"[silence]" "[ominous music ♪] [metal jangling] [slow footsteps]" "♪♪" "[dog barking in distance]" "Hey!" "Hey!" "Hey!" "[barking continues]" "Hey!" "Hey!" "[District Attorney] Good afternoon, Mr. Ward." "[Delbert] Afternoon." "[DA] You live up on Johnson Road?" "[Delbert] Yes." "[DA] You live there all your life?" "[Delbert] Yes, lived there all my life." "[DA] And you said you had a few brothers." "[Delbert] Yes." "[DA] Roscoe, Lyman, William?" "[Delbert] Yes." "[clears throat]" "[DA] Remember this question, Mr. Ward, from the statement..." ""How do you feel about his pain?"" "Remember that question being asked?" "[Delbert] Yes, I remember that question being" "[DA] Remember the answer?" ""I felt that he should go to the doctors." "My feelings were, that I felt Bill would be better off away from his pain, so he wouldn't be in pain and hollering anymore."" "[Delbert] Well, I remember that." "[DA] You gave that statement, right?" "[Delbert] Yes." "[DA] Remember this question?" ""After Bill went to sleep, what did you decide to do?"" "[Delbert] Yes, I remember that question." "[DA] Remember giving this answer?" ""I decided to put my hand over his mouth." "I reached around behind him with my right hand and put it over his mouth." "He struggled for a little bit, but then stopped." "I wanted to make sure that Bill wasn't suffering anymore, that he was dead."" "[Delbert] Yes, I remember that a" "[DA] You remember giving that answer?" "[Delbert] I remember giving that answer, after they showed me how I done it down there and told me how I done it." "[DA] Remember this question?" ""How long was your hand over his mouth?"" "[Delbert] Yes." "[DA] Answer, "About five minutes."" "[Delbert] That's what they told me." "[DA] Th-That's the answer you gave." "[Delbert] That's the answer they told me, then I agreed with 'em." "[cows mooing]" "♪♪ [horse snorting]" "[leaves rustling]" "[birds chirping]" "[car driving by]" "Today, Delbert Ward is living in the Madison County Jail." "Accused of killing his brother and roommate." "State police report the body of 64-year-old William Ward was found in his bed at 5:30 yesterday morning." "An autopsy showed he had been suffocated." "Police believe 59-year-old Delbert Ward committed the crime." "Authorities don't yet know a motive." "Everybody in Munnsville knows the Ward boys." "Bill and Delbert used to ride this green tractor into town every day, and their brothers," "Lyman and Roscoe, they'd take the red one." "Good evening, everyone." "A man accused of killing his brother out of mercy is out of jail tonight." "As Christie Casciano tells us, an entire community stood behind the dairy farmer and, for Delbert Ward, that means freedom." "[Female Reporter] The story of Delbert Ward starts here." "Ward lived and farmed here with his three brothers for most of his life." "But, life for Delbert Ward changed on June sixth, when his 64-year-old brother, William died of suffocation." "Today, a judge set bail for Delbert Ward and Delbert's friends posted bail." "After three weeks, Delbert Ward was released from jail." "[Male Reporter] What are you gonna do first?" "Goin' home to relax." "So, Delbert Ward has cleared his first hurdle with the law." "Even though the battle isn't over just yet," "Delbert Ward says he has faith in the justice system." "In Madison County, Donna Speziale." "News Center 5." "[Male Interviewer] Do you enjoy this work?" "Sure." "Always done it." "What do you like about it?" "Well, the smell of the hay." "[stammering]" "If you was around here when you first cut it, you get the smell of it." "It smells good." "What are you thinking about now, Delbert?" "I ain't thinkin'." "Just watchin' him." "So, if he breaks down, I go help him, if he breaks anything." "How long is this gonna take?" "[crickets chirping]" "Gosh, it's hard to say." "If you get it all on one load or not." "He don't go too fast." "Do you mind that we're making a film about you?" "No." "Don't bother me." "He went natural." "Bill died naturally?" "He, uh..." "He went natural, 'cause he lost a lot of weight." "[goat bleating]" "And he always complained that his feet bothering' him." "He always walked lame." "Yup." "[indistinct mumbling]" "'Cause he-he-he got awful thin." "He lost a lot of weight." "How was he the week before?" "Huh?" "How was he the week before?" "The week before he died." "How was Bill?" "Not too hot." "Well, you see, back years ago, he got cut with a chainsaw." "And that, that always bothered him." "What happened?" "Couldn't shut it off." "With the chainsaw, what happened?" "It cut him." "What did the police say to you when you were alone in the room with them?" " Do you remember?" " No." "'Cause I was all shook up." "Worse than I am now." " How was it then?" " Huh?" "How was it then?" " Oh, I was bad down there." " Why is that?" "Well, 'cause I'm nervous, [indistinct mumbling] said not to bother me." " You were nervous." " Yeah." "Well, they said you could have a stroke or heart attack, you're gone." "Hm." "We're not making you nervous, are ya?" "Everything makes me nervous." "'Cause always was, ever since-- [indistinct]" " Everything makes you nervous?" "Yep." "Ever since you were a little kid?" "Yep, always nervous." "Why is-- do you remember what was the..." "I don't know..." "'Cause I was probably born to be nervous." "You were born to be nervous?" "Probably." "I ain't the only ones nervous, there's lot of guys around here's nervous." "Like, who else is nervous?" "Spend [indistinct] these farmers, you get nervous." "What makes you nervous?" "Me?" "I don't know, always been nervous." "All my life." "So, that's what I'm gonna do." "♪♪ [indistinct mumbling]" "[dog barking in distance]" "When we were down in the courthouse, we, we went down just to look." "Didn't have any idea what we were getting into." "And when they posted it, the judge said that he would let him out on $10,000 bail." "And we went down, I went down, she sat in a seat up there and I went down where the lawyer was explaining it to us, 'cause we're a bunch of dummies, you know, we didn't know, understand the procedure." "And the lawyer said, we gotta scrape up $10,000, so I went back to where she sat and I said, "Mom," I said," ""you got your checkbook with you?"" " Yep." " And she says, "Yes."" "And I said, "Jesus Christ, make out a check for a thousand dollars."" "She says, "What for?"" "And I says..." ""They're doin' a lot of talkin' down there, they gotta scrape up $10,000 and nobody..." "They're doin' a lot of iffin' and andin', but no money."" "So, I took down the check, hand to Charlie." "I said, "Charlie, here's a start for the 10,000."" "It touched the ball off." "Hell, we had 10,000 inside of" "That's how they got our picture." " ...ten, fifteen minutes." "Hell, it wouldn't hurt any more if it'd been my kid." " Because..." " You wouldn't believe it." "W-W-We knew that..." "The kid, you know, we've known him all our life." "He isn't a kid, but he's younger than we are." "Well, Christ, he's 60 years old," "A lot younger, a lot younger." " ...and we're 80." "Hell of a lot of difference." "And after they got his whiskers off, he looked younger." "Yeah." "He looked like Jesus Christ when they when they brought him in." "I imagine he's got 'em on again." "Did you see him before he had his whiskers?" "[Interviewer] Yeah." "He made me think of Jesus Christ all of a... i-in a way, you know." "Not that he was that big a saint, or anything, you know, but, uh, he was never any hell raiser." "[crickets chirping]" "The DA, I think, he wants to be elected again next term." "[Mr. Bishopp] Well, I'll tell you something..." "And this is..." "They're just trying to blow this thing way up." "It's a, it's a political thing, that's what it is." "It's somebody to make a big name out of it." "They pick on somebody like this, you know, that, uh, nobody'd think anything about it, you know." "Yeah." " Well, they figured they'd put him away." "Sure." "Put him away, and then... and, put the other two in a home somewhere and that'd be it, you know." "Forget about 'em." " Yeah." "[Mrs. Landers] But don't you think that Bill really just died because he was sick?" "Lyman said, at night, Bill..." "was choking and coughing." "Yeah." "He was coughing." "He was coughing bad." "Yeah." "Yes, but if somebody put their hand over your mouth, would you fight him a little bit?" "Why, Bill, Bill was a lot stronger than Delbert." "I think so, too." " Delbert couldn't do that!" " Art went up there..." "Not if Bill didn't want him to." "There's no possible way." "They said he'd been dead since midnight." "That's right." "And, and he, he's gonna kill his own brother and then sleep side of him the rest of the night until five o'clock in the morning?" "That's, that's right!" "That's right." "It's just unbelievable what... what they're trying to pull and what they're trying to do." "[dog barking]" "♪♪" "[Interviewer] Delbert, what happened the morning Bill died?" "[Delbert] Well, I got up, I went outdoors," "I come back in to put my boots or shoes on." "I hollered at him, he didn't answer me, and I went in there, and that's... where he laid." "He was gone." "He died, so..." "I got Roscoe up." "I just looked at him." "I didn't touch him or nothing, just looked at him, I see he was gone." "[Interviewer] Did he have a pillow over his head?" "No!" "Did not!" "Didn't have nothing, only a blanket." "It come up to about here on him." "He had a pillow under his head." "Laying on it, laid his head on it, and he had one arm out like, he laid like that, just as though he was sleeping." "I can tell when a person is dead." "[chuckling] You could, too." "I didn't know what was the matter 'til I got up there, and I see he was dead." "Took hold of his arm, his arm was flimsy." "It wasn't stiff, but it was flimsy." "Kind of cool, he wasn't cold, but he was cool." "You could tell that his arm was cold." "It was cool." "I didn't say cold." "Cool." "Shit, I don't think he's been dead too long." "Th-That was six o'clock." "[John Teeple] The, um, EMT people arrived, and it's kind of interesting in... a country setting like this, if the EMT comes, everybody in the Volunteer Fire Department shows up, all of whom knew the boys of course." "I hate to call 'em "boys." It's..." "They're known that way i-in the county, but... and I'm-I'm pretty sure they don't think it's a put down, but it feels like one to me." "The morning that Bill died, um, John had called me, and I went right over and I was there like ten minutes after he'd called me." "And I said to Delbert," ""Would you like John and I, what would you like John and I to do?" "Would you like us to do the chores here this morning for ya?" "Help you out this morning or something?"" "And Delbert says," ""I would like you and John to go get a dark suit and a while shirt and a tie... for Bill."" "[crickets chirping]" "And he cried." "After they left that morning, the police were certain it was a natural death." "No question in-in their mind." "[sniffling]" "What happened later, apparently, is that the, uh... they did an autopsy." "They did it in about four hours, which, at least, I've been told, is really not long enough for a, a thorough autopsy." "And I judge the first thing they found that was really suspicious, they stopped, so the police came out here again, and took all three brothers down to the barracks and questioned them, and held Delbert," "who's confessed." "[dogs barking]" "[Interviewer] What happened that night that they were af-- all those men in uniforms were asking you questions?" "What happened that night?" "Huh?" "The night all those men were asking you questions, what happened that night?" "You said you were in, in with the police, what happened that night?" "What kind of questions did they ask you?" "Well, they wanted to know if you heard any arguments, any noise, and they wanted to know if we heard any guns or rifles or anything go off." "I told them, "No."" "Do you think Delbert killed Bill?" "That's what they figured, but... don't nobody believe it." "Just ain't nothing to it." "[stammering] But everybody I talk to tells it." "What else, what else did they ask you that night?" "Did they make you sign something?" "Did you have to sign a paper?" "Just your name." "I wouldn't sign nothin', but just my name." "They asked you to sign your name?" "Yep." "Did you read what you signed?" "Yes... it was... 'bout, 'bout the murder and stuff." "Brother Bill, yeah, that's..." "They had that on there." "[Delbert] You didn't read no papers down there." "Not right out loud." "One cop did." "He says, "There anything to it?"" "I said, "No."" "Delbert, can Roscoe read?" "Not very good, I don't think." "I don't think he read it." "Oh, yeah." "They was awful quizzy, but..." "I didn't know nothing about it." "What do you think's gonna happen now?" "Well, they figured Delbert killed him." "There was nothin' to it." "Not true?" "No, not true." "It's not true." "Just as I said, and always will, he went on his own." "[Captain Loszynski] After, uh, doing the preliminary investigation, which was in the early morning hours of June sixth, uh, I received a phone call at approximately 5:30 PM from the Medical Examiner's office in Syracuse" "regarding the cause and manner of death of William Ward." "Uh, the call was from Doctor Germaniuk, in which he explained that he had discovered certain medical evidence which suggest that the death was of suspicious origin, and that we should proceed with a investigation, uh," "regarding the circumstances uh, of William Ward's, uh, death." "[dog barking in distance] [ominous music ♪]" "[District Attorney] You telling us you told the truth to this jury today?" "[Delbert] Yes." "I'm telling you, I told the truth." "You telling us... that you didn't kill your brother?" "I didn't kill him." "Sir, in your statement, you admit to killing your brother." "I know I did, but I didn't know what I was saying." "Sir, this was your best friend, and you told the police that night that you killed him." "Yes, I told the police that, that night." "That was the truth that night when you told them?" "No, 'cause it wasn't really the truth 'cause I didn't know what I was sayin'." "You know the difference between a truth and a lie, don't you?" "Maybe, maybe not." "[wooden leg squeaking]" "There's a lot of history in this place." "I seen some of the kids I grew up with on my way in." "[Interviewer] Do you know where it is?" "No, not for sure." "It's, it's a wooden one, though, right?" "We heard it's a wooden heart." "[birds chirping]" "[wooden leg squeaking]" "Christ, there's a lot of people here I know." "That one right there must be it." "People shouldn't be treated that way just 'cause they're stupid." "Not really stupid, uneducated." "Now, any investigator in his right mind, when they started interrogating these boys shoulda known" "that they didn't have the schooling' and the stuff to enable them to do anything without an attorney." "Shoulda known it." "They're intelligent people, but yet, they questioned them all without an attorney, and Delbert, to this day, don't know what the hell" ""to waive his rights" means." "It's just some words to him." "I said, "What did you waive Delbert?"" "I ask him straight out." "I said, "when you did that?"" ""I don't know."" "That's his answer." "I asked him again last week, I says," ""What did you waive when you waived your rights?"" "He still don't know." "He waived his rights, but he don't know what the hell he waived." "That might've been somebody walking' down the street he was wavin' at." "That's the truth." "I mean, it's foolish as it sounds, it's-it's the God's honest truth." "So, how can you charge somebody like that?" "How could you took the statement to begin with from him like that without having a lawyer present?" "The confession of Delbert, uh, which was obtained here at the barracks, um, consisted upon, or consisted of, uh," "Delbert telling State Police investigators that, uh... uh, he had thought about, um, killing William, uh, because of, uh, the suffering that he had, uh, observed Wi-William going through over the last several months," "uh, and he focused in on extreme headaches and stomach problems, and he had a problem with his foot that the cow had stepped on, and he based, basically, his-his criminal conduct, in killing William," "on the fact that, uh, he felt William was going through, uh, an extreme amount of pain, and that, uh, he felt that, uh, he would kill his brother for these reasons." "[wind blowing]" "[Interviewer] Roscoe, what's your best memory of Bill?" "Roscoe?" "Huh?" "What's your best memory of Bill?" "Huh?" "What's your best memory of Bill?" "Best band?" "[laughing]" "I didn't hear ya, now." "[Delbert] He don't hear you." "[Lyman] He can't hear nothing." "Huh?" "[Interviewer] I-I didn't understand." "What was your best memory of him?" "Huh?" "What's your... [laughing] It's okay if you're on the film, Joe." "[Interviewer, Joe] I-I don't wanna be in the film." "I'm gonna stay here, and you stay here, okay?" "And just tell me what your best memory of Bill is." "The best memory?" "Well, we went to Oneida." "We got our groceries." "He got his stuff he wanted for to fix his water." "Done all his chores, had supper, and went to bed about, about nine o'clock, wasn't it, Delbert?" "Around nine o'clock or a little after, [metal jangling] and I thought I was gonna see him the next morning, and I didn't." "How'd you feel about that?" "Bad." "'Cause he's gone." "If somebody put hands, put their hands over his mouth, he'd have to have marks on him wouldn't he?" "And he didn't have no marks on him." "[crickets chirping]" "[Interviewer] They said there was a pillow over his face." "Well, they put that over there." "Who put the pillow over him?" "The police, I think." "[cat mewing]" "'Cause the... the first time I, they show me his pictures, he laid just the way I found him, with nothing over him." "Then they took me down there to the courthouse again, and that's when they showed him with a... pillow over, over his face." "Why would the police put a pillow over Bill's face?" "Well, 'cause they want this right here." "Right here." "They want this land." "We know, for a fact, that two of the State Troopers who interviewed a neighbor of Delbert's, in addition to asking about the case, asked if the neighbor was willing to sell his property." "Now, you've gotta remember that we're talking about an area in Madison County that's right on the, the edge of becoming a very, very suburban type of an area, so that these farms a-are worth a lot of money" "to a developer." "If it's true... it's one of the most disgusting things that I've seen as a, as an attorney in-in 13 or 14 years." "To think that somebody, uh, for purely monetary gain, would, uh, convince somebody t-t-to write a confession, or even worse, put words into his mouth." "I cannot fathom that there would be any reason whatsoever for anybody to want to have acquired that land, other than another farmer to use it as farm land." "Uh, and to suggest that any of the State Police officers involved in the investigation would even consider doing something like that is just ludicrous." "♪♪" "[Jerry Reid] If anybody ever grew up on a farm, when a cow has a calf, a lot of times, they get paralyzed in their backsides, and they have trouble gettin' up, and if you don't make 'em get up," "they can't clean themselves of afterbirth." "So, it's a very common practice amongst any and all farmers," "to hold the nostrils and the mouth of a cow that's down, and once she gets short of breath, she'll just jump right up, and she'll be healthy as ever." "I still feel, from the beginning, that that's all that Delbert was trying to do was to treat his brother like a cow because that's all he knew." "He was just trying to make him get up and go, I think." "I have no qualms in my mind, he died in his sleep." "For these guys, time stopped... back in the days when they were growing up." "They were poor." "Uh, if they had an animal in pain... the animal, they wouldn't let the animal suffer, they'd put it out of its misery." "That's the type of thing, that's the way they think, and... for two brothers who loved each other like they did, to... for one to watch the other in pain, day after day after day, uh... you know, it's very likely that the man, you know," "they agreed between themselves, I'm sure, and Delbert didn't wanna see him suffer anymore, and he took his life." "♪♪" "[Interviewer] You looking forward to tonight?" "[Roscoe] Yeah." "You gonna dance?" "I'm gonna dance." "Are you gonna dance?" "Yeah." "Did you get a shave today?" "Who, me?" "Yeah." "I cut 'em off." "Why?" "For tonight." "They got a little too long." "What got too long?" "Whiskers." "So, you cut 'em off?" "I did." "I didn't get 'em all, but I got," "I got the most of 'em." "♪♪" "[Roscoe] Hi!" "[Woman] You're Lyman." "Lyman's right out there, he's comin'." " Oh, you're Roscoe." " Right." " Want me to help ya?" " No." "Oh, I will." "I should know all these boys by now." "I know it, I know it." "We're cousins." "That's right." "Oh, but you don't cry." "[Interviewer] What's for, what's for dinner?" "Well, we got a little bit of everything, whatever you wish." "Baked beans, scalloped potatoes..." "Fruit salad, macaroni salad." "I'll tell you something I bet you've never had, barbecued venison in the crock pot." "Barbecued venison?" "Yeah." "[overlapping chatter]" "[Reporter] Delbert, laugh!" "[laughing]" " Yep." "What do you think of this whole, uh, this whole party put together for you?" "I think it's good." "Why do you think they're doing all this?" "To help me, they're all my good friends." "All these people, obviously, are behind you in saying you didn't kill your brother." "That's right, I didn't." "You didn't." "A lot of people are saying, if you did..." "I mean, a lot of people who are supporting you are saying, well, they don't know if you did or didn't, but if you did, it was a mercy killing." "Any response to that?" "I don't think much about it." "We believe this man is innocent, and that's why, uh, we're at this party." "We believed it right from the very beginning, and we always will believe it." "[Interviewer] Why?" "This is not the type of man to commit such a, a vicious crime." "He, he's just not built that way." "He's a, an easy going, lovable individual, and I sincerely believe that this man will be acquitted, and my wife believes the same thing." "Did-Did you know him?" "Do I know him?" "Well, my, uh, my nephew... is... that's-that's-that would be his uncle, and I've met him before, a few times, and he's a very, very fine talking, uh, individual," "who never should've been arrested at no time." "Okay." "Coming in three, two..." "A murder trial is nothing that unusual for central New York." "What is unusual here is the national media attention this is getting, and the crowds of people who have come out to support the accused killer." "One more." "A murder case is nothing that unusual for central New York." "What is unusual here is the national media attention this is getting, and the crowds of people who have come out to support the accused killer." "[country music playing ♪] [people whooping]" "Two...one..." "Delbert Ward will return to Madison County Courthouse next week, so attorneys on both sides can present evidence to the judge." "Friends here seem optimistic, but they say it's frustrating to know that, despite all their efforts, all they can really do is sit and wait." "Allison Alexander, News Center." "[party chatter]" "♪♪" "I really think that most people thought that they minded their own business." "They were different." "As long as they didn't step on your feet, why the hell were you gonna step on theirs?" "Well now, like, going in down to the confections store, or whatever to eat," "I kind of hate to eat after they did, wouldn't you?" "You wouldn't, you know..." " You know, wouldn't..." "You wouldn't go right down and plunk your ass down on the same table that they were sitting at." "Same chair..." "You'd move over a little bit, 'cause hell, uh, the smell." "Might get the best of ya." "You know they sweat..." " [Mrs. Geisler laughing]" "They worked and, hell, I don't think they changed their clothes in maybe six months, unless they..." " No." "...went to a funeral or something like that." "But they went, uh... the girls' weddings." " Yeah." "And then they were dressed up." " Yeah." "[Interviewer] And yet, you helped them." "That's right, and I'd, I'd help 'em again." "Yeah, they went to the, to the girls' weddings," "Hell, they're a part of this damn community." " 'cause we did, too." "We've never had a murder here, as I ever remember." "There's always been this antagonism between the big city a-and the rural areas." "You know, if, if you are born in the rural area and make it good, it must mean you go to the city and make it good." "It's not, you go down the road and start your own business." "It's, you go to the city and make it big." "And city people, I think, are inclined to look at country people as bumpkins." "As, uh... probably not terribly bright, and maybe, not awfully strongly moti--motivated, and nothing can be further from the truth if you see, see the way some of these farmers work," "and I suspect the city stereotype is probably within the heads of the BCI and the District Attorney, and they probably don't know it, it's just, it's part of the culture that you think rural area is that way, you see," "and I-I think..." "I think, maybe... that... part of the drawing together of Munnsville behind Delbert is that the "We against Them,"" "them being the, in quotes, "Big City DA,"" "trying to get poor Delbert up there on the hills." "♪♪" "[car honking]" "[Thurston] The boys never got any attention before." "When they had them dances and stuff for him down here and put on the benefits, to Delbert, that was a party." "He didn't realize, I don't think, that we was trying to raise money for his defense so he wouldn't go to prison." "Nobody'd ever give the Ward boys a party." "Not ever in their life." "So, here, all of a sudden, is all these goddamn people crowded around and giving him a big party and Delbert's dancing, the first time in his life." "[cow mooing]" "People coming up and asking him to dance, and hell, they wouldn't have danced with him before, for Christ's sakes, if you had paid 'em to." "From what it appears, uh, in the area, the Wards were kind of outcast people." "You know, they weren't generally accepted down there, and it's one thing for... the people who live there to consider somebody an outcast, but he was still their outcast." "You know, if it comes up to somebody else looking into the, the lifestyles of people down there and accusing them of something, it's..." "I find it's natural, in some of these rural areas, that people stick together." "They stick by their own, the people in the area." "And that they went to, went to back him as being an underdog, not caring really, in my estimation, whether he was right or wrong, at that point." "He was just one of theirs." "Delbert told me... that they were asking him all kinds of questions, and he was saying yes and no, and he was getting tired, and one of the troopers said to him," ""Delbert, if you sign this paper right here, I'll take you home." "I see you're tired."" "And Delbert said, "I signed the papers, and he slapped the handcuffs right on me." "Took me to the lockup."" "Makes you wonder, don't it?" "[dogs barking]" "The first time I was ever in jail." "I hope it's the last time." "Don't have no room, wasn't much wider than from here over to where you stand." "You walk out in front of your cell, your cell was only just a little one." "Concrete floor, - [cats mewing] and then the little room you had to walk in, had floor tile on it." "Only, only place you had to sit was just like this, back right up, sit right on the concrete, and then lean right up against the blocks." "[Interviewer] Were you ever in a place like that before?" "No." "Never." "[spitting]" "Didn't you sign a confession?" "Yep." "How come?" "'Cause I didn't know what I was doing." "I was nervous, and all shook up." "What did they have you sign?" "Two or three papers, then had to put your initials on 'em." "Did you read the papers?" "I couldn't see them 'cause I didn't have my glasses." "Can you read?" "A little bit, not much." "It wouldn't have done me no good if I did have the glasses 'cause they, they wasn't no good anyway." "What'd they tell you to get you to sign it?" "I don't know what they did tell me now." "Did they read it to you?" "Yes, they read it." "Did you understand it?" "Some of it, I did, and some of it, I didn't." "Did they tell you you could go home if you signed it?" "No, they didn't tell me I could go home." "What'd they say?" "Well, they said it'd be easier on you." "It would be easier, if what?" "On me." "But it wasn't." "I don't think." "♪♪ [dogs barking in distance]" "[Cognetti] When we were in the Grand Jury, a photograph was, uh, given to Delbert, and he was asked to identify it." "It was a photograph of his, of his brother lying prone on the bed." "What was interesting was that there was a pillow that appeared to be over the face." "Um, I don't know how or why the photograph was offered." "I would hope... for Mr. Cerio's sake, that it wasn't offered to represent the body as it was when it was found because, if it was, that's not a true photograph." "The..." "In fact, the body, when it was found that morning by the first, uh, first person in the bedroom, had no pillow near it." "As far as any fabrication of evidence, uh, regarding, uh, uh, putting a pillow over William Ward's case, regarding taking photographs of the scene, um..." "I would like to use the term "outrageous," regarding that, because the State Police is not in the business of, of fabricating any type of physical evidence." "Uh, we go on the merits of the case, and if the merits of the case, uh, substantiate and suggest that there is criminal culpability, then we proceed." "If it doesn't, we conclude our case, and we close it by investigation." "[Interviewer] So, Lyman... what were you telling me about the women in town here?" "Oh, there's nice women in town." "Yeah?" "There are." "I know every one of them in there." "What do you think?" "Oh, there're nice women." "Yeah?" "Yeah." "They're-They're pretty good, pretty good friends." " Yeah?" " Yep." "Them women I know are gone now." "Used to know." " They ain't there anymore." "Them young ones." "You get married, you're gone!" "[Roscoe] You get married, you're gone." "Did you guys used to, you know, have, like, girlfriends and...?" "Nah, I didn't have any." " Nah." "[Roscoe] Lyman never wanted a girlfriend." "Not like you, I wouldn't have them around." "[Roscoe] Me neither." " Why?" "Oh, I just don't know, just don't want them, that's all." "Got to put that on her finger." "Yeah." "Ever thought of getting married?" " No." " Come on." "No, sir, that's out of my territory." "I never, never thought of it, and I wouldn't, I wouldn't." "All the nice women you bring, I wouldn't." "Not me." "No, sir." "[Roscoe] My brother, Bill, he didn't want no women either." "Ike up there, my cousin in the bus, he don't want no women." "He said he'd rather live alone." "Watch his, uh, his CB nights, and watch his television." "♪♪" "[Investigator Graham] Lyman eventually told us that, uh, they had talked about killing William a couple days prior to his death." "That conversation took place out in front of their residence." "In fact, Lyman said it was under a big tree in front of their house, where, um, Delbert came up to Lyman and says, um," ""You know, Brother William is-is in a lot of pain with his stomach and h-his head problems." "He has continuous headaches, and I think it's about time that we did something, uh, to help him,"" "and then Lyman asked Delbert, he says," ""What do you mean by, you know," "'It's about time we did something.'"" "He says, "I think we, uh, you know, should kill him so he's not suffering anymore,"" "and initially, they talked in regards to how they were going to kill him, or how Delbert was going to kill him, and Delbert decided he was gonna use a rifle and shoot him in the head." "Um, Lyman had explained to him that was too messy, and he didn't wanna do it that way, or have it done that way, and it was decided that Delbert would choke him, um... and kill him." "♪♪" "One of the problems that I've... as I am sure you are well aware, one of the problems that I've had with the, the incredible press coverage is that it is... presenting to Delbert a whole 'nother world" "that he's not used to, and by presenting that to him, it's, it's changing him in, in some form, um, and it is to my benefit," "I should say, it's to his benefit, that he appear, uh, to the jury as he was on the date that this incident allegedly took place." "Um, I would hate..." "[stammers] it comes to mind, the example of him testifying, you know, in a sharkskin suit, with his hair slicked back and, and sunglasses on." "Now, that would never happen, but that's what I'm getting at." "I don't want him to change." "He's still is obviously a shy, gentle person, but he's becoming somewhat, uh, schooled in the ways of the world." "♪♪" "[inaudible dialogue] [chickens clucking] [muffled auctioneer]" "Dollar and a quarter." "[mumbling]" "One and a half." "Dollar 75." "Two dollar, and a quarter." "[auctioneer continues]" "It seems odd to see Delbert here without Bill." "I've known them, them guys, what, 35, 40 years, never, never seen 'em apart." "Never seen 'em apart." "Delbert's changing, I think." " Delbert is changing." " Yeah." "Delbert is changing." "Yeah, Delbert is changing." "♪♪ [chicken squawking] [auctioneer continues, indistinct]" "[Art Bishopp] Delbert, well, he hasn't changed in 40 years." "I do know that." "No, he hasn't changed." "See, the nice part about Delbert, he tells you something, you can believe it." "This guy says, "Good morning,"" "you gotta look out and see if it's night." "You know, I used to come up," "I used to see Delbert when he was down here." "Delbert was here, wasn't you, Delbert?" "Mm-hmm." "I was, uh, I was 15 years old when Delbert was born." "Oh, Delbert's a good boy." " It's kinda scary." "Always has been." "When it, when it boils down to everything," "I think it come out of the kindness of his heart." "That's what I, that's what I believed from the beginning, and I believe it today." "♪♪ [auction continues, indistinct]" "[chicken squawking]" "Well, I-I-I do believe h-he probably, he probably did do it out of, you know... but it's, it's, uh..." "At first, I didn't, I didn't believe it, and then we started putting everything together, with, you know, with Bill's troubles and all and, uh, and if he, if he was suffering," "it wouldn't be beyond him, probably, to... like, put him out of his misery, like you would a sick cat or something like that." "But, uh, it was, it was hard to talk about it while we, you know, with Delbert around 'cause I know he probably feels bad." "But they've been damn, damn good boys." "Our objective in any interrogation is to solicit incriminating responses, and, uh, I mean, we're in the business of... of, of doing police work and doing effective police work, and we use the, the methods and techniques" "that are, are most productive to us, and it's my opinion that Question and Answer is the most productive in an interrogation." "[Thurston] Were you befuddled in any way on the sixth of June by this whole procedure?" "Um, no, I guess not." "Do you know what befuddled means?" "No, I don't." "We discussed, briefly, if he knew what any of his rights were, and he remarked, right off, that he, uh, he watched TV, especially, uh, "Hunter,"" "which is a detective show, and he did know some of his rights, verbatim, uh, already." "[Thurston] Did they suggest to you, in any way, that, how you might have killed Bill?" "Yes, they did." "They showed me how I done it." "Could you show me?" "Yes, I could show you." "Well, go ahead, show me." "[muffled] That's tight as you can squeeze?" "Can't kill me. [mumbling] [muffled laughing]" "What he told us, that night, is what I'm relating to you, and that's what he told us." "After the fact, a lot of words were put in his mouth, but... there was no, no..." "Investigator Rifenberg didn't demonstrate on me, or I didn't demonstrate on him." "His exact way of doing it was he put his hand over his own mouth to indicate how he did it." "[cows mooing]" "[District Attorney] So, at that point, they want to take a written statement, right?" "A typed statement?" " [Delbert] Yes." "They want to put that down in writing, and they told you that." "Yes, they told me that." "And you said yes." " Yes." "And you remember them telling you that it was a crime in the State of New York..." " Yes." "...to give a false statement..." "Yes." " ...and you understood that?" "No, I didn't understood it." "You didn't understand that it's a crime to lie?" "No, 'cause I knew I didn't kill him." "And then they said to you, "Delbert, if this is the truth, sign this statement."" "Remember him telling you that?" "Yes, I remember him telling me that." "And you signed the statement?" "Yes, I signed it." "Now, you weren't handcuffed?" "No." "They didn't have their guns out pointing them at you?" "No." "You say they read this to you about four or five times?" "About that." " About that." "And each time, you told them that was the truth and those were your answers?" "Yes, I thought that if I cooperated," "I would get out of there, but I didn't." "[birds cawing]" "They've jumped from, uh, sex to, with incest, or whatever you'd call it, between the boys, to mercy killing to, what the hell, who knows." "They still haven't come up with any motive for why he would kill him." "Bill was the whole push behind this family." "He was the boss." "He walked in front, and Delbert walked back of him, and when Bill stopped, Delbert would run into him." "That's the way they lead, and that's the way they followed." "They were two men that walked the same pair of shoes, so Delbert wouldn't, no way, done anything to Bill." "According to my information, and it must be... on the record now, they held Bill's body two days over at the funeral parlor to do a rape test on him." "It come out inconclusive or whatever the hell they put it." "So, that was nothing." "[Interviewer] What were they looking for?" "Looking for sperm in Bill's body." "That was because they always slept together, but if they'd found it or not, what the hell difference does that make?" "We got a lot of goddamn guys down in New York City, where you boys are from, that sleep together." "[laughing]" "And they ain't doin' it just because it's a way of life, either." "I mean, that would have no bearing on the case, whatsoever, in my mind." "We have lesbians and gay people all over, so why the hell they was bothering with Bill and Delbert?" "I don't understand that part, but they were just fishing for something to justify what they were doin'." "That would be my understanding of it." "Like a witch hunt." "Like the mercy killing." "He hasn't been sick, uh, any more than normal." "For Bill, Bill was always hobbling or lame or a thumb-bunged or his arm hurt or something, and every time I had ever seen him, he's always had something bunged up on him, so..." "He wasn't sick... so that would rule out the mercy killing, so what the hell else could they come up with?" "I think, probably, that... you get a few narrow-minded people, it wouldn't matter who slept together, they'd have to think the worst of 'em." "That's they way our society works." "We're not back a hundred years ago, whatever you did was all right." "Before we got heat in the houses, which the boys don't have no central heating or anything, they slept together, probably, more or less, for warmth, so they wouldn't freeze to death." "We used to have a wood stove, and it heated one room." "You'd burn your belly and freeze your ass." "When you get up to bed, there was no heat in all our bedrooms." "Oh, I think these boys are the same way." "They just slept together when they was kids, and why the hell change it?" "Was a comfortable arrangement all the way around." "Just a habit." "These not are the most educated people in the world." "It probably never dawned on them that anybody would ever question why they slept in the same bed." "And before Bill died, I don't think anybody ever paid any attention." "You wouldn't think nothing about it." "Hell, nobody ever went in their house anyway." "Always talked in the cow barn." "I've known them since, for Christ's sakes, for better than 50 years, and I never been in their house, only twice." "So, what the hell did I care where they slept or anybody else?" "It's nobody's damn business." "So, when the investigators pulled that one," "I was kind of surprised, but..." "I guess they'd pull most anything when you get your tail caught in a crack in a log." "[chuckling] [dogs barking]" "[Interviewer] When was this house built?" "What, sixty... five." "Musta been, 'cause Ma lived in it just about a year before she passed away." "And she died in '65." "Or '64, then, it was about." " '64, probably." "I'd say." "Was there a house here before?" "There was an old house, sat over on this other side." "Over on this other side." "What was, what was your mom like?" "She was a good person, good lady, good mother." "Yeah." " Do anything for you." "She died of cancers..." "Didn't she Delbert?" " Ma." "Yup." " Yeah, so did Dad." "Yeah." "[stammering] Sister Emma had 'em." "Moses' mother." "I think Bill died with a cancer, too." "I do." "He did." "♪♪" "This battery's not too lively." "[indistinct mumbling]" "It's the battery." "[engine sputtering]" "Don't think either one of 'em's any good." "[cows mooing]" "[engine sputtering]" "Goddamn fuckin' thing." "[cows mooing]" "I don't think she's gonna start, Lyman." "[engine sputtering]" "[indistinct mumbling]" "That's the end of it." "Yep." "♪♪" "[wind rustling]" "[dog barking]" "[dog whimpering] [music on tv]" "Our first story is about some people you just don't see on television." "I mean, they're almost from a different era." "Sort of unbelievable." "You just have to see this story." "It's about the Ward brothers," "Delbert, Roscoe, Lyman, and Bill." "All bachelors, who live together in a cramped shack, where they were born in Munnsville." "It's a small dairy town in central New York state." "The Ward Boys, as they've always been known, lived the way farmers did 200 years ago." "They never learned to read or write." "They have no running water, no modern farming equipment." "Nobody in town ever paid much attention to them, until one day last summer, when Delbert was charged with murdering his older brother, Bill." "Suddenly, the people of Munnsville rallied around Delbert." "It's hard to put into words just... how simple they really are." "They never really grown up." "They're just plain, simple boys." "Little boys, with old man's faces." "He wouldn't even shoot a cat if he was half dead." "Talking about killing Bill..." "no way." "No, he didn't." "[Connie Chung on TV] What did the police ask you that night?" "[Delbert on TV] Well, they asked me if I killed him, and I tried to tell them, "No,"" " They wouldn't." " They said, "You did, you did."" "[Chung] You told him you didn't kill him." "[Delbert] Well, I tried to, but they wouldn't believe me." "[Asst. DA on TV] I just slid my hand around his head, came up, covered his mouth, and held my hand there for a period of about five minutes." "You're a goddamn liar." " Yeah." "[overlapping talking]" "'Cause you told, you told me that's how I done it." "Goddamn liar." "You told me that's how I done it, showed me how I done it." "[Asst. DA on TV] He showed how he was laying in the bed..." "That son of a bitch wasn't supposed to have been there until 7:30, they brought him in just to read the confession over, didn't he?" "Yes, he's a son of a bitch and a liar." "Yeah, he's lying like hell." "He wasn't supposed to been down there according to the Huntley Hearing 'til 7:30 just to read that confession over to you." "Are you crying Delbert?" " No." "Sometimes I do." "You don't have to pay no attention to that." "Why were you crying Delbert?" "Well, I think of Bill a lot down there again." "Then Jane or Moses or Glenn come in to see me or some of my other friends, and then I'd start crying." "[Connie Chung] After 20 days, Delbert's bail was finally set at $10,000, and the people of Munnsville, who had never before embraced any of the Wards, raised the money to free him in a day." "We're all your friends." " I know it." "We're always gonna be your friends." " I know that." "And we wish you a lot of health and happiness." "Thank you, all." " In your 60th year." "[man] And he hopes he gets out of this." "We know he's gonna get out of it." "[Asst. DA] And I think Delbert knows what happened that night on Johnson Road." "He has to live with it the rest of his life." "[Thurston] He had no problem with it, so far, you son of a bitch." "If I ever get the chance at that bastard, and he's on my land, he'd better pray." "'Cause I'm gettin' so goddamn old and so goddamn sick that I don't care too much anymore." "It makes me a dangerous man." "[Connie Chung] Delbert Ward's trial is expected to begin in a few weeks." "Organizers in Munnsville are planning several benefit raffles to cover the cost of his defense." "We'll be back in a moment." "[music on tv ♪]" "Well, Roscoe, you... had your snoot stuck in that television camera all summer." "How'd you like seeing yourself on television?" "All right." "Is that all, after all that?" " Yeah." "Christ, you hogged it all summer, didn't he Delbert?" "Yeah!" "Every time they got out a camera, there was Roscoe, smiling' and grinnin'." " Yeah." "You did a good job, though, Roscoe." " Yeah." "I give you credit for that." " He did do a good job." "Yup." " They didn't shake you a goddamn bit." "Well, I didn't sign no goddamn papers with them, did I, Harry?" " No." "Lyman wouldn't of signed the goddamn paper if they hadn't told him he could come home." "He was so goddamn scared, he was pretty near dead." "Look at the goddamn night he was so bad." "Jesus Christ, I come up and..." "I had to call you for him that night." "Thought- thought Roscoe was gonna die, we did," "Jesus Christ, so I told him he had to get better 'cause Connie Chung was comin' the next day, and, God, he snapped right out of it." "[laughing] He did." "Snapped right out of it." "And he hasn't been ill since." " No." ""All right," Roscoe said," ""I'll go to bed and get rested up." "I'll be all right in the morning."" "Yeah." "[laughing]" "Joe and Bruce, come on." "Come on up." "I wanna show you the old-old- old gobblers." "♪♪ [indistinct]" "We named one Joe, and one, Bruce." "H-Hear 'em, Joe?" "[dog barking]" "Gobble, gobble, gobble." "[laughing]" "I ain't fed ya yet." "[turkeys gobbling] That one wants some trouble." "Gobble, gobble, gobble." "Come on over, Joe and Bruce." "I wanna show 'em to ya." "If I can get in there." "[turkeys gobbling]" "There- there's Joe, the big one and that one over there's Bruce, the one h... the one lookin' towards the windshield." "[Interviewer] You named your gobblers after us?" "Yup, that's right." "[laughing]" "How come?" "Well... good name!" " Yeah." "Good friends." "That's why I done it." "That's nice." "Well, we're honored." "I know that." " Yeah." "[dogs barking]" "How come you like collecting birds?" "Oh, well, I always did." " How come?" "I don't know." "I used to keep wild doves, but I never had no luck with 'em." "Well, what is it about birds that you like?" "Oh..." "I like to see 'em around and hear 'em- hear 'em- hear 'em holler." "Always did." "[turkey gobbling]" "Always like to hear them." "Gobble, gobble, gobble, gobble, gobble!" "See them going?" "H-He knows there's something going on." "Can't fool that old bird." "[Cognetti] I wanted you here today for several reasons." "The first, is to let you know what's been happening." "I really haven't had an opportunity to speak with- with, uh..." "Hey, Roscoe." "Roscoe!" "[speaking Italian] [laughing]" "I haven't had an opportunity to speak with a lot of you, since maybe even the bail hearing, which was many, many, many months ago." "I am very disappointed at what I see from the District Attorney's office." "At the time that the body was moved to the... uh, funeral home, the clothes were taken and Doctor Germaniuk, sometime thereafter, discovered that there was some sperm on the pant leg of William, and some sperm on William himself," "on his body." "That, at that moment, changed his whole theory of the murder." "It no longer is, at least, this is what we've been able t-t-to fathom, it no longer is a mercy killing." "Believe it or not, it's a sex-gone-bad murder." "I think the allegation, perhaps along with some other things, is that Delbert and William were having sex, uh, that a fight occurred, and that Delbert killed William." "That's-That's incredible." "That's what the new theory may very well be." "He had continually said it was Delbert's, it was Delbert's, it was Delbert's, and we kept saying, how in God's name do you know that?" "Don't you think you should check and see if it's William's first?" "Or is it the cow's?" "Or is it somebody else's?" "Now, I am so upset, and I don't know what else to do." "If I could, I told somebody over here, if God were to tell me, today, I'm gonna die, the first person I- this is great for them- the first-- [laughing]" "the first person I would kill is Mr. Cerio." "I don't have any problem with the guy prosecuting the case to the best of his ability." "They're going beyond that." "I think they look like a bunch of fools in Connie Chung's story." "I don't know where a State Police Officer has the guts-- [applause] ...to tell on national television," ""I know he did it."" "All of a sudden, he's judge and jury?" "Let me tell you something else." "When this trial comes, we're gonna have this planned as if it was a Broadway show, and I'm gonna ask every one of you right now," "I want you to find ten people, and I want that courtroom packed every minute of every day, and I want you people to look those jurors in the eye when they sit there." "That's what- that's what I want, and we'll take care of the legal end." "I guarantee you, you will be proud of what's going to happen, but I need your help." "I-I need your help, a-and, uh..." "I can't do it without you." "I want you people there." "Every day, from the moment we begin, to the moment we end." "You can bring your lunches." "I-It's gotta be that way." "I want" " I want the people in Madison county to know that this stuff can't happen." "The problem is, because it could be you next time or you next time or you next time." "[dogs barking in distance] [door shuts]" "Well, Delbert, this is the day we've been waitin' for, maybe we'll get it over." "Maybe." "I hope so." "I got one wish." "My birthday's next Tuesday." "I hope they bring in the goddamn verdict that you didn't do nothin' for a birthday present." "[engine starts]" "[Court Clerk] All rise, please." "[gavel bangs]" "Madison County Court is now in session." "Honorable William F. O'Brien the Third presiding." "Yeah." "Good morning and thank you." "Have a seat, please." "[cough]" "Ladies and gentlemen of the jury." "This is a murder case, wherein, the defendant, that man is charged by indictment, with having intentionally caused the death of another in this case, his brother, William J. Ward," "by placing his had or hands over the nose and mouth of his brother thereby intentionally causing his death by asphyxiation." "You will hear that the defendant, at that time, stated to Police Officers," ""After Bill went to sleep," "I decided to put my hand over his mouth."" "He said that he held his hand there for about five minutes, until he felt that William was dead, and at the conclusion of this case, ladies and gentlemen upon the conclusion of your deliberations..." "...I will ask you to return a verdict of guilty in this case." "Guilty of the crime of murder in the second degree." "Ladies and gentlemen, let me begin by saying simply perhaps dramatically, that..." "Delbert Ward did not murder his brother William." "Delbert Ward could no sooner kill his brother, Bill, than he could kill a half-dead tom cat." "I would submit, ladies and gentlemen, you will unquestionably learn that what we have is a child in the body of a man." "Here is a man, whose disability, whose simple personality, made him susceptible to tactics, that would have been recognized by you and I, as coercive, when used against Delbert Ward." "Here's a man, who allegedly signed an alleged confession and that confession, ladies and gentlemen, that confession is the only proof that the prosecutor will show you, will give to you over the next several days," "that can connect Delbert with the murder of his brother, Bill." "There was and is no independent medical proof that William died as a result of a homicide." "You must come back, ladies and gentlemen, and tell Delbert and I that you find him not guilty of the crime of murder in the second degree." "As I remember, m-m-my feeling was that he was telling it like he is, he didn't know what was wrong, and, uh, that's what he said, he said, "Something's wrong with Bill."" "Oh, all over the world everybody knows Delbert, in our hometown." "[clears throat]" "If you saw him again, could you pick him out?" "Yeah." "Could you recognize him?" " Yeah." "Is he in the courtroom?" " Yeah." "Well, would you- can you point him out for us, please?" "Okay." "The gentleman with the gray beard?" "What was that?" "The gentleman with the gray beard?" "[laughing]" "What?" "I-Is it the man with the gray beard you're pointing to?" "Yes." "The record may reflect that he has identified the defendant." "[rooster crows]" "Come on." "♪♪" "Come on." "[turkeys gobbling]" "[dogs barking]" "[Judge] You may proceed, Mr. Cerio." "Thank you, Your Honor." "Would you state your full name, please?" "My full name is Humphrey Don Germaniuk." "H-U-M-P-H-R-E-Y- D-O-N-G-E-R-M-A-N-I-U-K." "And could you tell us what a Medical Examiner is?" "A Medical Examiner is a licensed doctor whose function it is to determine a cause of death, a manner of death, and to investigate death." "A cause of death is any event that, ultimately, is responsible for the individual's demise." "The manner of death are the circumstances in which the cause of death took place." "Let's take an example of an unnatural death, where there's an individual lying on the floor of his or her home." "The individual is lying in a pool of blood." "There's a revolver next to the individual." "There's a hole in the individual's head." "The cause of death, more likely than not, would be gunshot wound to the head." "But what is the manner?" "What are the circumstances surrounding that?" "Did someone shoot him or her?" "Did they take their own life?" "Or was it an accident?" "So, even though we may have the same cause of death, the manner may vary." "Suppose this individual was a businessman, whose business was failing." "He was in financial troubles." "Recent divorce, perhaps depressed." "There's no evidence of breaking into the house, no evidence of rummaging, no money taken." "Then, more likely than not, we begin to think that this could be a suicide." "Let's take the same body, same pool of blood, same gun, same floor, same building." "The cause of death is still gunshot wound to the head, but if we find out that the house has been broken into, money has been taken, the drawers have been rummaged and disheveled, then we begin to suspect that perhaps" "this could be a homicide." "[heavy breathing]" "Mr. Cerio will ask you some questions, Mr. Ward." "Mr. Ward, c-can you hear me okay?" "Can you- can you tell us, sir, your full name?" "Lyman George Ward." "How old are you, sir?" "How old are you?" "Sixty-six." "Sixty-six?" "Do you remember when William died?" "I remember when he died." "Where were you?" "When he died?" " Yes." "I must have been in bed." " Must have been in bed." " Huh?" "Must have been in bed." "[unintelligible mumbling]" "Oh." "You've answered the question, Mr. Ward." "I-I believe his answer was, "Must have been in bed."" "Is that your answer?" " Mm-hmm." "Mr. Ward, before your brother died was there ever any conversation about .ending Bill's life?" "No." "You never had that conversation with anyone?" "No." "Now, this is entitled," "The Supporting Deposition and it's dated June 6th, 1990." "It reads, "On June 6th, 1990 at 9:30 P.M." "I..." "Lyman George Ward, state the following:" "Question, "Do you know how William died?"" "The answer, "He was smothered."" "Question, "Do you know who smothered him?"" "The answer, "Delbert."" "Question, "When did Delbert tell you that he smothered your brother, William?"" "The answer, "This morning, at the barn."" "[cough] [mumbling]" "And, sir, after hearing that, do you wanna change any of your testimony?" "Yeah." "I'm sorry, Mr..." "Mr. Ward, the Court Reporter can't hear you if you have your arm- elbow out, but if you could turn and face the jury, thank you." "Do you want to change any of your testimony, you were asked?" "I won't be here too long." "His answer was, he wouldn't be here too long." "Do you wanna change any of your testimony?" "Would you, John?" "I-I'm sorry..." " You don't have to be." "Sir, Mr. Cerio was asking you a question, Mr. Ward." "His question was, did you want to change any of your testimony?" "Yeah." "The answer is yes." "What did you want to change of your testimony, Mr. Ward?" "[cough]" "Well, all that I said wasn't true, anyway." "What he said wasn't true, anyway, was his answer." "Did you mean for that to be true when you signed it?" "No." "Ladies and gentlemen of the, uh, jury, we'll recess now, uh, and, uh, enjoy the rest of the day." "We'll see you tomorrow morning." "♪♪" "Good morning, Mr. Ward, have a seat, please." "Wait just a moment." "[indistinct]" "That's it." "You may continue the, uh, direct examination." "Your Honor, if I may approach?" "Yes, you may." "You tell me if you can't hear me, okay?" "I can't." " You can't hear me?" "[mumbling]" "Y-You told us that this was the statement that, uh, you had given while you were at the State Police barracks?" "Question, "Do you know when Delbert smothered your brother, William?"" ""About six AM this morning."" "Do you remember that question?" "Yeah." "Do you remember giving that answer?" "No." "Sir, the question is," ""How do you know that Delbert smothered your brother, William?"" "The answer, "He said he did."" "Do you remember that question?" "Yeah, but he didn't..." "But, sir, do you remember the question?" "Yeah." "Do you remember giving that answer, "Yes, he did." "He said he did?"" "Yeah, but he didn't." "[man] What did he say?" "[coughing]" "The answer was, "He didn't."" "I think, I think the question is, uh..." "Mr. Ward." "We'll take a ten minute recess." "The Jury may step aside." "Just makes you sick." "Cruelty to animals, let alone human beings." "That's cruel!" "He's illiterate, completely." "He can't even tell time." "Trying to get him to read a goddamn thing that Donnegan wrote, bullshit." "[dogs barking] [cows mooing]" "[Interviewer] The courthouse the other day, how was that?" "I went to pieces." "I all went to pieces." "Damn near died down there." "Yeah, we felt bad for you." "It's okay, Lyman." "It's over." " I couldn't take it." " No." " Hey, Roscoe." " Yeah?" "Did you hear what happened down at the courthouse?" " Yeah." " To Lyman?" "Yeah." "What- what'd you hear about it?" "He pretty near died." "Pretty near died." "♪♪" "[Cognetti] Can you identify that for us, Doctor?" "Yes, we have one, two, three, four, five containers holding various specimens from Medical Examiner case number 900391." "And who would that be?" "That would be William Ward." "Can you identify that for us?" "People's exhibit 21 identifies the head and regions of the neck of case number 90 dash 0391." "How is it that you can identify this?" "The identifying numbers are right here on the front part of the neck." "Doctor, after having photographed there, what did you do?" "I then continued examining the eyes." "I looked at the upper eyelids and lower eyelids, and in the lower eyelids," "I noticed what are called petechiae." "I also examined the dental arches." "Uh, the individual, uh, had no teeth, and what I noticed was, on the upper dental arch, on the right side, there was also these diffuse petechiae, or pinpoint blood spots." "All throughout the windpipe, beginning with the little blade on top, called the epiglottis, down to the windpipe, where it breaks in half to feed the right lung and the left lung, had multiple, uh," "numerous of these red pinpoint bloody spots." "With that diffuse spray of petechiae, the large numbers of petechiae that were there and their distribution," "I first began to think that we may be dealing with an asphyxial type of death." "In my opinion, based upon a reasonable degree of medical certainty, this is not a case of asphyxiation." "There are, uh, four significant, uh, findings that I would look for in a case of asphyxiation, that are not present in this case." "No cyanosis, no increased liquidity of blood, no injuries around the nose, mouth, gums, chin, tongue, and, um, the absence of... even the slightest suggestion of regurgitation." "When you are being asphyxiated, you are struggling and gasping for air, food is gonna come back up on you, you're gonna start retching." "There is none of that, whatsoever." "Zero." "[metal clattering]" "[clearing throat]" "[quiet shot] [pig squealing]" "Roll over, goddamn you." "Delbert, you wanna grab me that meat cleaver and knife sharpener out the front passenger seat?" "You have to get in my door, that one's locked." "[motor whirring]" "Thanks, Moses." "[Cognetti] Doctor, it's true, is it not, that at the conclusion of your internal and external examination, you could not say, with a required degree of medical certainty, the cause or the manner of death?" "That is correct." "By that, I mean to say, you couldn't, certainly with any degree of-of certainty, indicate that it was a homicide." "That is correct." "But now, you're talking with Mr. Cerio, and your notes indicate that you tell him that I cannot rule out homicide." "Am I right?" " That is correct." "Once you got to the scene, Doctor, uh, were not you advised, immediately, to call the State Police barracks in Oneida?" "We were." "And, at the conclusion of this call, did he not tell you that Delbert had confessed to the killing of his brother?" "Yes." "So that death certificate, Doctor, came about as a result of your learning that Mr. Ward had confessed to the crime of murder in the second degree?" "No." "Doctor, if you had never learned that Mr. Ward..." "had confessed to the crime of murder in the second degree, would you on June 7th, have changed that death certificate?" "No." "So, let me go back then, Doctor." "That death certificate was changed because you now learned that Mr. Ward had confessed to the crime of murder in the second degree?" "But that was not the only piece of information." "We know about the petechiae." "Correct?" " Correct." "But we know, Doctor, as we talked about innumerable times yesterday, that at that stage, there were a host of reasons for petechiae." "That is correct." "So, we'll put that aside." "Because, as you just indicated, that would not have been enough to warrant a change in that death certificate on June 7th." "That's correct." "So again, let me ask you." "That death certificate was changed, on June 7th, for the sole reason that Mr. Ward had confessed to the crime." "Isn't that the reason, on June 7th, that that death certificate was changed?" "No." "[Dr. Wecht] In my opinion, the cause of death of Mr. William Ward was right heart failure, resulting in pulmonary edema, the, uh, collection of a substantial amount of fluid in the lungs." "[Delbert] I tried to tell him I didn't do it and Geen Rifenberg and "Kellogg" said I did." "[Cerio] Okay." "They kept right after me and said if I cooperated with the police, they'd go much easier on me." "Mm-hmm." "So, finally, I thought if I cooperated with 'em," "I'd get out of there and get home." "Okay." "But I didn't." " You didn't?" "No." "You were gonna cooperate with them?" "Yes, and Mr. Rifenburg is the one who showed me how I put my hand over William's mouth and nose." "Uh-huh." "And that happened in that room?" "That happened in that room." "It's not that you showed him how it happened?" "No, I didn't how him." "He showed me." "Mr. Ward, what other kind of shows do you watch besides Westerns?" "Oh, some of the police stories." "Police stories?" " Mm-hmm." "What kind of police story shows?" "Like "Matlock" there and "Heat of the Night."" "That's about the only two." "Okay, ever watch "Hunter?"" "No." " Never saw "Hunter?"" "A couple times, a little bit, I-I didn't care for it." "Didn't care for it?" "Okay." "When do they come on, during the day?" "No." "What time do they come on?" " Eight o'clock at night." ""Matlock" comes on Tuesday nights." "Tuesday nights." "What's "Matlock?"" "Remember Andy Griffith?" "Yep." "That's- that's the one I'm talkin' about." "Only, he calls himself, Ben Matlock, for the lawyer." "Oh, he's a lawyer now?" "Right." "Do you know what kind of a lawyer he is?" "Defense lawyer." "He's not a prosecutor?" "He's a de-defense lawyer?" "He's a defense lawyer, I think." "Okay." "I know he gets into a lot of them murder trials." "Mm-hmm." "You ever watch "Wheel of Fortune?"" "Yes, I watch that some nights." "Do you know, uh, the girl who's on "Wheel of Fortune?"" "Amanda White." "And, uh any other kind of shows you watch?" "Oh, yes, I watch that "Jeopardy."" ""Jeopardy?"" " Mm-hmm." "You try to answer some of the questions?" "Some of 'em, but I don't get very far on 'em." "No?" "Okay." "I want to show you something, Mr. Ward." "This is what's marked as People's 19." "Can you take a look at that for me?" "I can't see it." " Can't see it." " No." " You can't see this?" "No, not without my glasses." "I see." "You can't read any of this?" " No." "Not at all?" " No." "You didn't bring your glasses?" " No, I didn't bring 'em." "They's no good anyway." " I see." "Did you ever want your own bed?" "Sometimes, but I didn't have it." "Ever want your own room?" "Sometimes." "Did it bother you when William would get up in the middle of the night?" "Well, sometimes he'd holler at me, tell me it was time to get up and go get the cows and put them in to milk them." "Go do the chores?" " Mm-hmm." "But it wasn't time?" " No." "So, he'd wake you up?" " He'd still wake you up." "Yeah." "And he'd do that a couple of times during the night, wouldn't he?" "Some nights." "So, you wouldn't get too much sleep, would you?" "Not all the while." "Will was having some problem holding his water, wasn't he?" "Yes, he couldn't hold it good." "He'd wake you up, wouldn't he?" "Sometimes." "Now, you said that, uh," "Bill had the headaches and the stomachaches, right?" "Right." "Did he ever say anything to you about, uh, if he died, what would happen?" "Yes, he said, some morning, I wasn't gonna wake up and... [stammering] one of us would be arrested for his murder." "That's what he told you?" " That's what he told me." "Told me, told me outdoors." " Told you outdoors, he did?" " Mm-hmm." "When did he tell you that?" "Well, I don't know, must've been April or May." "He said that he was gonna die some night?" "That's what he said." "And that, uh, one of you would be arrested for his murder?" "Yes." " That's what he said?" "That's what he said." "Would you raise your hands, sir, and show those to the jury, please." "Thank you, sir." "[Judge] The record should reflect he's done that." "♪♪" "In case, uh, Delbert goes to jail, or something happens to him, we had to make out a will, so that the stuff would go where he wanted it to go, and not where the State wants it to go," "and the way things have been going against us all the way so far, there's a real good possibility of it." "It's like I explained to Delbert, didn't I, Delbert?" "I didn't..." "You explained it to me." "...tell him that things looked good or rosy." "I told him there's a damn good looking chance that he's gonna go to prison for something he didn't do." "I don't feel good about it." "I may go to jail." "I may not live long." "What type of person did the State Police believe they were bringing to the barracks that night?" "I would submit, that they felt they were bringing a bunch of queer old farmers, who lived like animals, who were stupid and ignorant, without a friend in the world." "Do you really wanna believe that the New York State Police, the Medical Examiners of Onondaga County, decided to pick on Delbert Ward for no other reason than," ""Let's come up with a homicide." "Let's come up with a murder, and let's pick out that man to do it."" "We know him to be educably, mentally retarded with a schizoid personality." "William was 64 years of age, ladies and gentlemen." "He died a natural death in his sleep from heart failure, the most common form of death of a man that age." "You, ladies and gentlemen, saw the defendant testify." "You make the assessment as to whether or not he's an intelligent fellow." "Yeah, are there some social deprivations?" "Yes." "I don't think you can dispute that." "Does this person appear to simply be a person with an IQ of 63 and educably, mentally retarded?" "Or does it appear to be higher?" "There is no independent medical proof which, standing alone without that confession, says that William died as a result of a murder." "The only thing that has been given to you people is this alleged confession." "Taken from a man whose very appearance cries out for special treatment." "As expected, both sides gave strong closing arguments, and after three weeks of emotional testimony, the fate of Delbert Ward now rests in the hands of the jury." "Paula Garell, Channel 3 News." "Um, I" "I wanna say the jury is now deliberating." "♪♪" "How's Mr. Ward doing?" " He's fine." " Nervous?" "He's as nervous as any of us, I'm sure." "Is that it?" "Thanks, Ralph." "[faint chatter]" "[coughing]" "[Male Reporter] Time for an update, now, on tonight's top stories." "[Female Reporter] First, go live to Christie Casciano at the Delbert Ward trial in Wampsville." "Christie, what's happened over the last hour?" "Well, since we last talked, the jury left, as we said, for a dinner break, and the verdict has not been quick in coming, as some courtroom observers have predicted." "The jury has the task of deciding whether Delbert Ward committed murder." "Whether he suffocated his brother on their Stockbridge farm last June." "The jury got the case at 11:30 this morning." "Since that time, they've been weighing evidence, sifting through testimony, and they've been at it for about six hours." "They left the courtroom, as we said, about a half hour ago, six o'clock." "They're on a dinner break." "They're expected back here at eight o'clock, and we will be back here, too, and bringing you the latest at 11." "Right now, let's go to Lisa Sweitzer for more of today's top stories." "[Judge] Uh, ladies and gentlemen, the, uh, jury has advised the court that they have reached a verdict, and I now admonish all of those here in the courtroom, including spectators, that you are to remain seated" "throughout the entire reporting of the verdict procedure." "In the event that there should be any violations of that, I will close the courtroom, you will be escorted from the courtroom, and you can find about, find out the verdict by either reading about it in the newspaper" "or seeing it on television." "There are to be no audible reactions or emotional outbursts by anyone in this room, and I mean that, and if there are any outbursts," "I'm gonna empty the whole courtroom." "The jurors may return to the courtroom." "[coughing]" "Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, I understand, uh, from the court clerk, that the, uh, jury has, in fact, reached a verdict, and, uh," " Mr. Broderick, is that so?" " Yes, sir." "All right." "The court attendant will receive the card." "Mr, uh, Broderick, the, uh, court has, uh, received the verdict sheet, and I now ask you, as the foreman of this jury, have you, in fact, reached a verdict in this case?" "Yes, they have." "What is the verdict of this jury in connection with the crime of murder in the second degree?" "Have you found the defendant guilty or not guilty?" " Not guilty." " Not guilty." " Not guilty." "[crowd murmuring]" "Ladies and gentlemen of this jury, the, uh, court had heard Mr. Broderick announce that the verdict is that of not guilty of murder in the second degree." "I now ask all of you, uh, is this your verdict, so say you all?" "[Jury] Yes." "Mr. Ward, you are excused now, and you can leave." "We'll ask the, uh, media to step aside so that you can leave." "Thank you very much, ladies and gentlemen for your respect and attention." "[applause]" "God bless you." "[Male Reporter 1] So, that smile says it all?" " Yup." " Yup." "Thank all my friends." "[Female Reporter] What's next for you, Delbert, back to the farm?" "Back to the farm." "[Male Reporter 2] How does it feel, Mr. Ward?" "[Thurston] You got it, buddy." "[Interviewer] Harry, how do you feel?" "My heart ain't gone back down yet." "[laughing]" "But I'll get it down by morning." "Did you think it was gonna turn out this way?" "The system works, don't it?" "What do you think, Delbert?" "I thought it might, but I wasn't sure." "I'll get home as soon as I can." "I love you, babe." "Goodbye." "Thanks." "Bye." "[Interviewer] How do you feel?" "Damn." "Sh--." "How do I feel?" "I'm very, very happy." "What's all this noise out here?" "Looks like a wedding." "Are you kidding me, they won't get to sleep tonight and, uh..." "Not in Munnsville." "Not in Munnsville." "You goin' to Disneyland now?" "[sigh] [laughing]" "I listened to all of the evidence, and I could find no solid evidence to prove that even a crime had been committed." "[woman] Justice was done." "It was." "[woman] Amen." "Amen." "Oh Delbert, we're happy." " We're happy for you!" " Thank you all." " We're happy for you." " We're all happy for you!" "[voices fade out] [birds chirping]" "♪♪" "[Interviewer] Do you think there was any good in all of this?" "Oh, yeah." "Yep, I do." "Well, uh, the way everybody helped Delbert, in the Munnsville area and Stockbridge and different places." "Yeah." "[car honking]" "♪♪" "I've been out visiting and talking to my friends." "You got a lot of 'em now." "By gosh, Stockbridge diner was full this morning." "I was gonna buy some of my friends coffee, and I didn't, they wouldn't even let me buy it." "Wouldn't let me spend a nickel." "The lady and the man that works at the diner up there, took the money out of their own pocket, and paid for all of it." "Why don't you come up this summer, Joe?" "Sure." "When the nice green leaves come out." "You and Bruce and Doug and Mike." "When the old leaves get out and the green grass." "Come up and take some pictures." "What do you think of all this now, Delbert?" "Well, I'm glad it's over with." "I thank, thank all my friends for all the support they gave me." "Did you ever know you had so many friends?" "Not so many." "[car honking]" "Do you think your life is different now?" "Yep, gonna start all over new again." "[tractor engine starts]" "You boys will, too, now." "♪♪"