"Attention projectionist, adjust the lens, so that your picture will be focused properly before the show starts." "Flying Saucers have invaded our planet," "Washington, London, Paris, Moscow are key targets, the whole world is under attack!" "People of Earth, attention!" "In 1952 the Central Intelligence Agency faced with a huge public interest in flying saucers brought in a panel of scientists, very senior scientists, we know it now as the." "Robertson panel." "They concluded that there was nothing to these flying saucer reports as objective devices of some kind but that, nevertheless, the government had to exercise great care to debunk the stories and individual civilians who expressed an interest in flying saucers" "ought to be carefully watched said the Robertson panel." "And I believe that to be the founding document, the document giving the long range strategy that has been followed by the US government." "The general feeling amongst people who have devoted a big chunk of their life to studying UFOs I think is fear that they have been taken for a ride, that these cases are hoaxes, but sophisticated hoaxes carried out by their own government." "What do you want with me?" "Let's take one step at a time, you're looking at Richard Doty, the professional disinformer, trained to lie." "I'm Richard Doty." "There's probably about 80% of false information being presented and about 20% of factual information." "Unfortunately the UFO community doesn't know which is which." "And that's your job, to keep it that way?" "That was my job before," "I'm a private citizen now." "But back in the early eighties it was my job to confuse the UFO community." "Doty was representing himself, as I recall, as basically this sort of deep throat." "Doty had this wonderful way to sell it," "I'm with the government you cooperate with us, and I'm going to tell you what the government really knows about UFOs." "Doty found a lot of gullible people in the UFO community, that would easily believe what he said without any type of scrutiny." "My commander told me" ""well there's this guy Special Agent Doty,"" "and you've got to be careful" ""because he kinda made the..."" "the impression I got was that he had made the Air Force a little nervous." "Maybe... they didn't say egg on their face or anything, but they were just very cautious." "The main reason that we in the UFO field recognise the name Richard Doty is that a man Paul Bennewitz a self-made man a very successful businessman was systematically driven insane wound up in an insane asylum under treatment for a long time, lost his business" "had to turn it over to his family, and was destroyed by the efforts of." "Richard Doty." "You hear about the ones that something goes wrong." "You hear about the ones where there was an unfortunate incident or in some cases there are failures." "It was unfortunate what happened to Mr Bennewitz but they were supposed to protect something and they did their job." "That's the part of the base that." "Paul Bennewitz could see." "You can see the Manzano mountain here where all the nuclear weapons were stored." "Kirtland Air Force Base's perimeter fence," "Paul Bennewitz's house is right over here, and his excellent view was afforded from this exclusive area of Albuquerque." "You basically have a front row seat." "August, September of 1979." "Paul was standing up on his deck and looking up over the roofs towards the base and these lights he saw would probably be about half a mile away there was always two of them they'd lift up from the ground rather quickly" "and then very quickly go around, shoot that way around the side of the mountain and then drop down behind it." "And they did the same thing every time." "For anybody that would peak your interest," ""what the hell is that?"" "He had an interest in the UFO subject it was about the only thing he was interested in besides his business." "He had a company called Thunder Scientific they designed instruments for high profile people like NASA and even the Air Force." "A lot of people said he was a genius with electronics and he decided that he was going to listen in on what was going on at the base, maybe he could pick up some radio signals about what this thing was" "and he knew about where to start looking and he started picking up these bursts of information, when he started to decode the signals he thought that it had a connection to whatever these lights were." "He decided it was something to do with technology that wasn't ours." "He was a good American, so he called up the Air Force base, they connected him with Richard Doty eventually." "Paul didn't know initially what he got, he didn't analyse it." "And when he had got the first series of transmissions, he recorded them, and then he contacted the security officer for Kirtland." "I began a dialogue with Paul trying to find out everything he had and as I did then I learned that a lot of the information he had wasn't anything to do with a soviet threat or some kind of hostile" "threat against Kirtland it was information that he had gathered because of the fact that he was a scientist, and because he had sensitive and sophisticated equipment he was collecting emissions coming from the base." "And we had to decide what we were going to do then were we going to allow this to happen?" "Or were we going to try and convince him otherwise?" "They sent Doty and a physicist." "Paul was being occupied with the other guy," "Rick was taking pictures of Bennewitz's equipment in his house." "The more he had contact with me and others within the intelligence community, the more he started analysing the information." "So, we kinda planted the seed in Paul that what he was seeing and what he was hearing and what he was collecting was in fact probably, maybe, UFOs!" "It was very easy to convince Paul." "Paul was a World War 2 veteran, he was very patriotic, he always flew his flag." "Those type of people you can convince that" ""listen", just tell him." ""Paul, you can't tell anyone else about this, because it could get into the wrong hands"" "so immediately Paul became a co-operating source he held everything that he had gotten in secrecy." "Doty was feeding this man all kinds of lies about UFOs and aliens being kept underneath a mountain nearby, and so on and so forth, and Bennewitz, of course, was believing all of this." "He had two films, of an object flying, one picture depicted an object that looked like it was flying out of the mountain and it looked like some kind of saucer shaped object." "He immediately then though that there were UFOs coming out of Manzano." "The second film was of an object that was something that was experimental that the government was doing." "When he filmed that, then again the flag when up that he just filmed a classified project." "Paul made a presentation to the Air Force officials, on what he had been doing and about what he had been collecting." "He showed some of his film, he showed some of his pictures, he had a audio recorder that was playing the sounds that he had collected from the base." "The highest ranking person in the room who was a Brigadier General said" ""you have some very convincing information Paul"" "and that kind of set everything in motion with." "Paul to let him think that, yup, he does." "From the point he came in and gave that meeting they decided all his perceptions were going to be directed exactly the way the intelligence organisations wanted." "We briefed everybody in the room." "So they knew what we were doing, basically." "And so after the meeting there was a number of questions asked to him" ""what do you want the Air Force to do?"" "and Paul says "I'd like a grant to investigate."" ""UFOs on the base" and a grant to continue this contact that he claimed he had with some of these aliens which... now that's a different story!" "At one point another agency was conducting an investigation and they set up a surveillance across the street from him and." "Paul's son contacted me and said" ""leave my father alone, you guys are across the"" "street and you're bothering my father, he's getting to the point" ""that he's being paranoid."" "Well, I knew it wasn't us." "He said he saw people coming in and out of the house and looking from the curtains and things like that and as it turns out the NSA had some people in this house, they were watching him and actually" "beaming messages straight across the street into his antenna set up." "He'd started picking up these signals and the." "NSA was scared that anybody could figure that out." "They decided to just take complete control of what he was seeing and give him exactly what he thought he should be getting." "They replaced his computer with their own computer." "The computer had software that would decode the messages that he was getting in the way that they wanted him to see them." "And if you look at the transcript of it, it seems like almost gibberish but because people want to pull out content from a random order it starts to make some kind of sense." "They said that they were from a planet with no water and they were trying to find a new place to live and they wanted to take over the earth and that they can only trust Paul." "They were going to have some kind of agreement with him but he said you can't trust anything they say these aliens are evil and it served to make him look silly which was exactly what they were trying to do." "Paul actually thought that these UFOs had to be coming from some other place." "So Paul on his own when up to Archuleta Peak, which is in Northern New Mexico, around." "Dulce New Mexico and he did his own investigation basically." "Dulce and the Archuleta Peak area has a superstition for many years, way way before we were ever involved." "There were strange lights and strange stories about that area coming from the." "Indian tribe that lives up there." "If somebody wanted to hide something here it would be pretty easy, it's very remote." "It's supposedly the site of an underground alien base." "That rumour got started in the early 1980s because of what was told to." "Paul Bennewitz by the Air Force." "Office of Special Investigation." "Paul was a pilot, and he had a plane, and he flew around those areas and he saw things and he filmed things up there that again presented a problem for us because what he was filming up there was actually a" "secretive military installation that was training commandos." "So then we had to convince Paul that what he was seeing up there was again, UFOs." "The Air Force actually put him in a helicopter with Rick Doty the first time and flew him up to a place above Dulce, called the Archuleta Mesa and before they took him up there, they dumped a bunch of props up there." "They flew him up there, flew him over the Mesa and said "you're right Paul, look there's"" "stuff here, there's some evidence of what's going on" ""why don't you check this out for us."" "So I would go with Paul up there and we actually camped out there a couple of times and we actually saw some things that startled me, which were fully explained later, but one of the things that was" "kind of interesting were these lights coming out of the ground, but the way the lights, these beams, were coming out of the ground in a pulse kind of manner, that it looked like they were saucers flying out of" "these mountains, and I actually saw this and" "I was somewhat concerned that maybe." "Paul had stumbled onto something." "Paul was flying what he called his missions around Archuleta Mesa and would send back fascinating letters, five, six, seven, eight pages long, hand written with pencil sketches of what he'd seen." "And finally he started sending large format eight by ten photographs taken with his." "Hasselblad in which he'd say" ""well, here's the black atomic powered ship that" ""crashed last week" and he'd circle it, and, oh," "I'd look at that and, bless his heart," "I couldn't see anything that resembled a crashed anything." "Something actually did crash near Dulce on the Mesa in the late 1980s." "Bennewitz just happened to be flying over it and took pictures of it and so the disinformation campaign had to be ratcheted up even more." "The Air Force, they knew it was something they were testing up in this area and that it had gone off course and crashed." "Of course they told Paul Bennewitz that it was some sort of alien craft that had been given to the humans to use and that they had shot it out of the sky as some sort of a lesson." "Agents would break into his house, to see what he had and at one point he had these pictures of whatever had crashed up there and they were very interested in getting these pictures, so they did." "From then on he went up and just took pictures of where it had crashed." "What probably crashed there was some sort of unmanned aerial vehicle and now they're over in the middle east, remote controlled, killing people in cars as they drive across the desert." "But in 1985 they didn't really want anybody to have any knowledge of this kind of thing." "They took great pains to explain to him that it was this atomic powered aircraft that the aliens had helped us with and bring down that laughter curtain again so that people just wouldn't pay attention." "They'd just think it was another UFO nut." "Somebody gave him a satellite picture of the landing area." "In 83 he went up there with me and the chief of police for the Jicarilla Apache tribe." "They had made a landing pad and he took us right to the spot." "They were giving him disinformation, some of it was true, some of it wasn't, see." "I think that was the biggest problem he had, coping with, why this, why not the other thing?" "He thought that this was the place where the aliens were getting together to take over the world and he wanted to trap them all there, kill them all in one fell swoop and save the Earth." "By the mid eighties he was getting to the point where he had written all of these letters to congressmen, senators, TV stations, even President Regan saying this is what's going on the Air Force is co-operating with me" "these are the people who are co-operating with me and giving me this information." "Earnest Edwards, Richard Doty, all this he would put there names in these letters." "He'd get answers back saying" ""we're not interested in the UFO subject"" "and there was this kind of cognitive dissonance here are people in the government telling him" ""yes you're right, this is going on, let's keep an eye on it"" "and then elected officials and other people in the the media saying" ""we don't know what you're talking about, this isn't very important"" "and nobody seemed to care what he was talking about except the Air Force." "So many people knew ultimately about." "Paul Bennewitz and that sad, strange, horrible story that it got way out of the realm of just a cute flying saucer story." "Paul was convinced that everything he was doing was UFO related." "I actually sat down with Paul and told Paul" ""listen Paul, I think you ought to stop doing this"" "I think you've gone as far as you can go, and this is a friend, this is Richard Doty a" ""friend" it wasn't Richard Doty a Special Agent with OSI talking to him, I said" ""this is a friend talking to you Paul"" "because I became a friend with him, he was a very wonderful person and I didn't want to see him harmed and I said." ""Paul, stop it!" "Listen to your son,"" "listen to your wife, end it, get rid of the equipment, lock this stuff away, go on with your life, go back to your work at your business and stop this..." "Paul listened to me and I thought maybe he was going to take my advice, but he didn't, he continued and continued and continued and at that point we ended the investigation we ended every involvement with." "Paul Bennewitz." "By 1988 things were so bad that his family decided to take him to a psychiatric facility and see if they could try and save his life." "He said that aliens would come at night through his wall and inject him with something that would make him get in his car and drive out into the desert and he didn't remember what he was doing or why he went." "The scary thing was there actually were injection marks on his arm." "This is a friend talking to you..." "Years later, I sat down with Paul, at dinner and told Paul, exactly, that everything we did was a sanctioned counter intelligence operation to convince him that what he was seeing was UFOs and that what we didn't want him" "to know was that he had tapped into something on the base, and we didn't want him to ever disclose that." "Paul looked at me and said" ""you don't have to lie to me Rick," "I know it UFOs related"." "He was caught right in the middle of it and then he was used." "If it hadn't been for Paul Bennewitz I would have never known 70% of the stuff that was going on." "What kind of stuff did you find that would make you think that there was something underground there?" "Well, the entrance to..." "A big enough entrance to get a truck or a plane or something through?" "Yes." "You saw this?" "Uh-hum." "But it wasn't where Paul said it was?" "No." "Well, the first case of the cattle mutilation in." "Dulce, it was June 14th 1974." "People do kill animals and steal the meat, and it's different, it was different." "Why did they just take the udder, the lymph nodes and the tongue at the base of the throat with the tonsils?" "And we're finding the evidence at the mutilations, gas masks that were made by the military, radar chaff, and the tranquillisers they were using atropine, they were injecting them with atropine." "I was up front with the ranchers they were losing cattle and nobody was compensating them." "I wasn't hiding anything, I never did." "I'm established as somebody who is doing all of this news and documentary." "So I start getting newspapers, people are saying." ""Linda, what is the answer?"" "Ok, this is what I'm going to do next." "I'm going to get to the bottom of this animal mutilation mystery." "And finally in October of 79 Lou Girodo who was the head of the district attorneys office in Trinidad says, with our cameras running, finally "well, investigators and I"" "have come to the conclusion we're dealing with" ""creatures not from this planet"" "is the way he put it which is in my film, A Strange Harvest." "And said all the reasons why, the orange lights that he and a deputy had seen go into the ground, come out, split in two, in pastures where they had mutilated animals." "We did follow one and it stayed there, it was hovering on top of the cattle, Manuel Gomez's cattle, and when" "I was going to try and intercept it myself it flew over me." "But this looked like a saucer type, yeah, aircraft." "Ah ha." "You could see lights in it blinking." "Why do they put lights if they're from outer space?" "They don't need any guidance with lights!" "I was an analyst in the agency responsible for chemical weapons analysis so the embassy would always give me a security escort and bodyguard." "Special Forces guy came, and I said." "'Hey, what do you know about these crazy stories about the helicopters that are taking mutilated cattle?" "'" "'Oh he says, my real job," "I'm in a special group in New Mexico." "We've been doing something that is really, really interesting' he said, 'it just blows my mind, I just... we got these helicopters that I'm flying' he says 'these helicopters are all fixed up." "First of all they got no markings on' em." "Second of all they're really fast." "Third, they're really quiet, and they got a lot of lights." "We got red lights, we got white lights, we got strobe lights.'" "I said 'What are you talking about?" "'" "He says, 'We pretend we're UFO's..." "What the hell is that?" "Do you know anything about this?" "Where did all that information come from?" "Why do you listen to those people, they lie?" "It's like, yes but they talk." "And if they talk, once in a while you're gonna get a piece of something in that huge pile of crap that will actually connect to what you want, and if you don't let them take you" "somewhere like they did with Paul, kind of keep an even keel, I think you're ok." "You just have to listen that's the thing." "So are you saying that the." "Dulce base, or the Dulce architecture, let's call it, ah, exists or doesn't exist?" "Have you investigated the RAND corporation's involvement in tunnelling in that area in the 50's and 60's?" "Oh yeah, yeah, I actually put some of that in the book construction of a nuclear waste facility there..." "Not waste, but they exploded an atomic bomb underneath about ten miles from." "Dulce to try and get gas out of the ground." "Stupidest idea!" "They couldn't use the gas 'cos it was radioactive." "New programs of the Atomic Energy." "Commission and other agencies are designed to expand the usefulness of nuclear energy." "Before work is begun on any of these programs." "The government evaluates the health and safety factors, often for several years." "Project Gasbuggy was an underground nuclear detonation that took place in 1967 in Dulce, New Mexico." "It was an attempt to release natural gas reserves from the subterranean environment in a sort of early version of what we would now recognise as fracking." "Some people have suggested that the cattle mutilation program was actually a covert monitoring program for assessing the radiation leakage levels into the environment, into the ecosystem and into the food chain." "Senator Harrison Schmitt had a conference here in 1980, 'cos the ranchers were asking for help, and I met Paul Bennewitz there." "He was taking a bunch of pictures of the aircraft coming out of the Kirkland area, but we were watching the same aircraft flying in the Dulce area, see." "Everybody's looking at these sophisticated aircraft and kind of saying 'well they're the one's that are mutilating the cattle.'" "One agency was doing the cattle mutilation, but the people that were doing the research on the aircraft used the cattle mutilations to test their aircraft so that people think it was ufo's... and it helped the cattle mutilation thing see!" "It's a wonder they didn't crash into each other, you know!" "Would we use perception to help shroud what we're trying to protect?" "Absolutely!" "If you've got an aerial platform that is highly advanced and the public who happens to get a glimpse of the thing from time to time, if they're convinced that it's from Venus and there's no way it could be our military," "well hey you know, that's awesome!" "Hell yes!" "If I'm the agent running the protection for that particular program and that's helping me to cover something for years?" "I might even feed the fire." "Doty and others would probably defend their counter-intelligence efforts as being patriotic." "They are carrying out work assigned by people who have decided that there must be a policy of denial in the interests of national security." "They're working for my government." "They're working in agencies of the government that is supposed to be protecting of the people by the people for the people." "How did it all turn upside down?" "At the core there is something that they want to keep people away from." "A real truth." "I'm Richard Doty." "I'm here at the UFO congress at Laughlin," "Nevada, as a private citizen, just enjoying the sights and sounds." "Disinformation is designed to appeal to the person that it's operating on." "The more dramatic you can be appealing to that prejudice, the better you're gonna get your hooks into the person you're trying to get." "In Paul Bennewitz's case, he was taking about." "UFOs so if they wanted his full and undivided attention, they would talk UFOs with him which is exactly what they did." "Bennewitz was filming really highly strange craft." "Then counter-intel's job is to come in and muddy the waters and make him look like a fool, and one of the cover jobs... it's been a cover story in the U.S for a long time tell the media, tell anybody who will listen" "that they're using UFOs to cover up advanced technology - when the truth is exactly the opposite of the words!" "Our perspective is that the ufo phenomenon is absolutely genuine..." "Hah!" "In spades!" "Yeah." "However, within that arena there have been points at which disinformation has entered the stream, you know, and there's no..." "From FDR on!" "It became seen as necessary to create an active disinformation program in the late 1970's and early 1980's and the reason for this is twofold." "One was the American Freedom of Information Act." ": "It's curtain time."" "An ingenious printing elemet that works faster" ""than the eye can see." "Watch it in action."" "Thousands of pages of documents were released from places like the." "CIA, the FBI, all the military agencies." "Documents proving the lie that agencies across the board were interested and were tracking the UFO phenomenon." "During the late1970's a variety of leaks started to occur." "Now they're just stories right?" "But the problem is there were many of them and they seemed to have a coherence about them." "Researchers at the time were in a very optimistic mode." "I wouldn't say there were so much giddy as just hopeful, that if they got the right leak, or the right document, that they just might be able to smash the wall of secrecy." "Then what happens?" "Then we get entrants into the field by individuals who start leaking documents of dubious origin whose provenance was basically unknown, that caused now twenty five years of dissension in the research field." "And it's the same within the mainstream media." "Serious media never in their news coverage seriously promoted the extra terrestrial hypothesis, what they did do was move that to the realm of entertainment." "Any time someone brings such ideas up seriously, what you find is the serious media says well, you've been watching too many movies." "So in a sense you could argue that the movies are used to inoculate the public against these truths." "So these demonstrably false UFO stories become inoculations." "When the doctor inoculates you from a disease, he gives you a little bit of it, and then your body's immune system recovers, deals with it and now you're kind of immune to it." "Look at the UFO conferences, where are they held?" "Usually in small dingy hotels with rather limited numbers of people participating." "I mean there has to be a reason why it's perpetuating." "You don't see conferences on leprechauns, so why do we still have conferences on UFOs?" "One of the keys to a disinformation campaign is to have a feedback loop and you need people on the inside to feed back to you the results of the operation." "Probably Doty's first success in rounding up a useful asset as they say in the intelligence field, or a useful idiot as they also say in the intelligence field was his recruitment of a man named William Moore." "Now William Moore I think very significantly was the co-author of the first book about Roswell." "I was given the task of making contact with Bill Moore and basically finding what he knew and who he knew." "Bill was a little reluctant to disclose everything to me, for obvious reasons." "Here I am a government agent coming in and introducing myself and wanting to know what he knew." "But there's techniques that we use, that we're trained to use in gaining that person's confidence, and I use those techniques against Bill Moore and they worked and." "Bill Moore took me into his confidence and we had a professional relationship as far as him providing us information about the ufo community and agreeing to say things we wanted said regarding the ufo community or within the ufo community." "The process of studying this phenomenon and the people involved with it, of assessing the claims and the counter-claims and of dealing with the question of how we as earthlings will react to the the discovery of a race of extra terrestrial" "visitors and how they will react to us all of this and more when finally looked at in perspective leads us to the inescapable recognition that in studying the ufo phenomenon we are at the same time becoming more aware of" "ourselves as individuals." "Moore was singled out because he had achieved considerable celebrity within the ufo field and a certain authenticity that would recommend him to politicians and journalists, and remember it's the politicians and the journalists who are the ultimate target of all of this disinformation." "I went to visit Bill, he had a bad back, he was lying flat on his back, he couldn't move, he was in traction and I remember him very dramatically saying to me 'aliens do exist, ufo's are real," "I know that now for a fact'." "Just seems kind of almost like a bad science fiction movie, but that's kind of what was going on at the time." "He was invested in maintaining these contacts that he had supposedly inside the government." "At one point Bill Moore had played me an early tape recording of a conversation he had with Doty, and Moore was telling me, you know, this is a huge breakthrough, and this guy is like on the inside and" "he's gonna give a lot of stuff away." "I just remember even back then that I was kind of suspicious that it sounded a little too good to be true, but I was kind of curious as to why somebody who supposedly was in." "Air Force intelligence was speaking so openly about some of these incredible things." "William Moore was using his position as an executive of an outfit that was called the Aerial Phenomena Research." "Organisation and in fact Moore admitted that he paid off the secretary of that organisation to send him reports at once when they came in and they went directly to Doty." "Bill didn't believe everything I was telling him and obviously he's a very smart person and a lot of the information I was telling him wasn't factual." "If you were a UFO researcher and you were offered documents that nobody had ever seen, that pointed the way to what the government might know about UFO's and in exchange you basically had to report on what people were" "thinking, what rumours were making the rounds, that's what he was offered and in exchange he was offered something that nobody else had gotten up to that point pure unadulterated information that would lead him to the centre of the answer," "the answer to the question you know, what does the government know and are there actually some sort of non-human intelligences interacting with the human race." "Moore later was part of the series of break-ins into the Bennewitz house, and the psychological warfare program." "Again, self-admitted by Moore." "Moore was not working alone." "Others, I'm convinced went for the same deal, and the deal was very simple." "You co-operate with us, and, we will give you the information that the U.S government has deep down in those vaults." "Now, this is the Faustian bargain that." "William Moore went for and he came up short on it." "It became apparent to me that my supplying information to the government through Doty on the activities of Paul Bennewitz, APRO, and to a lesser extent, several other individuals was to be a part of this equation." "I also discovered that whatever it was that." "Bennewitz was involved with, he was the subject of considerable interest on the part of not one but several government agencies, and that they were actively trying to defuse him by pumping as much dis-information through him as he could possibly absorb." "Being a very small part of that process gave me" "I thought something of an advantage." "It became my intention to play that advantage for all the information I could get out of it." "Bennewitz for his part..." "Frankly I'm a little ashamed of some people in this audience, regardless of what you believe what you hear or not." "They had to stop the talk about 4 or 5 times just because of all the yelling." "People got mad ran out of there, I saw a woman start crying and leave, people kept saying 'where'd you get all that crap from Bill' and one guy said 'I'm gonna get a firehose' and ran out the back." "Very dramatic." "Bill's admission to working with government agents was the first acknowledgement to the degree which our government would go in an attempt to keep the cover-up going, and" "I think people were angry, maybe not so much at Bill, but at themselves for their own naiveté as allowing that to happen, and refusing to acknowledge that they could have been just as easily duped, it's scary to think, gee somebody I trusted" "might be playing me for the fool." "Bill Moore I think probably believed what he was preaching." "I think he was one of these people that wanted to believe that he was one of the chosen few to spread this information, to be the Moses of mythology, UFO mythology." "Moore's book was well received and in my opinion, well done research, but very troubling because the thesis was that." "Roswell was a real spaceship that crashed and that the U.S government has the parts." "I believe that he was singled out precisely to ultimately discredit him and Roswell, to keep the press and the politicians off of Roswell." "July 8th 1947." "The army airforce has announced that a flying disk has been found and is now in the possession of the army." "Army officers say the missile found sometime last week has been inspected at Roswell," "New Mexico and sent to Wright Field, Ohio for further inspection." "The key thing to remember about the alleged crash of a UFO at Roswell in 1947 is that by the time of Paul Bennewitz's involvement in the UFO field it had been entirely forgotten by the UFO community, and it was" "only with the publication in 1980 of the." "Roswell Incident by William Moore and Charles Berlitz that the elements of the Roswell story, the crashed spacecraft, the recovered alien bodies, the pact between the American government and the extra-terrestrials to back engineer their technology." "All of these things have eventually become the core story of the." "American UFO mythology." "Their craft crashed somewhere after coming all these 50 light years, they crashed and then they sent another one that crashed again, and sent another one that crashed." "About nine crashes in the South West in the late 40's and that would indicate to me or at least suggest to me that we were testing something that was crashing." "Roswell happened." "Two crashes, one in Roswell and one west." "They didn't find the craft for a couple of years, it was all one crash but it took them a couple of years to find the second crash site." "Things are getting weird man." "Now Doty played a massive role in the perpetuation of the Roswell myth, many of the ideas prominent in the UFO subculture for two decades and it was completely avoided." "Rick Doty is certainly a fascinating character and clearly a trickster." "A man who probably has trouble figuring out whether he's lying or not these days." "It would not surprise me if people were selected to sow disinformation." "It would also not surprise me if some of the people were selected because they were not very bright, they lacked certain critical judgment but were very energetic in putting out certain messages, and I do often think that" "some of the people in the government agencies who have been involved in the." "UFO field were kind of pushed or nudged in that direction." "They'd just go into the field and muck it up automatically by themselves without any external controls." "Rick is not the man you're after, it's the person in the control position that's important here." "In my opinion he was just simply a pawn in a much larger game." "Just as I was." "What we are hearing today about malevolent aliens, underground bases, secret treaties with the US government, has its roots firmly planted in the Bennewitz affair." "The entire story of a secret treaty between the US government and the aliens, of exchanges of technology between us and the aliens, of battles between the aliens and American armed forces, and of aliens having implanted hundreds of thousands," "if not millions, of human beings for the purpose of taking over the world, and using us as cattle, or slaves, came about as a result of the disinformation process." "I know, because I was in a position to observe much of this process as it unfolded, and" "I was providing regular reports on its effectiveness to some of the very people who were doing it to Paul." "It wasn't a whole lot that we did." "It was just a simple, really, really, simple, nod and statement to Paul that what he was seeing was probably UFOs." "It's generally assumed that the counter intelligence operation conducted against." "Paul Bennewitz was designed to throw him off the scent of some kind of classified experimental technology that he was accidentally filming over Kirtland AFB but when you stop to think about it this doesn't make a whole lot of sense." "If the Kirtland base personnel really had wanted him to stop his investigations they could have ordered him to do so instead they encouraged him to continue his research and indeed facilitated his growing delusions about an extra-terrestrial invasion." "What this suggests is that rather than a campaign directed against Paul Bennewitz this was an information war on the." "American UFO community." "And there are a number of reasons why." "Air Force Intelligence might have wanted to use." "Bennewitz as a conduit for disinformation." "The ufologists were constantly seeking evidencefor the extra-terrestrial conspiracy and theUFO cover-up." "They were digging through documents, they were hanging around secret air bases and quite likely stumbling upon genuine military secrets." "And a more serious possibility is that." "Soviet agents may have been infiltrating the." "UFO field in order to extract this kind of information about new technologies." "I think it's no coincidence that the timing of the operation against Paul Bennewitz dovetales with the development of the." "Stealth programme, and at the time this was the absolute pinnacle of global aviation technology and that's exactly the sort of thing that Soviet agents would be looking for." "If you guys are doing a film..." "I..." "I do not want to do an interview in a film in which you're going to try to communicate that there's nothing to UFOs than advance technologies being used to cover..." "I mean..." "No No." "Then all you're doing is playing into the government's hands... that's absolutely what they want people to do..." "No..." "That's absolutely not what we're doing." "People trying to put out documentaries about UFOs seemed to be teased over and over and have the rug pulled out from under them at the last minute." "In the late '70s a rumour started circulating that there was a film of a UFO landing at." "Holloman Air Force Base, in New Mexico." "And apparently a UFO came and landed at the air force base, on the tarmac, a group of people went up to meet him, there was a sort of exchange of information the alien got back in his ship and took off." "I have wondered, whether that film" " I think as many people have wondered - that film was an abortive attempt at some kind of disclosure." "We began with an invitation and met with." "Paul Shardle, who was head of security for the." "Depository, where all the films by the military are sent, out at Norton." "We talked about possible programmes such as three-dimensional moving holography, atomic fission, a dog programme where they trained Shepherds to do reconnaissance, and a lot of laser work at Wright Patterson." "Then he said: "I want you to come with me"" "into this studio."" "We went into a studio, which was a clean room." "He said: "What would you think if we told you"" "that in the early '70s there was a landing of an alien craft at Holloman Air Force Base, and our TDY, temporary duty guys, had" ""filmed it?" And I was just sort of scratching my head thinking, UFOS?" "!" "What are we talking about?" "So he said: "Look, if you're interested", bury that under the other projects, as UFO" ""sends up a red flag." He said." ""If you're interested, go talk to Captain"" "somebody, and he'll start a liaison with" ""the Pentagon." Which we did." "I was told that there was footage and that was sort of like a carrot." "Where you'll be provided with a film that we have, 900 feet of Ektachrome, and off we began our project." "We had a legal contract with the Pentagon and an agreement on everything that we were gonna be doing and their total co-operation." "They fulfilled every one of our requests, they vetted our information, gave sanction to it, they really did not influence the content at all," "I was quite surprised." "Even the people at Holloman did not say" ""what are you doing?" "What are you talking about?"" "They seemed to confirm that something had happened." "And the film was not forthcoming but I knew where it was and what it was and was told by one of the people we worked with that it was confiscated at the last minute because it didn't seem appropriate." "So we ended up having to go to animation." "But everything else was documented as I recall it happening." "It was a daylight shot of a light ascending on Holloman Air Force Base." "And with that little clip, that's all that I tell you it's genuine." "A landing of a craft at Holloman... it was... film... very brief... that's all... you know..." "I can tell you it's genuine..." "Just that snippet that you saw?" "Just a light... coming down from above... it was really not that distinguishable it was just among other footage, that's all I can tell you..." "And just to say on camera that you never saw the Holloman Landing footage?" "Not really..." "Oh..." "OK!" "Can you elaborate?" "Can we just wait for that car?" "Saved by the car!" "I'm trying to think how to answer that." "I knew what the film was about, all the details." "But I never saw a real projected version." "You saw a still of it?" "Yes." "What is your bottom line?" "Beginning, middle and end?" "Our bottom line is that there is a UFO phenomenon that's genuine and needs to be studied, and seriously and one of the things that makes that difficult is the muddying of the waters by people like Rick Doty, Walter Bosley and" "others who are working for who ever else they're working for," "CIA, NSA, and they are making the work of people like yourself, and us, and others who want to understand what's really going on very, very difficult." "If you believe that it's true then you have to buy in to this phantasmagorical, conspiratorial, bizarre, nonsensical, ridiculous story, and when I've sat down with Rick, his response to me is, you know, it's really all true." "Rick's great strength is that he's a wonderful storyteller." "He's a very friendly guy, he builds relationships easily." "My immediate instinct is to trust him." "I think it's very easy to mislead people in the UFO community." "You get them going down a certain trail.." "You give them certain leads and you just watch people chase their tails over and over again, looking for the truth." "I was living and working in New York when." "Linda Howe actually came to stay with me for a few days and it was right in the midst of her working on this HBO project." "Linda was sort of, I believe, on the track at the time, of thinking that this was the film that was gonna again expose everything, and I believe she was in touch with Doty at the time, in fact I think she had even gone" "to see him face to face." "And that was very curious to me because" "I'd known about this guy through Bill, you know," "Bill Moore, and I thought, hmm, now he's sort of hooking Linda in the same way." "Doty said that he has names of people who are witnesses." "A security guard has a gun melted in his hand, there's a disc, beings." "I want to investigate that story." "The original plan with Linda Howe was to obtain as much information as she knew, and to find out what she was going to air in this documentary for HBO and whether we wanted it aired or not." "So I drove her out to Kirtland, to the OSI office." "I took her into a special room," "I told her it was the Commander's office, which wasn't really, necessarily true..." "The first thing that shifted this from what I thought was going to be a five minute meeting get these names, phone numbers and addresses and go on " "I had already set up other things to do..." ""That documentary that you did broadsided the government."" ""How do you mean?"" ""Nobody ever expected that a credible journalist would ever take on the animal mutilation story."" "It was like something was shifting in the air..." "Where is this going?" "What is happening here?" "He never gave me a list of names or phone numbers." "Instead, he said." ""My superiors have asked me to show you something."" "Pulled out this manila envelope, pulled out these pages and as he's handing them to me, he says." ""You can read these but you cannot take notes."" "You can ask me questions but I want you to move from that chair you are sitting in to that chair..." "Everything that was done there was being filmed by other agents in another room and there was a two way mirror." "And I'm looking at the top page, and it's all caps." "Briefing Paper for the President of the United States of America on Unidentified Aerial Vehicles." "And I'm trying to read what is the most remarkable series of letters and words that has probably ever been handed to me because this was new, I was innocent." "And it started out about all of these places in the United States that the government had retrieved discs that were identified as extra-terrestrial." "I knew some names, like Roswell." "There was Aztec, Magdelena, South of Laredo, down in Arizona." "There were... my mind was kind of reeling at how many places this is saying, because all of us had only heard of Roswell, really." "And eventually it came to paragraphs that are as indelibly emblazed on my mind sitting here today as they were then." "And the one that is probably worth sharing from all of this." ""These extra-terrestrials manipulated DNA"" "in already evolved primates to create" ""homo sapiens."" "And I remember reading that sentence over several times, trying to absorb the implication of its meaning." "Because if homo sapiens is a genetically constructed species by extra-terrestrials, we are then, by definition, a planet of six and a half billion androids." "If we are androids, what purpose are we serving?" "All of that hit me, reading that sentence." "Then, on the last page paragraph, paragraph, paragraph, paragraph." "PROJECT GARNET, all caps." "All questions and mysteries about the evolution of homo sapiens on this planet have been answered and this project is closed." "The documents that I showed her came from our special office in Washington, with the operational plan and what I was supposed to do." "And the plans to show her these." "And I'd read them, and I knew what was in them and I realised that some of the information contained in them was real." "But then I realised that you have to give some real information in order for a person to think you're credible." "So I knew what was in there and I gave them to her and it was sanctioned." "I did what I was told to do." "When you look back at it they must have had meetings about." ""How do we stop"" "a persistent and dogged reporter who has already demonstrated that she's going to go after a really, really difficult subject." ""How do we stop her?"" "When you look back it all makes sense." "She wanted me to tell her things that I couldn't tell her and at one point she went public with my name and she did what Paul Bennewitz and Bill Moore didn't do and she publicised the fact that she was deceived" "by a government agency, namely OSI and although there were many other people involved with that operation she named my name and so I became a public figure." "We actually played a trick on Linda that, er, kind of paid her back so to speak." "Not anything that harmed her in any way or anything like that." "We kind of planted something that she ran with which wasn't factual and I think she realised that maybe she should keep her mouth shut after that." "The forged documents shown to Linda Moulton Howe by Richard Doty would form the basis of the." "Majestic 12 papers which expanded upon the story of the." "Roswell UFO crash and provided the foundations for the future mythology in America." "And over three decades later these documents are still dividing the international UFO community." "Before it had always been inferred that a cover-up was underway." "There was talk about who was involved and so forth, but there was never any paperwork." "Here's the paperwork." "A package showed up at the home of." "Jamie Shandera, who was Bill's sort of writing and research partner." "What it contained was a canister of 35mm film they developed it, and what was on it was photographs of this document, saying that there was a group that had been controlling UFO information, how it was released in public" "and how the government should deal with it." "Regarding the MJ-12 documents that were released to Jamie Shandera and Bill Moore," "I had absolutely nothing to do with that." "The document could be real, and because of the nature of it, it made a perfect perception management device." "People have to realise that these things may not be to cover up the truth about flying saucers it may be more to gather information about how the public responds to manipulation." "When I print off the sum total of all those documents - you get a stack about this thick when you read them through as one day I decided this is what" "I am going to do, it's very impressive." "To have faked it would have required a team, a high level team, of very very expert individuals who know everything about document creation, science and technology in the 1940s and '50s and a whole bunch of other things." "I looked at them, and initially I thought they were good forgeries, but over time my opinion of their quality has gone down hill." "The use of a zero in front of a date, the use of an extraneous comma the obviously photocopied signature they just keep getting worse and worse." "If they were faked, the only thing that one can say is, the UFO topic was considered important enough by these people to create the most elaborate, incredible, detailed series of papers, and one would have to ask" "if they're faked." "Why?" "There were some investigations conducted by FBI, OSI, regarding the MJ12 documents, extensive investigations, just to determine whether these things were legitimate whether they contained classified information and then who released them." "I was interviewed as a suspect did I do these?" "It was proven that I didn't do 'em." "But somebody outside the government created it and in that particular instance" "I don't know if the government would prosecute them." "Doing that would lend credence to the document and then they would have to disclose the information and so the best thing to do is just say... we did an investigation and not tell anyone what the outcome was." "I like to think of UFOs as weapons of mass deception, and the role of the intelligence organisations and the military, in propagating UFO mythology, as somewhat analogous to what evolutionary biologists call a punctuated equilibrium." "The UFO mythology develops of its own accord and the Mirage Men will just drop a new piece of data, a new meme, some new faked documents into the mix as and when it is expedient for them to do so." "And so there's no real need for a sustained." "UFO deception campaign because the folklore is just perfectly capable of sustaining itself." "The US government had a once secret programme in which 12 astronauts were sent to an alien home world, Serpo thirty eight point four light years away from the years 1965 to 1978." "When the returning astronauts came back" "I believe there were seven, that report was finalised into a report called." "Project Serpo in 1980." "Rumours about this kind of thing had been flying around since the 1960s or '70s, so it's got some kind of historical provenance." "In November of 2005." "Project Serpo was sent to my UFO thread list" "I received an email from someone he requested to be anonymous." "When I first read that bombshell email it was far different from anything" "I'd ever received and even though it was a version that was different from what I was familiar with it had the ring of truth." "Someone within the government would have to be co-operating because I can tell you that a lot of information not all of the particular details, but a lot of the information is factual" "I believe it is a disinformation campaign to lead people astray." "That said, a good disinformation campaign a good perception management campaign always includes nuggets of fact and truth and some of those nuggets of facts and truth should be, if you're going to do it effectively, should be some of the more" "extreme facts or truths." "They brought back thousands of soil samples samples from the Eben civilisation, and I believe all these artefacts are now ensconced at Bolling Air Force Base." "And photographs too." "There's always a possibility that the Serpo story was created for disinformation to present to the Soviets back during the Cold War and somebody stumbled on to it." "There's always that possibility, but I don't think so." "It's not a professional job." "Myself and three others were working as a research team looking into the Serpo story." "We really wanted to get to the bottom of Rick's involvement in it." "People within the UFO community immediately said." "'Hey, is Richard Doty involved in this?" "Did Richard Doty do this?" "'" "I never had anything to do with the Serpo story." "We were adamant at this time that Rick Doty was the person sending the information." "But we didn't have any proof and the only way we could get that proof was if we could see an actual copy of the original emails that the anonymous source had been sending Victor." "Unless Rick Doty is one the greatest novelists and writers of the 21st century, it's not him." "We came up with a plan." "We'll use the same name and just contact." "Victor and let him think his anonymous source was back in touch with him." "We asked Victor to send us copies of the emails that we, allegedly, had sent him which meant we could look at the headers of these emails to determine where they actually came from." "And it was from looking at those headers and having emails from Rick Doty to compare against, that it was indeed Rick Doty's." "IP address on the Request Anonymous emails, and, as it turned out later, he was also several other people in the story." "All contacting Victor and Victor thinking he's been contacted by a multitude of different people when in fact it was all one person it was all Rick Doty." "I didn't create it, I didn't, err, conspire with anyone else to create it." "It was created by somebody else and, those people, I don't know." "How do we ever know what we know?" "Apart from Victor Martinez who really started this thing off" "I'm the only name who's known." "We've got this anonymous storyteller round this giant camp fire who's entertaining us with this incredible tale, and we're sitting here with bright eyes with the flickering flames thinking 'wow, tell us some more'." "The idea of disinformation is that it's meant to be believed." "With Serpo, the first response is 'well this is fascinating, but it's ridiculous.'" "Of course there's an aspect of me that wants to believe this wonderful story." "I had no idea where this would be leading..." "Well when I first met Bill Ryan at the Loughlin conference in 2006 he presented himself as someone being given information to reveal to the public he didn't quite know why but thought it was very important." "What's strange about the Serpo thing and." "Richard Doty was that he denied, you know, continually and vociferously that he had anything to do with it, yet he came to the." "Loughlin UFO convention to see what was going on there, to hear Bill Ryan talk and announce this to the world in person rather than just on the radio and basically had his hands in a lot of things that were going on" "or at least looked like an interested bystander." "Why should he be interested in this silly story?" "Wonderful question." "We don't know whether Anonymous got this from the movie or whether." "Spielberg had the tip-off that this was one of the ways, as many people in this community suspect, over the years, the public have been gradually acclimatized to the possibility of this contact with an extra-terrestrial race by seeding little parts of the truth here" "and there in movies is the best way to get ideas through to the general population." "This might have been one of the ways of doing it." "I think the information should be brought out to the public." "Let the public decide whether this is real or not." "Whether you think the information is real or not, or whatever the proportion of that might be the case this is a government operation." "If it's a government operation these guys wouldn't be doing their job if they weren't following me every step of the way." "Ever since the middle of November" "I've been assuming that I'm being monitored." "If they're not doing that they're not doing their job." "And it's like I'm one part of a team but" "I don't even know who the other team members are." "And I have to assume that" "I'm being bugged." "I mean, this may be paranoid but whatever's going on, it's happening at a government level, and therefore everything" "I do is being watched." "I have to assume I'm being tested." "You know the whole Bill Moore stuff?" "Yeah, yeah." "No absolutely." "I wasn't around then but if they were hanging around... where I did... to see whether he would make a good spook... just to see whether he was willing to obey orders..." "I have to assume that's there's something more at stake." "You see, what I..." "You also need to have a really good bullshit detector." "Yes I know." "Since 1985 I've talked to 18 people at the cabinet level or above including 4 presidents." "About a third of them have said 'It's true', about a third have said 'I heard it, and I think it's true' and about a third of them have said." "'I don't have a clue." "I do think though, Doctor Green, that this important for you to investigate.'" "Turn it off for a minute." "The trouble with the whole UFO thing is there are so many people who make up." "BS stories that no one can check." "Somebody can step forward and say." "'I'll tell you what's going on in UFOs', and they can say 'I've briefed the President'," "'I've done this, I know what's going on'." "I don't know..." "I think there's too much BS in that field." "Part of the problem that UFOs created was that there were people within government within the air force, within the CIA, who really believed that flying saucers existed." "And because they had stature because they had rank their opinion was considered proof." "Unless we understand and work effectively for the principles on which our American way of life is founded the structure will crumble." "Well, before going to Norton Air Force Base, going into a clean room and being told we had a landing by someone who seemed to be respectable, his name was all over the wall as head of security, and his boss and everything" "agreeing..." "I didn't believe it then, but then when confronted with the information" "I now realise after working with intelligence people that it's a reality." "And they stand behind the idea that they don't disbelieve it's just so far it's not proven to be a threat to our national security and that's the way they got out from under it." "In the intelligence community there are definitely people who are interested in extraordinary phenomena, particularly UFOs definitely believers in there, because you don't work in that profession and it's not just a profession it's a world unto itself" "without learning some things." "How many pictures do you need how many eye witnesses, how do you study something that controls, possibly, even this programme?" "What is known of the truth of them these other beings?" "What if the truth is bad?" "Could be." "What if we're their farm animals?" "What if they eat us psychically?" "Yeah, I don't know." "There's a lot of possibilities there that are not good." "I think we are surfing on the wave of a huge adventure of the opportunity of humankind rolling into a totally new era and that wave might break one of these days." "Even the Vatican recently has come out in preparation saying 'Hey, listen, you know if there is anybody out there, they're all." "God's creations and they're our brothers and sisters really.' I mean, what a set-up that is for what might be coming next." "We're really a by-product of extra-terrestrial intervention." "We're really" " I mean, this is my view that we're... we've been genetically altered by, maybe not one, maybe perhaps several extra-terrestrial races." "The government obviously doesn't want to tell us, otherwise they'd disclose everything they knew." "And the most important players, the aliens, don't want disclosure because they could disclose any time." "I mean, they control most of the cards." "I don't have any files, any photographs, anything to show you, I just have a lot of personal research, I have my professional experiences and I have the bona fides, the tested bona fides of the sources" "and I have my intuition." "And those things all fit together and you kind of get a picture." "There is a planet, that orbits Sirius the Dog Star system, they are human they are very much interested in us and they have been key to our survival and they are capable of coming here certainly others have come here." "Um, now... could that be part of disinformation?" "Absolutely." "I read things even today that we fed to." "Paul Bennewitz or to Linda Howe or to." "Bill Moore that I fed to them." "And I see that today and it's surprising that that stuff's still there but it just shows we were a professional organisation and we did our job and that information is still out there." "People whose job it was to make the subject look ridiculous over the last 50 or 60 years have done a very good job." "I don't know where they're from, I don't know." "I don't know where they're from." "I know that they're not, like, from Detroit, you know." "That's as far as I can take it." "So again, when somebody starts saying 'well here's who they are', 'here's why they're here', they lose me almost immediately." "I was selected to participate in a special access programme within the counter intelligence community." "My supervisor selected me and said 'you're going to be briefed into a programme and you're going to be responsible for investigating everything associated with this programme'." "The first part of the briefing dealt with how the United States Air Force were countering unauthorised disclosure of technology to the public by using the UFO phenomena as a cover." "And then the second part of the briefing was where we were actually shown and briefed about the United States government involvement with extra-terrestrials since the late 1940s, which was obviously the most interesting part of the briefing." "Well they showed us a lot of things." "They showed us a film which was late 40s or early 50s film of a recovery operation which they talked about as being in Roswell." "They showed crash debris, they showed extra-terrestrial bodies and then there was also a briefing showing a live alien sitting in a room talking to people." "And then the narrator of this film talked about the continuation of a connection between the." "United States government and extra-terrestrial civilizations." "After viewing this I was not sure if it was real, if it was... they presented it to us for some reason, maybe some kind of psychological conditioning, I don't think" "I initially believed any of it." "But after the film was over with and the." "Air Force Colonel in uniform then started talking about the operation, the programme how the United States government, and it was always the United States government, it wasn't." "Air Force or Army it was the United States government, how they progressed from the early days, meaning the crash retrieval operations in the late 40s until now which was the late 70s." "And then the more he spoke, the more I realised that what I saw was real." "I mean this guy wouldn't be sitting here standing here talking to us with the people in the room briefing into this high-level programme if it was a hoax." "A fractured hall of mirrors with a quicksand floor that nobody knows exactly what the truths are and everybody has found themselves completely suspicious of the motives of any human being because counter-intelligence in England and the United States and a lot of" "other countries have worked overtime to misinform and to tell the public and the media there is nothing to the UFO phenomenon." "It's a lie" " I have no question about it - and my work is to try to shed some light on what could be so threatening out of some other intelligence from some other part of the universe or it's been here for two billion years" "and it's not extra-terrestrial but we're the new ones on the block." "What is it that is considered so threatening that governments will kill people to keep it silent?" "They can't come forth and say 'yeah, OK, we had contact in 1947, all this is real'." "What would that do?" "That would open up the Pandora's Box, because there would be millions and millions and millions of people asking questions that somebody has to answer." "The easiest thing for the government to do is just to say 'no comment' or 'no, it I didn't happen'." "But there are so many people, so many people within the government that have come forth with information saying 'it did happen', 'it's real', and the reason I'm doing it is because I asked the government" "a long time ago 'hey what am I supposed to say?" "'" "And they're going to say 'you stick to the fact it's not real'." "But when the government tried to discredit me on something then I went to them and said." "'Listen, you're telling everybody it's not real and I know it's real, and you know it's real and all these other people know it's real so I'm going to tell the public what I know about it'." "And the government basically said 'do what you gotta do'." "Let's take one step at a time." "You're looking at Richard Doty, and by looking at him, you're taking a glimpse into a whole machine that now has a life of its own." "Well, I was a young man and I'd heard about UFOs, but you know I didn't believe it was even possible to a have a UFO but then I went... to an Air Force Base," "an Air Force Base they took me aside and said," "'You know what?" "Guess what?" "We have an alien among us'." "And I said, 'You got to be kidding.'" "And they said 'Would we kid anybody?" "No!" "'" "Up on the Air Force Base, up on the Air Force." "Base, and now I stand before you saying that I am a true believer in UFOs." "Believer in UFOs!" "UFOs are real indeed!" "That is so dumb!" "I don't even make any sense."