"Right now, on "Close Up" "With The Hollywood Reporter."" "I think reality in general is the lowest common denominator type thing." "The freakier, the better, and" "What's wrong with that?" "I like that" "I was gonna say." "(all talking at once)" "I'm not a TV person." "I'm a chef that happened to get a extra paycheck due to TV shows." "If I didn't like-- and I won't bull(bleep) ya." "(laughter)" "Why don't you invite" "Donald Trump to sing" ""I Wanna Be a Billionaire"?" "(laughter)" "♪ I wanna be a billionaire ♪" "(laughter)" "'Cause you know he does!" "(laughter)" "(Lacey Rose)" "We'll hear from the power players behind the year's most talked about reality shows." "Mark Cuban, "Shark Tank."" "Jane Lynch," ""Hollywood Game Night."" "Nick Cannon," ""America's Got Talent."" "LL Cool J," ""Lip Sync Battle."" "Mike Darnell," ""500 Questions."" "Guy Fieri," ""Diners, Drive-Ins and Dives."" "♪♪" "Welcome to "Close Up" "With The Hollywood Reporter."" "I'm Lacey Rose," "Television Editor." "Let's dive right into this." "Jane, what's the hardest part about doing what you do in this show?" "Oh, not-- there's nothing hard about it." "No?" "It's" " It's pure joy." "I love it." "It's-- you know, I get to be social, but" "And I love" " I don't like going to parties, but I love hosting them." "So, it's great." "It's like "Hey, hey."" "I get a little bit of intimate connection and then I go to my perch." "Uh-huh." "And I'm down." "So, no one had to convince you." "Exactly." "No one had to twist your arm?" "I'm kinda like" "Jay Gatsby, watching my party, you know, sipping a scotch." "(audience laughing)" "Umbrella!" "Yeah!" "Raining!" "Raining!" "Shoes!" "Sandals!" "Shoe" " Tennis shoes!" "Flip-flops!" "Sandals!" "(buzzer)" "Oh!" "Did they get sandals?" "(cheering, bell dings)" "Yes!" "(cheering and applause)" "I love for "crab"-- was the one, and Jason pointed to his crotch." "(laughter)" "I would have said" ""Go ahead!"" "(Jane)" "On a family television show." "(laughter)" "But I-I" "There's nothing hard or challenging about it at all." "(Lacey)" "I love it." "Just learning the game, sometimes, I'm, you know-- 'cause I'm not the brightest light on the Christmas tree." "It is a party, by the way." "It's totally a party." "It's a party, and it's a great time." "Mark, how hard was it to be convinced to do "Shark Tank"" "in the first place?" "Yeah, Burnett just asking me." "I was like "Business show?"" "and literally," "I think" "I said earlier," "I didn't think the show would last." "Mm-hmm." "You know, it'd been bounced around," "I'm like, "Okay, maybe" "I'll find some good deals and it'll be a unique experience,"" "which is what" "I care about." "And then the next thing you know, it's just like... a juggernaut." "I wanna thank you guys all for your offers... but Mark, we've got a deal." "Let's do this!" "Well..." "Congratulations," "Patrick." "I'm really proud of you, man." "Thank you." "Thank you so much." "You remind me of a Mini Me." "Bubbe!" "I knew, I knew!" "Mazel tov!" "I knew you would do it, because I knew that you'd be impressed with him." "Yeah, and I was." "I really, really was." "(Mark)" "Congratulations." "Bye!" "Good job, man." "Thanks, thanks." "Bye, Bubbe." "(Lacey)" "What's the most money you've lost on a-- on a "Shark Tank" contestant?" "200 grand," "I think." "I think out of the 71" "I've closed, three are out of business, four are out of business and aren't smart enough to realize it." "(laughter)" "And then on the other side, probably, ten, 12 are making a half-a-million, or $1 million a year or more." "I've had a bunch of 'em pay me back, you know, 10x." "Huh!" "Yeah, so I've made" "Do you stay in touch with these people?" "I mean, is that part of the process?" "Oh no, no, absolutely!" "Are you kiddin' me?" ""Cuban gave me some money, and, like," "I never heard from--"" "No, I-- every week," "I get my reports, or every week or two," "I get reports from 'em." "Bad news first, and yeah," "I have to help 'em." "Yeah." "And they call you and they want advice and they want" "Always email." "Like, yeah, 'cause otherwise, my phone would not stop ringing." "But yeah, always-- but-- and I have like 15 people who work with me and help me" "(LL)" "Vet." "(Lacey)" "Mm-hmm." "No, that just-- that just work on 'em once I've closed the deal." "Mm-hmm." "And so um, yeah, it's-- that's the hard part about doing the show." "The show, actually, you know, three weeks in June, two weeks in September, you know, long days, but we just crank 'em all out." "It's after you close the deal, that's when the work starts and so that's the hard part." "Sure." "All right, LL, is it easier to get people on the show now that it is a success?" "No, you know, it" "You can't" "It" " It never gets easy because you still have to be respectful." "Just because the show is successful, and it's growing, doesn't mean that you can like... snap your fingers and people just want to be on your show." "That's lovely." "It's good to be here tonight on the Lip Sync Battle show." "I have been begging to be here and I finally made it!" "♪♪" "What just happened?" "!" "This whole show is such animalistic love." "(man)" "You are not on LSD." "You are on LSB." "(cheering and applause)" "There are people that have called and asked to be on it, but at the same time, sometimes it takes a little coaxing because people don't wanna look stupid, don't wanna look crazy." "They're scared to put their selves out there." "It makes them nervous." "It's" " It's sensitive." "It's scary." "You know, it's a little scary, so... it's not, you know, just like, whoo-hoo!" "You know," ""Pop the champagne."" "But how much of your job are-- that coaxing is a piece of it?" "(Jane)" "It" " Yeah, one of the things that" "I always say is that, if you come on our show, you are risking the 99.9% chance of looking like an idiot." "(Lacey)" "Mm-hmm." "And they go in knowing that." "And you tell them" "I was great on your show." "(Jane)" "Yeah, absolutely." "(Lacey)" "So, you have to have that conversation with them." "You were one of the biggest idiots we ever had!" "(laughter)" "(Nick)" "They exist!" "(Mike)" "Wait a second," "I haven't been on yet." "(Jane)" "And that's the best." "That's why" "(laughter)" "I was afraid to do the show for that reason, you see?" "Right?" "Exactly." "No, it's-- it's, um, uh, it's about having fun." "Like it's not about-- you know, there are a lot of people who are competitive." "Mm-hmm." "But for the most part, for me, it's a successful show if, like, a fight breaks out, if somebody cheats and I get to call them on it." "That's fun." "Mm-hmm." "You know, we really-- everything stays on-- in the show." "It takes us about an hour and a half, two hours to shoot it, so we-- there's very little cut out." "And that's one of the things" "I love is when, like, mayhem ensues and I just stand back and watch this golden television moment." "And just wind it up a little bit worse." "Yeah, really, throw a little something out there, yeah." "Is coaxing a piece of-- of the job for you?" "It's the worst part of the job." "I wish that-- they-- they hire these people called talent bookers and I don't know what they do." "(laughter)" "Because, I mean-- and that like, specifically on "Wild 'N Out."" "It's a show I created," "I'm the producer, and I literally after" "I'm still" "I'm gonna-- after this is over," "I'm gonna beg LL to come and do the show." "It's like, you-- it's a fine line of like, these are your friends, these are your peers." "But then again, everyone has a schedule, you have to be in the right part of the cycle where they're promoting something" "(Jane)" "Right, right." "But then everybody's lookin' at you like," ""This is your show, and you said this was your buddy." "What happened?"" "And you've got a lot of people in your ear..." "Yeah." "...telling you not to do this." "Not to-- especially 'cause everybody" "That's a mistake, don't do that, blah blah blah" "Did anyone tell you guys not to do it?" "To actually-- whether to be on it or whether to host?" "Oh, all the time." "I was" "Funny, for" ""America's Got Talent,"" "when they offered me the job, I was promoting a film at the Sundance" "Film Festival" "(Lacey)" "Mm-hmm." "Well!" "Ooh!" "Hey!" "And they were like" "Wow." "They were like..." "Indie guy." ""Yo, this money offer came through."" "And I was actually-- the way it even came about," "I was pitching another show that I was producing." "I was never thinking about it, and they were like," ""You're promoting the film," ""and we're trying to win awards." ""Tell me one award-winning actor you know that hosts a reality show."" "Like, I don't care about all of that." "I wanna have" "I wanna do what I wanna do and have fun." "One of the best decisions" "I ever had." "So, Mike, you obviously have to pick, uh, for a long time, you've been picking hosts and-- and judges and whatnot." "I mean, "500 Questions" is-- is one recent example." "And how do you think about, okay, what-- what makes the most sense?" "Do I always want a Simon Cowell, or do I" "No, no." "No." "So there's a difference between a host and a judge..." "And a judge, that's true." "and someone on a reality show, right?" "So, like," "I put Simon Cowell and Gordon Ramsay in the same bucket." "Which is, they're both really talented and the reason people like them is because they are authentic." "I think Mark's like that." "Where you will forgive a bad day or an angry comment if you know they're real." "If it feels to you they're coming from a real place." "So when you're looking for certain things-- you know, hosting a game show is very different than, you know, someone that's gonna" "You don't want a mean host." "Right, right, right." "That's not gonna work, right?" "Right." "I'm not mean-- it's candor!" "(laughter)" "Tonight, the smartest people in the country are about to play the toughest game ever devised." "No saves, no helps, no multiple choice." "Our geniuses are ready, the pressure is on." "It's Day One." "Will anybody be able to answer 500 questions?" "(cheering and applause)" "♪♪" "But as long as you're authentic, as long as, you know-- and-- and Guy, you're authentic." "I think there's a sense of, you know" "You're a good man." "Nick's more the host," "Nick's the host" "Are you calling me a Nod-Off Nick?" "No, no, no, no." "(laughter)" "(Jane)" "We're completely game-fried." "Is that what you're saying?" "Yeah, he is." "That's exactly what he's saying!" "No, no, it's different!" "I'll take it." "Like LL said, he's-- he's just-- he's being himself being host." "It's different." "It's a different thing... (Lacey)" "Yup." "...than being a judge." "It's a different thing, that's all I'm saying." "♪♪" "♪♪" "Welcome back to "Close Up" "With The Hollywood Reporter."" "We're with the influencers behind the year's most-watched reality shows." "What's the wildest thing that's happened on one of your shows, whether it's made it to air or it hasn't?" "Well, mine made it to air." "I was dry-humped by Martin Short." "(chuckling)" "(Mike)" "Nice." "I don't have anything nearly that good, so I'll just" "I'll opt out." "I thought I'd start kinda down here and down there at the same time." "(Lacey)" "Uh-huh, raise the bar, mm-hmm." "That's good." "Yeah, nothing that good." "I mean, we had somebody pass out on "Shark Tank"" "and we couldn't air it." "Guy walks up, starts to do his pitch and then gets a little bit woozy, you know?" "We're like "You okay?"" "and then, bam!" "Just fell over." "He couldn't take it." "Passed out, he was done." "(LL)" "Yeah, I can't" "I can't imag" "I don't know." "It was just-- you know," "I've just been having so much fun on "Lip Synch,"" "I don't know." "I've watched the show." "You could just say for the next hour, everything, I mean" "(all talking at once)" "A lot of things, you know, because a lot of things happen, you know, but... nothing that we wouldn't air." "You know" " You know what I'm saying?" "We air everything, too." "I want all of it on TV!" "Put it on TV!" "You know?" "All right, you can go back way in the vault here." "Well, no, you know," "I mean... those who don't know my past," "I did a lot of-- all my shows were so crazy that" "I literally put everything on air." ""When Animals Attack!"" ""Police Chases."" "Um, "When Good Pets Go Bad."" "You know, every show had something crazy happening." "Can I tell you how much" "I love "When Animals Attack!"?" "Thank you very " "(laughter)" "I love" " Yo!" "I'm tellin' you right now." "Yo, I love that like" "I heard it's staged, though." "I heard the whole thing is staged." "You see some lady sitting next to a bear or something and she's not lookin'." "The bear, like, gets shocked or something" "In the zoo with the karate outfits trying to hold the bear back." "I did" "I did a show called-- and a lot of people still call "Man vs. Beast."" "Mm-hmm." "So we had humans goin' against beasts." "So, the one thing I wanted was a runner to go against a giraffe." "I thought," ""That's interesting."" "Except, the horse knows he's supposed to race," "The giraffe doesn't know." "So, we're like honking horns, and spraying a little water, anything to get him to-- nothing, zero." "I'm like," ""Okay, what do we--"" "So then we ended up with a zebra, but I was very unhappy with that." "I felt like a giraffe would have been very interesting." "Who won the race?" "You shoulda put a-- a lion behind him in the cage or something." "That'll give him some motivation." "The zebra won the race." "You know what else I had?" "On that same show," "I had... the guy that was the current hot dog eating champion," "Kobayashi." "(Mark)" "Kobayashi." "No, he's not-- he's not-- he's not the leader anymore." "(Mike)" "No, no, back in time." "(Mark)" "How do I know this stuff?" "(all talking at once)" "And, look, he was eating like 60 hot dogs in 12 minutes." "Which is crazy-- with the buns." "And we put him against a bear." "No competition." "The bear, he'll-- the bear takes his tongue and just" "How'd you like to sell him toilet bowls?" "(laughter)" "That's a business in and of itself, ain't it?" "(Mark groaning)" "So really, literally, there was almost nothing that could possibly go wrong that didn't." "Amazing." "Yeah, like Mike, I mean, uh... the show that I'm on, people do the craziest things." "like, when you think about" ""America's Got Talent,"" "that's the whole thing, so I-- where do I begin?" "I've had people stick drills in their nose" "(audience cheering)" "♪♪" "(Howie Mandel)" "Whoa" " Whoa, ho, ho!" "I can't do dat!" "Aah!" "Aah!" "(farting sound)" "That's nasty!" "Aah!" "(screaming)" "Oh my God!" "(Nick)" "We will see you at Radio City Music Hall!" "Just-- just this season," "I had a-- there's a 95-year-old stripper, who-- who was on the pole." "(Lacey)" "Oh!" "Hmm." "Oh!" "And I helped her on the pole." "Who wants to see that?" "(laughter)" "Of course!" "Had to give her a boost." "That's what I'm supposed to do, I'm the host." "I had to make sure everything was going okay." "And you were the one who found her, right?" "Absolutely!" "(laughter)" "(all talking at once)" "Listen, you're too old for this, but maybe we could put you on the show." "(laughter)" "I'm at a diner, and I'm-- we're not shootin', we're havin' a kind of a wrap meeting with the production team, and there's these two ladies sitting across the way from us." "And they're having a discussion that I'm supposed to be hearing, but they're not looking at me, and they're having a discussion of who's the bigger fan." "And they really kinda get into a heated argument and this one's talking about" ""Well, I know what his kids' names and I know where he lives in the wine country."" "It goes back and forth." "Getting creepy." "Finally" " Finally" "Oh, yeah, it gets-- it gets real creepy," "And it's in the South, so there's a little accent in there too." "And finally, the one lady gets up from the booth and pushes away from the table and I think she said like," ""Mabel!" "I'm gonna tell you right now," ""I'm his biggest fan." "I know everything about Gus Ferrari!"" "(laughter)" "Gus!" "Okay, don't worry about gettin' the name right." "I love the heat in the burger." "The bacon, you've cooked it down enough to where you get the texture of the bacon, you get the flavor of the bacon, and then you get this tender burger which you've been able to cook" "medium rare." "Brother," "I'm tellin' ya." "It's a simple dish but it has to be executed the right way." "It's kinda like a play." "If you just do what you're supposed to do and commit to what you're supposed to do, you're gonna make it happen." "You made it happen, man." "That's-- that's outrageous." "What's the key to... the dream contestant on an unscripted show?" "Fearless, like" "(Jane)" "Yeah." "Mentality of just like, they're-- they're there for them." "Like, the selfishness of it all." "(LL)" "I think it's people that just don't take themselves too seriously." "They just wanna have fun." "Yeah." "People that've had a lot of coffee." "Yeah." "Or drank some." "Yeah." "Had some booze in their coffee, those are my favorite 'cause they-- they let it go." "(Lacey)" "But I'm guessing there's-- there is probably a spectrum, and too far in the coffee or booze, and we've... (all talking at once)" "I think that's true." "We've had that on" ""Hollywood Game Night,"" "because we do, uh, give them drinks." "(Lacey)" "Mm-hmm." "And, um... so we've got celebrities and then we've got, uh, regular people, normies." "(chuckling)" ""Normies."" "The people who aren't celebrities, it helps if they're not star struck or drunk." "(Lacey)" "Mm-hmm." "So there are" "I mean, we've had some really great people kinda show up and they really play as a team with the celebrities." "And, we have had to cut people off, celebrities and some of the normal folks coming in, so..." "Uh-huh." "Sometimes that works against us." "It loosens people up, but then sometimes" "Cut 'em off of what, is the question." "(stammering)" "Scotch." "Whatever their drink is, yeah." "Water it down a little bit." "(Mike)" "You know, we used to, um" "I don't know if you guys know this, but, um, almost all the contestants on all shows go through a psych test." "Right." "Which, uh, goes from a one to a five, right?" "Okay, so." "I know, it's five worst." "And they always were, you know, "Well, this guy's a four and a half."" "I'm like, "Great." "As close as you can get to a five."" "Let's get 'em on the air." "It's almost never bad." "Especially-- according to what show you're doing." "if you're doing "Bachelor"" "or "Bachelorette,"" "they can be nuts, right?" "You want 'em to be crazy." "Um, and I think even the talent contests, you know, they're more open, they're more emotional." "There's a breed that's... meant to be on these shows anyway, right?" "Sure." "And they know it." "It's kinda like guys that like to bungee-jump, there's an X-factor in there, right?" "There's an X-factor in these things." "And I think that you're looking for" "It is very rare in my career that I've ever had someone show up and go," ""Too much."" "Almost never." "We have a show you can go on somewhere, just hang on a sec." "That's right, that's right." "What does" " What does the psych test entail?" "It's a written test, and a verbal test." "Mm-hmm." "Uh, there might be some drawings on it," "I'm not sure, like, like" "Uh-huh." "Like the Rorschach?" "Yeah, a little bit." "I mean, we've had ones and twos." "They're okay." "But they don't make it to the shows." "You gotta have threes and fours, and at some" "(LL)" "So you're not lookin' for Mr. Spock?" "No, you're not." "(laughter)" "(Mark)" "That's what you don't want." "It's the exact opposite." "The psych lady, who's onsite all the time, literally sitting there because some of the people who come off..." "That's right." "...that don't get-- just are distraught." "So there's been people who walk off crying..." "Oh, yeah." "...screaming, yelling" "(Guy)" "You guys have counseling at the end of it?" "There is counseling, yes, oh, my God." "Seriously?" "(all talking at once)" "We always had a psychologist on set." "(Mark)" "You've got to." "At all the "Idol"s, everything, yeah." "(Lacey)" "Huh." "Absolutely, just in case." "Yeah, they'll walk down the hall and-- like, so, we're sitting there, and "No, you didn't get a deal," right?" "And we'll just hear 'em wailing, or screaming or yelling." "And then, you know, it's like other shows, you come off, and there's craft food." ""We're-- we're done, right?"" "It's hard not to laugh at that." "(laughing)" "It just depends, right?" "(Nick)" "But you don't have like four "X"s on your show, right, in front of thousands of people." "(Mark)" "Millions of people, right?" "Remember, these people who come on, this is their dream, right?" "They've put their whole life into this." "Oh, yeah, well." "Every penny that they have is just gone, if we-- you know." "And they may be out of business, you know, they lose their house, whatever." "And so, they come out of there just wailing' and just dyin'." "So, we come out, you know, and we're out going to craft service and then, our psych lady, you can just see her come back..." "But usually a day-- a day, two days later, they're okay." "(Lacey)" "They're okay." "They know they're gonna be on television, and they know they-- right?" "And that's what-- yeah." "Sayin', like, the people who are built for this." "There's people who, like, are fearless, who are like "Hey, I'm" "I'm here to be on television."" "Mm-hmm." "And I'm here to play on" "Those are the people you want." "Getting everything out of it." "Yeah." "Especially like on" ""America's Got Talent,"" "because-- and this, you know, like Mike said, there's certain levels of people." "There's some people that actually really believe that they're talented, but they're not." "Those are the best, though." "You're authentic, right?" "Yeah, so those are the ones that psych has to kinda be a little delicate with" "(Lacey)" "Uh-huh." "Or I have to be deli-- 'cause I'm not there to make fun of them, but it's like clearly, you know, you playing straws is not gonna win you a million dollars... (Lacey)" "It's not?" "But that's all they know and that's all they have." "So you have-- it's a delicate balance of," ""All right, these people are almost at a five--"" "Uh-huh." "But you still-- they're still people and they're still humans, and you wanna handle 'em with respect." "Don't go away." "We'll be right back with more." "♪♪" "♪♪" "Welcome back to "Close Up" "With The Hollywood Reporter."" "We're bringing you the untold tales of reality television." "If you could go back and reboot a reality show, which would you choose?" ""That's Incredible!"" "Oh!" "Fran Tarkenton, man." "Come on!" "(laughter)" "That's right!" "(Lacey)" "What would you guys bring back?" "(Mark)" "Weird how you know that" ""Mutual of Omaha's" "Wild Kingdom."" "(laughter)" "(Jane)" "Ratings all over" "(Guy)" "Just the song alone is enough." "How did it go?" "♪ Mutual of Omaha-- ♪" "I'm singing now?" "These" " These things have really gone wrong." "(LL)" "I mean, I'd like to just watch the intro of" ""The Wide World of Sports."" "Just the" "(all talking at once)" "And the agony of defeat!" "Oh, yeah, defeat, yes!" "Yo, with the guy on the skis falling" "Wipe out!" "Yeah, I just" "I just wanna watch that." "Like, I'd like to see that right now, just to see how it looks." "(Nick)" "You know what's cool too?" "Back in the day," "I actually got an opportunity to bring it back, and it's "Yo!" "MTV Raps."" "You know what I'm saying?" "Mm-hmm." "Yeah." "So we gon'" " L... (Guy)" "Oh, that's awesome." "He was on the first episode, the pilot of it, where he went on tour and I took that same concept and got the tour bus and stuff like that, so." "(Lacey)" "Huh, I love that." "I'd like to do "Cribs,"" "but kitchens." "(Nick)" "Nice!" "Beautiful!" "(Jane)" "Oh, yeah!" "Let's go seeing gangsta kitchens 'cause I know he's gotta have one" "Oh, hell, no, are you kidding me?" "I've got a microwave." "Come on, Cuban." "18 chefs and the whole" "I mean, it looks like... (all talking at once)" "(Guy)" "And you know what?" "I mean, touring' it." "You know, bring Robin Leach back." "Let him do the intro for it, you know?" "Right, right, right." "(snaps fingers)" "Leach is the man." "(Lacey)" "I love it." "Right now, what's going on in the news is a reali-- we have our first sort of reality star as president, which I know, Mike, you recently said" "As president?" "!" "(Nick)" "He's running." "Let's not push it." "What?" "When did that happen?" "!" "(Lacey)" "I'm sorry!" "(all talking at once)" "It was the second one." "The second one, right?" "Do you know something we don't know?" "When is this airing again?" "(Lacey)" "People are horrified by this." "But the first, yes, reality star candidate." "Yeah." "I'm curious if you think what are the sort of skills that work as a reality star that are perhaps working for him as a candidate." "Transparency." "Or the-- to appear to be so transparent." "Well, no, that's right." "That" "No, the blowing things up, that kinda, that whole" ""I can do this and I can do that, and we're gonna destroy this and we're gonna destroy that."" "(Mike)" "That's true." "And peop" " It's" "And then he gets all of these people going "Yeah!" "Yeah!"" "I think that's the thing where they feel like," ""He's just like me." "I know him." "I've seen him on TV." "he speaks my language."" "(Mark)" "Nobody" " Nobody thinks" "Donald Trump is "just like me."" "No, no, no." "(laughter)" "He's" " He's not talking political" "(Jane)" "I think what they see, is they see the bully on the playground who's saying" ""I'm gonna" " I'm gonna make sure nobody kicks your ass."" "You know, like, "We get to hang out with a bully!"" "(laughter)" "There's a movie coming," "I can tell right now." "I think that's right." "I also think there's a thing about reality television and being a judge or being a host." "When we had J.Lo on "Idol,"" "I think she was-- no one had ever seen her as her, right?" "(Lacey)" "Right." "And I think that they really feel they know him." "Yeah." "That-- whether they know him" "Right, right." "But they feel-- it's different than being an actor." "To be an actor, you're always playing a role." "It's different." "There's a wall up." "This guy has spent 14 seasons, in addition to his other" "In everybody's living room." "His other, his other, news-- you know, everything he's done before that, but people feel like," ""Oh, I know him."" "And" ""He's talking to me."" "Right." "And" " And you know what?" "And he's an outsider." "And I think that is the trend" "That's the key." "That's the key." "There's no question about it." "All right, so Mark, your name gets thrown in" "Yeah, how crazy is that, right?" "But is there any truth to any of that?" "And is that appealing?" "I mean, Chris Sacca was-- recently said that" "I mean your-- your buddy, and, uh, he said that there's-- there's a future in which you will be our, uh-- you will be our president." "I mean, look," "I would talk to Donald, he would call me, all this stuff, and um..." "It" " It's" " It's a different world right now..." "Uh-huh." "...and I think, like-- like you guys were sayin' that it's not so much that they're all for Donald, it's that they're all against what's goin' on right now in Washington and somebody's" "looking' for an alternative." "Now, unfortunately or fortunately, depending on where you're at, it's Donald, right?" "And Donald plays to his strengths." "You know," "I call what he's doin'" ""The Seinfeld Campaign,"" "the campaign about nothing, you know?" "Because all he does is scream and yell, but like you said, you know, the bully's on my side now and nobody else is getting anything done of consequence." "Like, I've gotten into battles with Donald on Twitter and other places, and on TV and all that kinda stuff, and he's just so easy to (bleep) with, right?" "(laughter)" "He's got" "He's got no sense of humility, he's got" "Or humor." "Or humor, right?" "Uh-huh, none." "He's got no humor whatsoever." "So that's what makes him so easy to mess with." "(Lacey)" "Uh-huh." "I did an event, and I said, "Donald's just like the guy who walks into a bar and will say anything to get laid."" "Mm-hmm." "And everybody knows it's true, but he won't come back and mess with me, right?" "He'll go fight whoever else or take on someone else because he knows" "I can slam him." "He's got no sense of humor." "(Lacey)" "Yes." "So, in terms of me being contacted and all this, it's true, but it's like, they know that" "I don't give a (bleep)." "There's nothing he has that I want, there's nothing" "I have no obligations." "I'm" " I'm independent." "I haven't given money to either party." "Yup." "You know, I can just say what" "I think and do what I feel." "And" " And, um" "But could you be the second reality star cont-- uh, candidate?" "Yeah, you know, if you would have asked me... six years ago, four years ago," "I would have said "Hell, no."" "Uh-huh." "Right, but given what's going on, and given, you know, kinda how people feel about everything, you know," "I'm the luckiest guy in the world, and I'm in a position where if I wanted to invest in myself to do something, I could." "And if I wanted to get people behind me to do something," "I could." "It's just a, you know, a question of whether or not" "I can have the greatest impact there..." "Sure." "...or doing what I'm doing." "I'd vote for ya." "I mean, anything's pos" "Yeah, anything's possible, right?" "Anything's possible, but..." "I'd wanna be in your cabinet." "(laughter)" "Yeah, the liquor cabinet, right?" "(laughter)" "Kitchen cabinet, or liquor cabinet." "The liquor cabinet!" "(laughing)" "(Lacey)" "I like it." "Anything's possible." "(Guy)" "Weren't you appointed to the, uh... (LL)" "The liquor cabinet is crazy, though." "We can't just like, we can't-- we can't just gloss over that." ""The liquor cabinet"?" "That's pretty good." "Okay, you know, I'll take either one you give me." "♪♪" "♪♪" "Welcome back to "Close Up" "With The Hollywood Reporter."" "We're here with the power players behind reality TV's best shows." "A lot of you have other careers here." "An actress, an actor, a chef." "What's harder to stomach, a good or a bad review for a show in which you're acting or a reality show in which you're ostensibly playing you?" "I don't read any of it." "And if I see that it has, uh, an opinion about me one way or the other," "I-I push it away." "(Lacey)" "Yeah?" "Yeah, I just have too much fun doing it." "That was the first thing" "I was told." "Yeah." "First thing I was told when" "I got in the business, don't read anything." "If you live for the compliment, you gotta die by the criticism." "Yeah, exactly." "I was actually having this conversation with somebody too, and it's interesting because... there's something about art." "When people judge art, you take it a little more" "(Mark)" "Sure." "Like, if a reality show gets canceled, you'll be like, "So what?" "It's a reality show."" "Like, I've done like... several reality shows that have only done one season and nobody-- they just forget about it 'cause it's just like," ""Oh, that was a reality show."" "If you do a television show that-- a scripted show or a film that gets tanked or... yeah, people are like" "Ooh, they-- they like ex" "(laughter)" "They exile you sometimes." "But it's like a reality show, like, oh yeah, you'll keep goin' until one of them becomes a hit." "(Jane)" "Yeah, till something sticks, yeah." "Yeah." "Reviews of reality shows" "I've always said this" "If you get a good review on a reality show, you've done something wrong." "'Cause they don't like the genre, generally speaking." "I'm not trying to insult anybody... (Lacey)" "Yes." "...but they're-- they don't particularly-- they much prefer to review a drama or a comedy." "One of the great things about the 24-hour news cycle is that whatever is being said about you is goin' away tomorrow." "(LL)" "Yeah." "Tomorrow!" "I remember, I-- 'cause" "I Google Alert myself and" "Dangerous, dangerous thing." "Yeah, it is a dangerous thing to do." "No, but you got to, right, you got to." "I kinda click-click on it and then I go away, but... you know, when-- like," "I had a show get canceled, and for about 26 minutes, it was like... (gasps dramatically) and then, something else got canceled, or then the Kardashians did something, and it goes away," "which is so great." "(Nick)" "That is the beauty of" "That helps in" "I can't decide with you, I mean, so perhaps not for shows-- would you read restaurant reviews?" "That's, that gets in the same thing, yeah." "It happens the same way and-- and you have to take it" "I really take it from the perspective of where's this coming from, what's this really about, and how's this going to impact me?" "You have one of the most famous ones of all time." "Well, when somebody's saying something to me that I can really take and do something with in this reality?" "Mm-hmm." "Then I'm absolutely listening." "But when somebody's not coming at it from-- and they're coming from an ego standpoint, or they're coming in an attack way, then I kinda tune that out." "So that's-- that's really my way about it." "I mean, there's a lot of really good information out there." "My dad's kinda my filter." "My old man comes in my house every morning and says," ""Hey!" "Gotta take a look at this."" "And I'm like, "Dad, I don't wanna read this today."" "He's like, "No, take a look, there some things here that I want you to see, blah blah blah."" "And so those kind of things..." "Mm-hmm." "...or that kind of feedback is important." "But it really comes down to where's the source, what's the timing, and what's the attitude?" "Sure." "How different are you guys from your sort of personalities on television?" "Oh, I don't" "I don't have a persona." "(Jane)" "Yeah, I don't do anything, yeah." "(Lacey)" "It's you." "I'm the same-- same guy." "Oh, I'm a dick in real life." "(laughter)" "Everybody hates me, hates me." "But you're so kind on "Shark Tank."" "Exactly!" "It's that or, you know, rehab my image." "(Jane)" "Yeah. (chuckling)" "Are you?" "I mean, it's funny because people always say, like, the Nick Cannon on "America's Got Talent"" "is completely different from the Nick Cannon on "Wild 'N Out" or-- and it's just like" "But it's the same person." "I'm just" "(Mark)" "It's in context." "You're just speaking to a different audience." "If I'm at a pool-- you're not at a pool party in a tuxedo, right?" "What are they talkin' about?" "So, like, I'm in a suit on NBC, but on MTV, I'm like being a-- yeah!" "(Lacey)" "On "America's Got Talent,"" "you now have Simon Cowell." "He is" " I mean, that is a-- a persona that is so sort of perfected." "Um, he is arguably one of the greatest reality TV personas of all time." "Is that who that guy is?" "See, that's definitely who that guy is." "Yeah." "And he does it so well." "Like, he knows how to engage with people." "There's a reason why people love him, people-- or people love to hate him at times because he speaks his mind, but it's true to who he actually is." "I did see him do a contrived moment." "(Nick)" "Really?" "You know when that-- remember that woman who-- the Scottish woman who sang so beautifully?" "(Nick)" "Susan Boyle." "Right, right, right." "So she comes out onstage, and the audience is like literally booing her 'cause she's ugly." "They like go, "Boo boo!"" "And he's like-- looks at her." "You know, he's contrived." "He's like going... (scoffs)" "And then she starts to sing, and he acted it." "He was like..." "He already knew, yeah!" "I was like," ""Dude, you are acting."" "That was fantastic, by the way." "(all talking at once)" "He knows exactly what he's doing, yeah." "He knows how to do it because he has to do that." "You-- those are 16-hour days." "He has to probably do that eight or nine times during" "So he does contri-- he does contrive" "(Mark)" "Oh yeah." "But, you know-- you know when someone comes out and they're gonna-- you know, they're like," ""Okay, this lady has a good voice but she's a four or a five."" "Yes." "You know what I mean, or something in that sense?" "And it's like, okay, how are we gonna play this?" "And it's not, it's not contrived in a sense because I guarantee you if that audience would have start booing or laughing at her, even if she had a good voice, it would have been a different outcome." "So, the audience had no idea that she was gonna have this amazing voice." "(Jane)" "Really?" "I don't know." "I don't buy that." "Why would the audience" "I think that" "Why would the audience know" "No, but I think it was edited to" "Oh, of course!" "That's what I'm saying, there's 16-hour days and you see a hour of it, so if I'm in the edit and I got a face of Simon going like that, as an editor," "I'm gonna use that." "(Mark)" "We go through the same thing, right?" "So, we start shooting 8:00 in the morning." "They just bring in deal after deal after deal." "Yeah, yeah." "And like, by the end of the day, it's like, "Oh, before this next deal comes up, wake up, mother(bleep),"" "right?" "You know, you've got" "(Lacey)" "Yes!" "You've gotta bring some energy, right?" "'Cause you just looked at 12 deals and you've got to re-energize." "And so, you know, I could see how that would happen." "Do you watch the show and go," ""They used my face here and that wasn't what" "I was thinking at all"?" "(all talking at once)" "Don't tell anybody, but I rarely watch the show 'cause I hate to watch myself." "All right, so, what is it in the food world?" "(Guy)" "Well, when I take" "People walk up and they go," ""Okay, you went to this place" ""and then you went and you had the burger and then you took the-- you didn't really like it."" "I say, "You know what?" "If I didn't like it," "I won't bull(bleep) you."" "If I don't like it, you're either not gonna see it on TV or I'll say something like "It's good."" "I mean, there is," ""This is awesome." "This is the best."" "And when I'm sayin' it, that's" " I'm really that." "I'm not a TV person." "I'm a chef that happened to get a extra paycheck going on to, you know, to do TV shows." "I mean, you gotta be a chef." "You think it's important?" "You gotta know" "You gotta know how to-- you gotta know what it is, you gotta know how it's made, you gotta know what it tastes-- you gotta do all those components, and then you have to be able to project it." "So, it's kind of-- anybody that's in an artist's field, you have to be great at what you do to be able to go try to become great at anything else." "So the foundation has to be true." "(LL)" "Mastery." "And I seek" "Mastery, that-- that's right on." "That's what I love about the cooking shows is that these guys-- you know, I'm not tasting it-- that you guys and girls are-- really know what they're doing." "Yeah, we break-- we break it down." "I bridge things, 'cause a chef'll be able to-- he'll tell me this piece and then he'll tell me that piece, and he'll segment it." "Well, I know what it takes to make the dish." "So, he'll tell me this, and I'll say, "And then we'll put it in the mix--"" ""And then we'll put it in the mixer."" "And then, you know, and then he gives his piece, so I don't have anything else to give you." "I mean, I'm-- what you see is what you get." "I mean, I've known a couple of these guys that" "Mark, you know me, we've known for a few years." "I act the same way on, off" "All the time, yeah, all the time, yeah." "That's what I tell about Cuban." "That's why" "I was gonna put him in charge of liquor cabinet, right?" "(laughter)" "Margarita Day." "Promises." "♪♪" "♪♪" "Welcome back to "Close Up" "With The Hollywood Reporter."" "We're taking a look at the reality behind unscripted television." "So what's the most frustrating trend to have emerged in the genre in recent years?" "(Guy)" "Ringers." "Ringers." "Oh, ringers." "Yeah, in the food world, in food competition shows, we have people that have been on in multiple shows and... (Lacey)" "Makin' the rounds." "Then they come in with a little" ""I know how production works and I got this..."" "and you're like," ""Oh, boy..."" "You know, I gotta" "So that's a little tough." "Well, arrogance is frustrating, period." "Right?" "You know what I mean?" "Well-played." "I think in reality in general, it's the lowest common denominator type thing that we're trying to appeal to." "And the freakier, the better, and the, you know" "What's wrong with that?" "(Mike)" "I like that." "I was gonna say!" "That's a great trend!" "I may be alone here on an island, but, yeah." "There is a little exploitation." "I think the worst" " Yeah." "Yeah, yeah." "(Mike)" "For me, the worst trend is no innovation." "Uh, people going back to stuff that was 15 years ago or 12 years ago, and I think if anything gives the genre a bad name, it's that sense of there's a lazy-- it's kind of a "laziness"" "about some of the shows." "And you feel like," ""Oh, this is just" "'Survivor' done for the 18th time."" "And I think the audience is tired of it." "They want to see something new, or at least something that tries to be new." "On "Shark Tank," that's the part I hate the worst." "I'm on a business show." "(Nick)" "Right." "(Lacey)" "Mm, right." "I mean, when I went on," "I went on as a guest, right?" "And they had been bounced from Tuesday night to Sunday night, then on Friday night, which was death." "(Lacey)" "Mm-hmm." "And then it-- it just caught fire." "But, you know, we're gettin' knocked off, you know?" "It's like how uncreative can you possibly be?" "On your own network!" "(all talking at once)" "Yeah, it's just like, you know, "Fish Tank."" "(all talking at once)" "A tank, right?" "Look, it'll make itself." "All right, so one of the genres that has emerged and has done very well is the sort of kids' space." "Does that make you nervous, or do you feel like the industry can handle it?" "I hope so, because, you know, when you're over 18 and you step into this stuff and you're a-- you're an idiot, that's one thing." "But when you're just a kid and you-- yo, you gotta be careful with that." "And animals." "Kids and animals, don't do it." "I think Holl-- even Hollywood knows when to draw the line." "(Lacey)" "You do?" "Yes." "You trust" "Hollywood?" "No, I wouldn't." "I don't know about that." "No, with little kids?" "With little kids?" "A friend" " I have a 12-year-old daughter, right?" "And one of her friends is on "the track,"" "left school, went with her parents out to L.A." "(LL)" "Modeling or TV?" "Music and TV." "Oh, music, no." "(all talking at once)" "You can't do both." "Yeah, but music is different." "Now, music has no line." "(Mike)" "There's no rules." "Yeah, yeah." "None, right?" "But, you know, but they're gonna do this show or that show and, you know, you know how they get pimped out." ""Oh, we're gonna make you a star."" ""We're gonna put you on this show."" "And it's just-- it's scary." "Well, what I mean by Hollywood knowing' to draw the line, and I agree with what you're sayin', is that hopefully, your parents have your best interests at heart, and have some experience." "Because a "dad-a-ger"" "or a "mom-a-ger"" "with no experience can be as bad for your career..." "Exactly." "...as it is, you know, as a great manager could be good for your career." "(Lacey)" "Yep." "Right, but..." "As long as they have people around them that are trustworthy and really insulate them, there are a lot of protections in place on the television side to make life really good for kids." "Yeah, there are rules." "There are rules, on the television side." "Now, if you talkin' about music?" "Man, listen." "Game over?" "Listen, listen, you-- you're comin' in, your kid-- your kid'll be in a hammock of hashish, like goin' back and forth," ""Look, Mommy!" "Look what they give me as a gift!"" "(laughter)" "You know what I mean?" ""Do a remix!"" "(laughter)" "You know what I'm saying?" "You know what I mean?" "So, you know." "(Nick)" "My thing I always go to-- 'cause they're there to have fun." "When you're a child, you just wanna have fun." "When it starts to become work..." "Mm-hmm." "...that's when it goes wrong." "I get sad a lot of times when you see these kids that are there, like, they don't wanna be there." "They wanna be playing." "Do you encounter that," "Mike?" "Well, no one knows this at the table but I was a child actor for, uh, I think..." "I knew that!" "...for like a dozen years." "Which show?" "Oh, my God, if I go back," "Oh, my God." "Which show?" "I wanna hear this." "Yeah!" ""Kojak," "Sanford and Son,"" ""Knot's Landing," I mean," "I'm dating myself." "(all talking at once)" "I did an NBC sit-com." "(laughter)" "I did-- like, like" "I did, I worked quite a lot." "How old were you?" "What" "From age 10 to about 20." "Uh-huh." "Um, and it's all about the parents." "My parents-- um, I motivated it, but they were not mom-a-gers, they were not, you know," "I didn't have that." "But I met many kids who did not have those parents." "Yeah." "And were pushing them." "And that's why" "I do believe there's-- a lot of these kids end up in trouble." "(Nick)" "Amazing." "Right." "And then, when you start to exploit your children, then you just switch the whole paradigm." "(Lacey)" "You cross a line." "You know what I mean?" "Now, the kids are gonna be talking to you a little differently than they would-- 'cause they're not dumb." "They can see when" "Mommy and Daddy are trying to do this for a certain reason." "It's not love involved, you know." "I've had my kids on, uh, on my shows, and I've also had a couple kids' shows, cooking shows, and uh, I see that same thing, the mom-a-ger, and you see some parents" "are pushin' their kids a lot and the others are just there for the experience, and so..." "But I do think that there's a lot of things in place" "I'm just saying from the TV side of it-- that, you know, we could only work a few, you know, a certain amount of hours and then they had school." "(Jane)" "Mm-hmm." "(LL)" "Yeah." "And we had teachers onboard, and then there were certain requirements about what the kids were eating." "You know, I believe that there is a certain drive for certain people to do it." "But I think that that should be developed inside of the kid." "(Lacey)" "Mm-hmm." "I think the kid should be the one coming forth and saying" ""I wanna do it."" "And not the parents, they railroad it, yeah." "You know, 'cause my-- my kids love it." "Like, they're around it and I was like, oh, you could kinda tell and even as-- 'cause it's not me." "There's not a microphone they don't love, you know?" "(laughter)" "They-- they're grabbing' it." "(Lacey)" "They have the right parents, yes!" ""Are we on the air?"" "Poom, poom, poom." "Exactly!" "But, it's like" ""All right, have fun with it."" "This is not a job." "When you got-- you gotta keep it up on everything else too, right?" "You gotta do good in your school work." "Would you do a "Shark Tank:" "Kids"?" "No, you can't." "You just can't because" "I was developing one!" "(laughter)" "You'd do it, right?" "But, um, you can't, 'cause what are you gonna say?" ""That idea sucks," right?" "And you just" "The worst thing we can do is tell somebody they have something good, they go out and put everything they have in it, and it's horrible." "It is a fine line." "I picked up "Master Chef Junior"" "before I left Fox." "You know," "I said to Gordon," ""You're gonna have to treat them like adults" ""to get it to work." "You just have to be cautious on--"" "so Gordon can still be Gordon, but not really." "Right?" "So, it's gotta" "You've gotta really be" "It's a" "It's a real delicate line." "Fine line." "I remember the kids really well." "You gotta pay attention to where they're at and know what kid can handle what level and what language is gonna work and what way, and which style, and what method." "They're smart." "If you're in that level as a kid, doing that type of competition" "We had these little chefs that are comin' in that can really cook, so the thing is, is they're able to handle but you just have to really pick how you're gonna talk to each one." "♪♪" "♪♪" "Welcome back to "Close Up" "With The Hollywood Reporter."" "We're talking with the game-changers behind reality TV's best shows." "Going back to, in your own lives, who was your favorite teacher in school and why?" "Favorite teacher?" "Yeah." "Uh, my favorite teacher was my gym teacher." "Uh, you know," "Mr. Asher." "Why?" "Uh, because... my favorite classes in school were gym and lunch." "(laughter)" "I'm with you!" "You know?" "So..." "Mr. Asher used to walk around with a plastic bat and say "Clack!" "Get in line!"" "And it just worked for me." "I just liked him, you know what I mean?" "He was just like an alpha male and it just worked for me, like, what he was doin'." "Oh, man." "You know, and he-- he was very smart and, you know, strategic." "He would hire the bullies to get the class to behave, so that we could all play." "Were you-- were you one of the bullies?" "No, no, not at all." "Which side were you on?" "I was actually, no," "I was always a kid that" "Bullies didn't mess with me, but I liked to hang out with the nerds and talk to them because they were more interesting." "They had stuff they were saying." "Bullies didn't bother me," "I mean, you know." "They don't bother me." "I'm harmless." "I love it." "Was there a teacher for you?" "Interestingly enough," "I wouldn't say" "He was definitely a teacher, but it was, uh, my martial arts instructor," "Master Wilson." "I've taken martial arts since I was five." "And it's interesting becau-- you know, he was like, literally, like, the stereotypical guy that was like, very stern, and like the" ""Punch me in my belly!"" "type of thing." "But he" "But, it was like, those principles that" "I didn't even know that I was, you know, consuming at a-- at five, it was like, integrity, perseverance, and hard work." "Those things last with you forever." "They do." "And it's like," ""Oh, man I didn't--"" "Stick it out." "Yeah, you know what I mean?" "It's like I use those same principles today and even have my kids in martial arts now because of those things, because you just think you're having fun kicking and punching" "Yep." "But then like, it's actually making you very disciplined and putting you in a" "Showin' up on time." "I did martial arts, yeah." "(LL)" "I had that same experience." "Yeah.Yeah." "What were you like as kids?" "I was like this." "(laughter)" "I absolutely believe it!" "There's no question about it." "There's no doubt about it." "I'll be honest, there's people who knew me in school." "Everybody recognizes me," "I never" "(laughter)" ""You went to school with me--"" "(laughter)" "What can I say?" "Same beard and everything?" "Almost, and the same height for sure." "(laughter)" "But the truth is that's the truth." "I have not changed over the years." "People seem to..." "What kind of kids were you guys?" "I was, uh, probably a little more shy version of what you're seeing today." "Um, uh, but basically," "I've been kinda t he same person too." "Mm-hm?" "Yeah." "Little more" "I have more confidence now." "(Guy)" "I'm the same way." "I've been the same-- just a grown-up version of it." "I don't know how much grown up, but taller." "And uh, but I was an entrepreneur as a kid." "I was always into business." "I had some kind of business going at some time, and uh, I had a pretzel cart that I had on the back of a three-wheel bike." "My dad helped me build it in fifth grade, and I sold hot pretzels." "We didn't have those on the West Coast back then." "That was like a big thing." "Where at on the West Coast?" "Here, in Northern California-- we're in Southern, but Northern California." "It was called" "The Awesome Pretzel Cart." "And my foundation, we make the carts now and give 'em to kids for fundraising projects." "But it wasn't the money." "It was I like making people happy, I liked cooking." "I cooked at a young age." "I cooked for my parents when I was ten." "So, same guy." "Same, what you see is what you got." "Little fatter." "I'll give you all you need to know about my school days." "I was a lot shorter." "I didn't really grow until after I left high school, and a lot heavier." "I had" " I was playing baseball one day, and I ran into a bike and it broke these two teeth at the bottom and my parents made me get silver caps, right?" "Oh!" "Yeah, metallic because we could" "I had big glasses, right?" "Oh, Jesus." "Yeah." "So I" "Looked like a gangsta." "No, trust me, no." "No one was paying-- no one knew who I was, and so." "(LL)" "Whoadie." "(laughter)" "So, yeah, I kinda grew out." "It's so bad, like, when people went back and found my high school yearbook?" "Uh-huh?" "And they circled who they thought I was, they circled the wrong person, right?" "And you were happy about it, you didn't correct it." "No, I was fine with it, but still, yeah, it was a big change." "All right, so," "Arnold Schwarzenegger obviously is taking over" ""The Apprentice", and he has to come up with a catch-phrase that rivals "You're fired."" "Got any for him?" "(all talking at once)" "That's easy, hasta la vista, baby!" "You won't be back." "You're terminated." "You're terminated." "Can't we get anything more clever for him, come on?" "I know he said-- he recently said," ""Let's get back to business"" "on someplace." "So I know he's using" "I don't know if that's-- obviously, that's not the "fired"." "I don't think that's the firing, yes." "I'm hoping that they're trying to come up with something that's not as obvious as the ones we have." "Ha ha ha!" "Do we want to give him any ideas?" "Anything that you say in the accent" "Holla!" "(laughter)" "Anything in the accent is gonna be perfect." "(imitating Arnold)" "Holl-lah." "Holl-ah." "Holl-ah back." "(laughing)" "Holla back!" "Holla back." "I love it." "I think we've done it." "Thank you guys all for being here." "(all talking at once)" "Fantastic." "Thanks for having us." "Thank you." "You're welcome." "Cheers." "(all talking at once)" "I'd want a badge." "(laughter)"