusion..." "when your fixed delusion tells you to kill people... and when your... insight doesn't allow you to seek treatment," "then schizophrenia becomes dangerous." "It is a dangerous illness untreated... and hence..." "we're here." "You are just so lost in your illness that no one knew about... and then for people just to hate her like that, just hate you..." ""I hate that little girl." "I hope she burns."" "Like, having people call my house and tell me," ""You're going to burn in hell and so is your daughter."" "People don't understand that... she loves Bella." "We love Bella... so much, and she still talks about her like they're friends." "Oh my god." "She loves her like I love her." "And like, for people to talk about her the way they do, it's like..." "Morgan loved Bella." "She's..." "like, how sick are you that you would do that to your best friend?" "Because you're afraid of something happening, or because you want something happen." "You want to become something... because your illness dictated that this is something you need to be." "Just blows me away... that people are like that." "It just makes me sad." "I wish people knew." "The regular ones are just the regular cat treats that you're used to." "Just to say, "I love you, kitty."" "Cat Snacks are only 2.99 at your local grocery store." "Thank you." "Detective, did you have a chance to watch that compilation?" "I saw the compilation." "And would you agree that that's you present in that room with Morgan Geyser?" "Those were... pieces of the interview that was me and Morgan together." "Did you tell Morgan she could have parents available to talk to before you interrogated her?" "I did not tell her that, because that wasn't an option." "You weren't going to let her parents be present?" "Correct." "Or let her even have a phone call to talk to them?" "Um, we did not offer her a phone call." "At some point were you provided with Anissa's phone?" "Yes, I was." "Did you have a chance to look at any of the... messages on that phone?" "Yes, I did." "It says, "This is my final wish to those who care..."" "Mm-hmm." "Where did you locate the suspects?" "They were located right by I-94 in Waukesha County." "Did you notice anything about Anissa's emotional state when you had contact with her?" "She said she was scared, and I asked what was she scared of?" "And do you recall what she said to you?" "She made mention that if she told me," "I would think that she was crazy, and I told her that I didn't think anybody was crazy." "Okay." "Can you ask the question again please?" "One of the first communications before any of the search requests was found on Anissa's phone that was provided by her parents, correct?" "Correct." "It was basically a goodbye letter." "Correct?" "Yes." "And basically indicated that people should remember who she was, not grieve for her... and that she wouldn't do them harm." " Correct." " Nothing further, Your Honor." "Aiden?" "Wrap it up, chief." "we got places to go." "All right?" "We have to run over to the school for a mandatory meeting about iPads... setting up their iPad... and using their iPad, and... the disadvantages they'll be at if they're not allowed to use their iPad." "You know?" "I don't think anybody can really, you know, begrudge me for thinking the way I do about... a bunch of fifth graders getting iPads." "You know, based on what this family has been through." "At the same token... you know, I don't want to hinder his learning." "I guess I just need to... get over my own reservations about it." "And about the iPads." "If I'd had my way, he wouldn't have one." "You have a child that is... incarcerated, for lack of a better term... but your other life still has to go on, so you still have to be able to support your other children with the activities that they're in, and... you do your best to support your children" "that you can't have access to... and have to explain to Anissa that," ""Well, I might not be able to come up on Tuesday," ""because Aiden has a pack meeting." "I have to be there for that."" "I've had conversations with..." "my oldest son." "I was out in the backyard." "He comes outside, he says to me, "What's wrong?"" "That's when I told him... it's just stressful as hell... trying to keep everything as balanced as it can possibly be." "You never get a day off... and it wears on you." "It just really wears the shit outta ya." "Because you have to do so much more... to try to keep everybody in a positive place, including yourself." "It's..." "It's mentally... and emotionally and physically just draining." "I knew it was always a risk, simply because of... genetics that one of our children might develop schizophrenia." "I never thought something like this would happen." "Matt is so..." "He's so high functioning and he's so... stable." "I just know that he's developed an awareness of what's real and what's not." "And I think, for Morgan, those lines are still pretty blurry... but it's all still very real to her." "In general, Morgan's just becoming more and more lost and involved in this world of imaginary friends that she has." "The best possible situation would be that she ends up in an environment where she can receive treatment for her schizophrenia, and that would be a psychiatric facility." "Not prison." "She can't go to prison." "I think it's kind of cruel of the courts... to have a law where you can take two girls who are not troublemakers prior..." "And they did not try to hide what they did." "They did not lie about what they did." "They were very truthful for it." "And it's like they're being punished extra because of it." "Well, let's hope the judge is gonna have some good news." "Some very good news." "The two young girls accused of stabbing their classmate are back in court." "WISN 12 news' Hillary Mintz is live in Waukesha County with the very latest." "Hillary." "Well, Melinda, for pretty much the past year since the stabbing happened, a judge here at the county courthouse has been trying to figure out "Should Morgan Geyser and Anissa Weier be tried as adults or juveniles?"" "That decision is expected to come today, and the stakes in that decision are extremely high." "The victim, 13-year-old Payton Leutner, has physically recovered, but they say she is still dealing with the emotional damage." "The court's prepared to proceed with the ruling." "The court easily finds that this is a violent, premeditated, personal offense." "There was a conscious decision made at the time of the offense to let the victim die." "They told P.L. that they would leave to get her help." "They did leave... and they left, walking to the Nicolet National Forest to locate the Slenderman Mansion and then meet up with Slenderman." "This is charged as an attempted murder, but you have to keep in mind for both defendants that this was in fact... this was an effort to kill someone, not a mistake by hitting them too hard," "not a mistake by pushing them too hard." "The issue of brain development is important for the court to consider." "They were young when the offense occurred, but they get older every day, frankly." "They're a year older today." "But what happens at age 18?" "And in this court's view, that's a critical factor for the court to evaluate." "There would be no oversight, no control, no ways to ensure public safety." "They've committed an offense that is serious." "It's... it's, frankly, vicious." "There has to be assurance that that doesn't happen again, that a serious offense is dealt with on a serious basis that offers protections to everyone." "On that basis then, I'll order that the defendants," "Ms. Geyser and Ms. Weier, be retained in the adult jurisdiction." "As so ordered." "There were tears and some surprise here in court as a judge denied a motion by lawyers for both girls to have their cases handled in juvenile court." "Anissa Weier's lawyer went on to say they'll be discussing the possibility of an appeal." "The victim's father here said they wouldn't be commenting, though the family did appear to be upbeat following this decision." "I'm sure that they would have been found eventually." "I think they never would have made it to the state forest." "From Waukesha to the Nicolet State Forest is a good four- to five-hour drive." "And they thought they were going to walk that?" "They had no idea of what it would take to walk that distance." "The judge ordered that Anissa have no contact with the Internet." "The judge also ordered that, you know, she have no contact with the co-defendant." "Morgan has no access to the outdoors." "Not even a window to look out." "Morgan says that this doesn't bother her, because she doesn't want to go outside anymore." "One of the things that Anissa and her had talked about was, no matter what happened... they would always be together."